#330 - Jim Brammer - Building a legacy in live events

1
00:00:00,040 --> 00:00:01,720
I can't.
I came home from the Navy in

2
00:00:01,720 --> 00:00:07,640
1974 and I had electronics
degree compliments of the Navy.

3
00:00:07,640 --> 00:00:10,760
And you know, I thought, what am
I going to do here?

4
00:00:10,760 --> 00:00:13,360
So I went to work for RJ
Reynolds Tobacco Company.

5
00:00:13,760 --> 00:00:16,239
I was single.
I wasn't the corporate type of

6
00:00:16,239 --> 00:00:18,880
guy.
And we were at this discotheque

7
00:00:18,880 --> 00:00:21,240
one night I turned a couple of
my buddies and I said, you know,

8
00:00:21,240 --> 00:00:24,040
we could build one of these.
And they said you've lost your

9
00:00:24,040 --> 00:00:26,080
mind.
And I said watch me.

10
00:00:26,600 --> 00:00:31,320
So yeah.
So September 17th of 1976, I

11
00:00:31,320 --> 00:00:35,080
opened the doors of my first
music club, if you will.

12
00:00:35,560 --> 00:00:39,080
It was a discotheque.
I soon realized I didn't like

13
00:00:39,080 --> 00:00:43,400
the DJ on the stage mixing the
record, so I wanted to see bands

14
00:00:43,400 --> 00:00:46,400
up there.
And I started booking Motown,

15
00:00:46,440 --> 00:00:50,360
you know, 4 Tops, Temptations,
The Platters and and then that

16
00:00:50,360 --> 00:01:28,160
got into regional rock bands.
We're excited to welcome back

17
00:01:28,400 --> 00:01:32,480
Jim Brammer, CEO of Special
Events Services and founder of

18
00:01:32,480 --> 00:01:24,760
Concert Stuff Group. thanks for
joining me again today on Geez

19
00:01:24,760 --> 00:01:36,120
of Gear, today's podcast.
The From a tobacco farm in North

20
00:01:36,120 --> 00:01:40,240
Carolina to stages and stadiums
around the world, Jim has spent

21
00:01:40,240 --> 00:01:42,920
nearly 40 years shaping the live
event industry.

22
00:01:43,360 --> 00:01:45,640
He's worked with artists like
Hootie and the Blowfish,

23
00:01:45,960 --> 00:01:50,960
Coldplay and Three Doors Down,
and also pioneered arena quality

24
00:01:50,960 --> 00:01:54,560
production for ministries
including Doctor Billy Graham,

25
00:01:55,040 --> 00:02:00,400
Joyce Meyer and Joel Osteen,
founder of a network of

26
00:02:00,400 --> 00:02:03,120
companies that simplify large
scale events.

27
00:02:03,120 --> 00:02:07,240
Jim's leadership and People
First philosophy earned him the

28
00:02:07,240 --> 00:02:09,960
2024 Parnelli Lifetime
Achievement Award.

29
00:02:10,680 --> 00:02:14,120
He's still building now,
bringing world class

30
00:02:14,120 --> 00:02:18,080
entertainment back home with a
5000 capacity amphitheater in

31
00:02:18,080 --> 00:02:22,080
downtown Winston Salem.
From farm fields to global

32
00:02:22,080 --> 00:02:26,760
stages, Jim Brammer's story is
pure vision, grit, and heart.

33
00:02:27,200 --> 00:02:30,600
Please welcome Jim Brammer to
the Geese of Gear podcast.

34
00:02:32,000 --> 00:02:33,280
I'm doing good.
How are you?

35
00:02:33,600 --> 00:02:36,200
I'm doing excellent.
We got to quit meeting like this

36
00:02:36,200 --> 00:02:41,080
on on podcasts I'm.
I'm sure we got to get back to

37
00:02:41,080 --> 00:02:43,360
the physical connectivity at
some point, don't we?

38
00:02:43,400 --> 00:02:47,640
You know, I mean, I do enough of
that, but well, I shouldn't say

39
00:02:47,640 --> 00:02:49,600
enough.
I do still a bunch of it, but

40
00:02:49,600 --> 00:02:53,120
not enough probably because I,
you know, one of the reasons we

41
00:02:53,120 --> 00:02:55,640
all got into this industry is
because we like people and we

42
00:02:55,640 --> 00:02:58,640
like being around people and we
like connecting and, and

43
00:02:58,640 --> 00:03:00,720
networking and all of those
different things.

44
00:03:01,120 --> 00:03:03,720
And then of course, you know,
COVID changed everything.

45
00:03:03,720 --> 00:03:05,880
But for me, it was even before
that.

46
00:03:05,880 --> 00:03:12,400
Like for me, my company went
completely remote in about 2015.

47
00:03:13,000 --> 00:03:17,080
And like, I have people who work
for me, who've been working for

48
00:03:17,080 --> 00:03:20,800
me for 10 years, who I've never
met, which is crazy.

49
00:03:20,800 --> 00:03:23,560
It's, it's lunacy.
You know, actually, Sarah, who

50
00:03:23,560 --> 00:03:26,440
you just met, our producer,
she's been with me for six

51
00:03:26,440 --> 00:03:29,160
years.
And we just met last year at

52
00:03:29,160 --> 00:03:30,600
LDI.
Oh wow.

53
00:03:31,080 --> 00:03:34,480
So flew her in for LDI.
She's coming again this year

54
00:03:34,480 --> 00:03:37,160
because we're doing a couple of
different events with LDI.

55
00:03:37,160 --> 00:03:41,320
We're doing this X live thing.
And last year we started

56
00:03:41,320 --> 00:03:44,200
something called dining with
Dinosaurs, which kind of takes

57
00:03:44,720 --> 00:03:48,880
the podcast to more of a a real
in person thing.

58
00:03:49,360 --> 00:03:53,160
And so the list is unbelievable.
Like if you saw the list for

59
00:03:53,160 --> 00:03:56,760
Dining with Dinosaurs, you'd
like wow, like some of the top

60
00:03:56,760 --> 00:04:05,480
LDS, top TV guys top.
We've got Branham, we've got Roy

61
00:04:05,480 --> 00:04:09,280
Bickel.
Speaking of rigors, just an

62
00:04:09,280 --> 00:04:13,360
incredible, incredible lineup of
like 20 people that we're

63
00:04:13,360 --> 00:04:16,240
calling dinosaurs because that's
the name of the event.

64
00:04:16,720 --> 00:04:20,880
And and then, you know, the
young people and, and anyone

65
00:04:20,880 --> 00:04:23,240
really can buy tickets and come
to this thing.

66
00:04:23,240 --> 00:04:26,200
And it's an LDI thing.
And it's actually, I think it's

67
00:04:26,200 --> 00:04:30,000
the only individual ticket this
year, the only thing that you

68
00:04:30,000 --> 00:04:32,840
can buy a ticket for separate
from the show and all of that

69
00:04:32,840 --> 00:04:35,200
stuff.
So yeah, it's going to be

70
00:04:35,200 --> 00:04:37,440
really, really great.
It's going to be a lot of fun.

71
00:04:37,440 --> 00:04:42,040
But but yeah, so I'm, I've been
looking forward to this one

72
00:04:42,040 --> 00:04:45,160
because, you know, I don't even
actually usually when you've

73
00:04:45,160 --> 00:04:48,000
been on before, I go back to the
previous episode and listen just

74
00:04:48,000 --> 00:04:51,040
to get a good idea.
But I don't even remember how

75
00:04:51,040 --> 00:04:54,320
much stuff we went into about
your past.

76
00:04:54,600 --> 00:04:58,800
But you have one of the most
incredible stories coming into

77
00:04:58,800 --> 00:05:02,480
our business because first of
all, you grew up on a tobacco

78
00:05:02,480 --> 00:05:08,600
farm in in North Carolina.
But you know, I believe you went

79
00:05:08,600 --> 00:05:12,760
from there to like you joined
the Navy and sort of an

80
00:05:12,760 --> 00:05:18,640
electronics thing and that
somehow LED into a 40 plus year

81
00:05:18,640 --> 00:05:23,160
career in the entertainment, you
know, sound, lighting, staging,

82
00:05:23,160 --> 00:05:27,040
video business.
You know, it's a great country.

83
00:05:27,040 --> 00:05:30,880
The opportunities are boundless.
You know, it is true.

84
00:05:30,880 --> 00:05:32,360
Yeah, it's it's true.
I can't.

85
00:05:32,360 --> 00:05:37,200
I came home from the Navy in
1974 and I had electronics

86
00:05:37,200 --> 00:05:42,040
degree compliments of the Navy
and you know, I thought what am

87
00:05:42,040 --> 00:05:43,960
I going to do here?
So I went to work for RJ

88
00:05:43,960 --> 00:05:46,200
Reynolds Tobacco Company.
I was.

89
00:05:46,200 --> 00:05:48,040
In North Carolina back then,
yeah.

90
00:05:48,200 --> 00:05:50,360
Exactly.
You know, and and I mean, there

91
00:05:50,360 --> 00:05:53,360
were there were two times in my
life I made my mother cry.

92
00:05:53,360 --> 00:05:57,080
She cried for joy the day I went
to work for RJR and the day I

93
00:05:57,080 --> 00:05:59,600
left, she she cried, you know,
for sorrow.

94
00:05:59,600 --> 00:06:02,720
But yeah, you know, because that
was every mother's dream.

95
00:06:02,720 --> 00:06:05,040
You know, your kid goes to work
for RJR.

96
00:06:05,040 --> 00:06:10,160
But I was young, single out
nightclubbing a lot and just,

97
00:06:10,960 --> 00:06:13,280
you know, I wasn't the corporate
type of guy.

98
00:06:13,280 --> 00:06:16,680
And we were at this discotheque
one night, I turned a couple of

99
00:06:16,680 --> 00:06:19,000
my buddies and I said, you know,
we could build one of these.

100
00:06:19,400 --> 00:06:21,120
And they said, you've lost your
mind.

101
00:06:21,400 --> 00:06:24,320
And I said, watch me.
So yeah.

102
00:06:24,320 --> 00:06:29,600
So September 17th of 1976 I
opened the doors of my first

103
00:06:30,120 --> 00:06:32,840
music club if you will.
What was it called?

104
00:06:32,920 --> 00:06:36,680
Discotheque and.
What was it called, Jim?

105
00:06:36,880 --> 00:06:39,440
It was called EJ's.
Why?

106
00:06:39,680 --> 00:06:45,400
And that was because I had two
partners, Elmer, Jim and Steve,

107
00:06:45,560 --> 00:06:47,800
and we just, you know.
Ejs there you.

108
00:06:47,800 --> 00:06:51,400
Go and, and back then I wasn't
very creative when it came to

109
00:06:51,400 --> 00:06:54,400
the marketing aspect of it, you
know, or I would have picked

110
00:06:54,400 --> 00:06:57,800
some neat name like, you know,
Mother Fletcher's or, you know,

111
00:06:57,960 --> 00:07:02,440
players or some junk like that.
But you know, I soon realized I

112
00:07:02,440 --> 00:07:06,520
didn't like the DJ on the stage
mixing the record, so I wanted

113
00:07:06,520 --> 00:07:11,520
to see bands up there.
I started booking Motown 4 Tops,

114
00:07:11,520 --> 00:07:15,800
Temptations, The Platters and
then that got into regional rock

115
00:07:15,800 --> 00:07:19,360
bands and that was.
That was this club.

116
00:07:19,800 --> 00:07:25,040
The 750 seats.
And I also got a reputation

117
00:07:25,040 --> 00:07:28,360
throughout the Carolinas and
Virginia that I like to build

118
00:07:28,360 --> 00:07:32,080
stuff for other club owners.
And I would remodel other clubs.

119
00:07:32,080 --> 00:07:35,680
I would put in a lighted dance
floor or build them a stage or

120
00:07:35,680 --> 00:07:38,840
whatever.
And, you know, we we come around

121
00:07:38,840 --> 00:07:44,480
to 1980 and there was an old
movie theater South of Winston

122
00:07:44,480 --> 00:07:47,560
Salem that had been sitting idle
for a while.

123
00:07:48,040 --> 00:07:51,240
And it was back in the day when
movie theaters were crammed.

124
00:07:51,520 --> 00:07:56,360
And it was a 600 seater with
big, tall ceilings, 40 foot

125
00:07:56,360 --> 00:08:00,880
ceilings and a stage where every
Saturday morning they did kids

126
00:08:00,880 --> 00:08:03,640
shows.
And I went down to the owners

127
00:08:03,640 --> 00:08:06,240
and I said, you know, I want to
rent this place and turn it into

128
00:08:06,240 --> 00:08:10,880
a live music venue.
So in 1981 we opened up the Form

129
00:08:10,880 --> 00:08:15,680
Music Theater and I, I met a lot
of people then.

130
00:08:15,800 --> 00:08:22,400
Charlie Daniels, Pablo Cruz, the
The Pointer Sisters, Reba

131
00:08:22,400 --> 00:08:25,720
Mackintosh, I mean just everyone
I could book, I booked.

132
00:08:26,240 --> 00:08:29,480
And you were booking yourself?
Yes, you were booking the venue.

133
00:08:29,480 --> 00:08:31,320
Too.
Yes, yeah, I always, always

134
00:08:31,400 --> 00:08:34,080
booked it myself.
You booked the venue.

135
00:08:34,080 --> 00:08:36,039
Booked it.
I have some help in at.

136
00:08:36,039 --> 00:08:39,799
The end of the night.
Yeah, yeah, I have some help.

137
00:08:39,799 --> 00:08:42,840
There was a guy in Atlanta by
name of Ken Hewitt that had a

138
00:08:42,840 --> 00:08:46,760
strong out agency and you know,
he would get a lead on someone

139
00:08:46,760 --> 00:08:49,640
and call me and say, Hey, so and
so is coming through.

140
00:08:49,640 --> 00:08:54,400
Like I, I think Paul Davis, for
example, one night was coming

141
00:08:54,400 --> 00:08:57,000
through.
And so I'm, I'm a huge Paul

142
00:08:57,000 --> 00:08:59,480
Davis fan.
So sometimes that's not good

143
00:08:59,480 --> 00:09:02,440
when you're a fan and you're
also running the venue because

144
00:09:02,680 --> 00:09:07,080
you, you tend to I, I remember I
booked Average White Band and

145
00:09:07,280 --> 00:09:11,040
every musician in the Carolinas
and Virginia was there, but that

146
00:09:11,040 --> 00:09:14,160
was about it, you know, So we
all had a good time.

147
00:09:14,160 --> 00:09:17,560
Martin Day Rush concert.
Exactly, exactly.

148
00:09:17,760 --> 00:09:22,840
But but you know, from that we
kind of went outdoors.

149
00:09:23,120 --> 00:09:26,720
Charlie Daniels became a friend
and he was a big veteran

150
00:09:26,720 --> 00:09:30,280
supporter.
Me being a veteran, we decided

151
00:09:30,280 --> 00:09:33,880
to rent the local baseball,
minor League Baseball field and

152
00:09:33,880 --> 00:09:37,880
do a benefit for the vets.
It was very successful.

153
00:09:37,880 --> 00:09:41,720
We raised I think $56,000 for
the vets that night.

154
00:09:42,040 --> 00:09:45,600
He walks off the stage and slaps
me on the back and said, Jim,

155
00:09:45,600 --> 00:09:48,520
you found your calling, get out
of the bar business and start

156
00:09:48,520 --> 00:09:51,520
producing events.
So I took him up on it.

157
00:09:51,520 --> 00:09:54,360
That's what I did.
And that's kind of like the the

158
00:09:54,360 --> 00:10:00,720
beginning of SES and which
formed in the garage in 1986

159
00:10:00,720 --> 00:10:05,280
with my wife and Jeff Cranfield.
And and then later on it we did

160
00:10:05,280 --> 00:10:11,120
SET and we just started adding
pieces that yeah.

161
00:10:11,280 --> 00:10:12,800
Adding letters.
Yeah, yeah.

162
00:10:12,800 --> 00:10:14,880
Exactly.
We just started adding pieces or

163
00:10:14,880 --> 00:10:18,400
or solutions.
We'll say yeah, when whenever

164
00:10:18,400 --> 00:10:21,640
there was a problem to be solved
and we felt we could solve it,

165
00:10:21,640 --> 00:10:26,040
we created it like concert.
Elation Lighting is a privately

166
00:10:26,040 --> 00:10:30,880
held corporation established in
1992 and headquartered in Los

167
00:10:30,880 --> 00:10:33,320
Angeles.
All products are developed and

168
00:10:33,320 --> 00:10:36,640
engineered in the United States
with sales and support office

169
00:10:36,640 --> 00:10:42,240
locations in the USA, Mexico and
Europe, and distribution via a

170
00:10:42,240 --> 00:10:45,360
worldwide dealer network.
Elation Lighting presents the

171
00:10:45,360 --> 00:10:48,640
Rebel Profile, a powerful high
output LED moving head with

172
00:10:48,640 --> 00:10:52,360
dynamic color mixing with high
CRI and rugged IP65 protection.

173
00:10:53,280 --> 00:10:56,080
Unleash the untamed power of the
Rebel Profile with explosive

174
00:10:56,080 --> 00:10:59,360
output, uncompromising precision
and audacious projection that

175
00:10:59,360 --> 00:11:02,280
shatters conventions all in a
packed 500 Watt package.

176
00:11:04,040 --> 00:11:08,160
The Rebel Profile delivers CNY
color mixing variable, CTO and

177
00:11:08,160 --> 00:11:11,760
A7 position color wheel with
high CRI filters and UV options.

178
00:11:12,680 --> 00:11:15,680
Elations Rebel Profile harnesses
powerful visuals with rotating

179
00:11:15,680 --> 00:11:21,360
and fixed gobos, dual rotating
prisms and high speed iris.

180
00:11:22,800 --> 00:11:26,160
With an IP65 outdoor rating, it
enables designers to create

181
00:11:26,160 --> 00:11:29,120
captivating experiences in the
harshest outdoor conditions.

182
00:11:29,320 --> 00:11:32,280
Featuring a customizable logo
plate, the Rebel series lets you

183
00:11:32,280 --> 00:11:36,560
brand every moment.
Bold, distinct and unmistakable,

184
00:11:36,560 --> 00:11:38,760
yours break free from the status
quo.

185
00:11:41,800 --> 00:11:45,000
Chairs, you know.
How did how did you and how did

186
00:11:45,000 --> 00:11:50,360
you and Jeff get together?
So once, once I got out of the,

187
00:11:50,480 --> 00:11:55,200
the bar business, sold the form,
I, I started producing

188
00:11:55,200 --> 00:11:57,280
entertainment for corporate
clients mainly.

189
00:11:57,600 --> 00:12:01,800
And I would hire Jeff's company,
which was a sound and lighting

190
00:12:01,800 --> 00:12:04,560
company called Mighty Mouth
sound and lights.

191
00:12:05,120 --> 00:12:08,480
And I I I talked about terrible.
Names.

192
00:12:08,680 --> 00:12:12,520
Oh, yeah, exactly right.
You know, so I would hire them

193
00:12:12,520 --> 00:12:17,640
and, and one day I was doing Ray
Stevens in Winston Salem at the

194
00:12:17,640 --> 00:12:21,080
Convention Center and, and Jeff
and his team were loading in the

195
00:12:21,080 --> 00:12:25,200
sound and lights and I was
looking at the equipment and I

196
00:12:25,240 --> 00:12:30,880
said, you know, that's not
really quite where I want to be

197
00:12:31,240 --> 00:12:33,840
and not really quite what I want
to present.

198
00:12:34,120 --> 00:12:37,760
So I went to Jeff and I said,
look, how about you come over

199
00:12:37,760 --> 00:12:41,800
with me and let's start
something and really put a, a, a

200
00:12:41,880 --> 00:12:45,160
good product out there.
I ended up having to buy mighty

201
00:12:45,160 --> 00:12:49,280
mouth sound and lights and from
the owner, but I ended up

202
00:12:49,280 --> 00:12:51,000
getting Cranfield in the
process.

203
00:12:51,000 --> 00:12:53,440
And and this is, it's been a
great win.

204
00:12:53,520 --> 00:12:54,920
Marriage.
Yeah.

205
00:12:55,240 --> 00:12:58,720
One for partnerships to survive.
What was that, the mid 80s?

206
00:12:58,720 --> 00:13:01,600
Late 80s.
Well, it's 1986, yes.

207
00:13:01,880 --> 00:13:04,920
So 40 years.
Next year, yeah, that's right.

208
00:13:05,080 --> 00:13:05,600
That's right.
Like.

209
00:13:05,920 --> 00:13:08,880
Just for a partnership, you
know, I've been through a couple

210
00:13:08,880 --> 00:13:10,600
partnerships and they're not
easy.

211
00:13:10,600 --> 00:13:12,520
They're way harder than
marriages.

212
00:13:13,560 --> 00:13:17,640
They aren't, you know.
And so yeah, that that alone

213
00:13:17,640 --> 00:13:19,560
says a lot about the two people
that are involved.

214
00:13:19,560 --> 00:13:22,680
And I happen to have a high
degree of respect for both of

215
00:13:22,680 --> 00:13:25,240
them.
So I can see how it survived,

216
00:13:25,240 --> 00:13:27,080
you know, cuz you're both really
good people.

217
00:13:27,400 --> 00:13:30,560
Well, you know, it's, it's, it
hasn't been always easy.

218
00:13:30,640 --> 00:13:33,200
You know, there have been some
partners in the mix and, and you

219
00:13:33,200 --> 00:13:35,800
know, you've been down the same
Rd. where it just didn't jail

220
00:13:35,800 --> 00:13:39,040
for one reason or another.
And, you know, I see a lot of

221
00:13:39,040 --> 00:13:42,320
friends that, that just suffer
through it.

222
00:13:42,320 --> 00:13:46,080
They, they just grin and bear it
or, or they just really don't

223
00:13:46,120 --> 00:13:49,840
get where they can be because
they're held back.

224
00:13:49,840 --> 00:13:52,720
And then there's the whole
resentment thing and all of

225
00:13:52,720 --> 00:13:55,240
that.
So I, I've been, I've been very

226
00:13:55,240 --> 00:13:59,240
proactive in those scenarios.
If, if I knew early on in the

227
00:13:59,240 --> 00:14:02,240
partnership that it just wasn't
going to work, hey, you know,

228
00:14:02,360 --> 00:14:03,880
I'm sorry, but it's not going to
work.

229
00:14:03,880 --> 00:14:07,520
We, we, we've got to go our
separate ways and it's, it's all

230
00:14:07,520 --> 00:14:09,400
worked out pretty well.
Yeah.

231
00:14:09,440 --> 00:14:12,200
Well, I'd say so, yeah.
I mean, you guys just keep

232
00:14:12,200 --> 00:14:16,960
growing and it's it's such a
beautiful company and and I

233
00:14:16,960 --> 00:14:20,480
think, you know, a model that so
many are really looking at

234
00:14:20,480 --> 00:14:22,600
going, what are those guys doing
over there?

235
00:14:22,680 --> 00:14:24,680
You know, that's pretty
interesting what they're doing

236
00:14:25,040 --> 00:14:27,240
because you've just done it
different than everybody else.

237
00:14:27,240 --> 00:14:31,600
So, so yeah, I mean.
It's been a lot of fun, but you

238
00:14:31,600 --> 00:14:35,080
know, it's, it's really not me.
It's, it's all of the people in

239
00:14:35,080 --> 00:14:40,120
the group, you know, you, if you
can get really good people and

240
00:14:40,120 --> 00:14:44,680
empower them to be who they can
become, you know, that's,

241
00:14:44,720 --> 00:14:48,920
that's, that's the strength
behind CSG everyone in every

242
00:14:49,400 --> 00:14:53,600
vertical that they have their
strengths and, and, and they,

243
00:14:54,040 --> 00:14:56,760
they're so complimentary to the
entire group.

244
00:14:56,760 --> 00:14:58,800
And it's, it's just, it's just
fun.

245
00:14:58,800 --> 00:15:01,920
It's a lot of fun.
Yeah, so I read a couple things

246
00:15:01,920 --> 00:15:05,640
in your story. 1 Is that that
your grandmother Alley was was

247
00:15:05,640 --> 00:15:10,280
one of Speaking of strength, was
one of the real sort of rocks

248
00:15:10,280 --> 00:15:14,680
behind you.
And do you have any lessons that

249
00:15:14,680 --> 00:15:17,880
you remember from her that that
carried you through your career?

250
00:15:19,640 --> 00:15:24,440
Yeah, a couple.
You know, she, she was a back in

251
00:15:24,440 --> 00:15:26,440
the day of the turn of the
century.

252
00:15:26,440 --> 00:15:31,320
You know, she was a farmer's
wife that raised 13 children.

253
00:15:31,800 --> 00:15:35,320
And my mother was the 13th.
I'm the 13th grandchild.

254
00:15:35,360 --> 00:15:37,200
My mother was born on the 13th
day.

255
00:15:37,200 --> 00:15:40,040
So 13 kind of.
Not only Taylor's lucky number,

256
00:15:40,040 --> 00:15:42,000
but mine as well.
There's some interesting

257
00:15:42,000 --> 00:15:45,800
coincidences.
Yeah, but she, she, she just

258
00:15:45,800 --> 00:15:50,440
taught me so much about the
strength of being the, the

259
00:15:50,600 --> 00:15:54,720
matriarch of a large family and
a farming family.

260
00:15:54,720 --> 00:15:57,840
And we, we we grew up dirt poor,
really.

261
00:15:57,840 --> 00:16:00,280
I mean, I didn't know it then,
didn't care.

262
00:16:00,440 --> 00:16:02,480
But if we didn't grow it, we
didn't eat it.

263
00:16:02,640 --> 00:16:07,040
You know, it was.
And I remember one time she and

264
00:16:07,040 --> 00:16:12,080
I were out picking blackberries,
and I saw a copperhead and I

265
00:16:12,080 --> 00:16:14,640
said, Granny, there's a snake.
There's a snake.

266
00:16:14,760 --> 00:16:18,480
She just calmly walked over and
stomped on it.

267
00:16:19,280 --> 00:16:20,880
And that was the end of that,
you know?

268
00:16:21,680 --> 00:16:23,360
Wow.
OK.

269
00:16:23,440 --> 00:16:27,000
That's that's pretty cool, you
know, And I remember when I was

270
00:16:27,000 --> 00:16:28,960
so messy with Granny.
Yeah.

271
00:16:28,960 --> 00:16:32,040
I remember when I was 15, I
said, grandmother, I'm going to

272
00:16:32,040 --> 00:16:35,360
be 16 next year and I'm.
I'm going to need a car.

273
00:16:35,960 --> 00:16:39,600
And she said, OK, Sonny boy,
step out here with me for a

274
00:16:39,600 --> 00:16:41,520
minute.
So we went out in the yard and

275
00:16:41,520 --> 00:16:45,280
she pointed over to the next
hill and there was a three acre

276
00:16:45,280 --> 00:16:48,280
patch of land.
And she said, see that 3 acres

277
00:16:48,280 --> 00:16:50,840
over there said yes, ma'am.
She said grow you 1.

278
00:16:51,760 --> 00:16:56,040
So I grew 3 acres of tobacco the
next year and bought my car.

279
00:16:56,040 --> 00:17:00,720
So, you know, that's that's it's
just things like that, you know,

280
00:17:00,840 --> 00:17:02,520
those are incredible.
Lessons.

281
00:17:02,520 --> 00:17:06,280
So that's incredible.
Like, that's what's, I hate to

282
00:17:06,280 --> 00:17:08,040
even go down this path and we
won't.

283
00:17:08,040 --> 00:17:10,920
But some of that stuff's missing
today, you know?

284
00:17:11,319 --> 00:17:16,000
Yeah, some of the foundational
real teachings in life and, you

285
00:17:16,000 --> 00:17:20,040
know, hardships and all of the
things that make us who we are

286
00:17:20,079 --> 00:17:22,920
or made us created the
foundation that we could build

287
00:17:22,920 --> 00:17:27,560
things on top of, you know, come
from, you know, toughness, come

288
00:17:27,560 --> 00:17:30,840
from, you know, not being given
everything in our lives.

289
00:17:31,320 --> 00:17:34,520
Yeah, get guilty myself.
I mean, you know, I, I never

290
00:17:34,520 --> 00:17:38,240
wanted my son or my daughter to
grow up as hard as I did.

291
00:17:38,280 --> 00:17:41,680
I, I, you know, I probably
spoiled them a little too much.

292
00:17:42,040 --> 00:17:44,440
Of course, Michael and Jennifer
both will tell you.

293
00:17:44,440 --> 00:17:48,680
Oh, no, We had a hard, you know.
That not really uphill both ways

294
00:17:48,680 --> 00:17:49,640
to school.
Yeah, right.

295
00:17:49,720 --> 00:17:50,800
Yeah.
And snow.

296
00:17:51,360 --> 00:17:52,240
Yeah.
Yeah.

297
00:17:52,600 --> 00:17:53,840
No, I know.
I know.

298
00:17:54,000 --> 00:17:56,280
Well, my son grew up in
Motorsports.

299
00:17:56,280 --> 00:17:58,480
He decided he wanted to be a
racing driver.

300
00:17:58,480 --> 00:18:02,520
So we went through karting and
then finally into cars.

301
00:18:02,920 --> 00:18:06,800
And, you know, his hardship is
the fact that most of his

302
00:18:06,800 --> 00:18:10,960
friends who are racing in cars
are now in IndyCar or Formula

303
00:18:10,960 --> 00:18:15,040
One or whatever because their
dads were billionaires, you

304
00:18:15,200 --> 00:18:17,000
know?
So hey, guess what, kid?

305
00:18:17,000 --> 00:18:18,400
Now you're roughing it, you
know?

306
00:18:18,400 --> 00:18:20,240
You know, all the stories that
you're going to tell him you're

307
00:18:20,560 --> 00:18:23,760
well, I would have made it as a
Formula One driver if my dad

308
00:18:23,760 --> 00:18:27,680
wasn't broke and in the frigging
entertainment business, you

309
00:18:27,680 --> 00:18:28,960
know?
So.

310
00:18:29,800 --> 00:18:33,160
So yeah, you know, we all have
crosses to bear.

311
00:18:33,160 --> 00:18:36,480
I guess.
Another thing that I read from

312
00:18:36,480 --> 00:18:41,400
your story that was really
interesting, this pivotal spark

313
00:18:41,680 --> 00:18:46,080
from early on in in your life
and career or that created your

314
00:18:46,080 --> 00:18:50,200
career, I guess, was you.
You were, I believe, driving

315
00:18:50,200 --> 00:18:53,880
down the road or something and
Jumpin Jack Flash came on the

316
00:18:53,880 --> 00:18:57,720
radio and you pulled over to
listen to it and somehow that

317
00:18:57,720 --> 00:19:01,200
created the spark.
It it it did and I still

318
00:19:01,200 --> 00:19:04,440
remember that this day I had a
63 Chevy super sport with a

319
00:19:04,440 --> 00:19:06,800
reverb unit in it.
That's a cool bar.

320
00:19:07,360 --> 00:19:11,880
It was you know, and I paid 1500
bucks for it, you know, my own

321
00:19:11,880 --> 00:19:14,680
hard earned money.
But you know, I was riding down

322
00:19:14,680 --> 00:19:18,480
the road 11 evening and and that
came on I'm whoa.

323
00:19:19,040 --> 00:19:21,600
I just pulled over to the side
of the road and cranked it up,

324
00:19:21,600 --> 00:19:24,760
and I said I don't, this is
moving me.

325
00:19:24,760 --> 00:19:30,760
This is why Raleigh nothing's
affected me like this song right

326
00:19:30,760 --> 00:19:34,880
now in this moment.
Yeah, I kind of knew I wanted to

327
00:19:34,880 --> 00:19:36,440
be in the music business.
I didn't.

328
00:19:36,440 --> 00:19:38,000
I had no idea how to get there
though.

329
00:19:38,320 --> 00:19:41,000
No idea.
Yeah, really.

330
00:19:41,000 --> 00:19:43,400
That's interesting that it was
jumping Jack Flash.

331
00:19:43,400 --> 00:19:44,040
Yeah.
Yeah, right.

332
00:19:44,040 --> 00:19:46,880
I mean, for me, there's a lot of
those moments in my childhood

333
00:19:46,880 --> 00:19:51,120
too, where, you know, because my
my parents, my mom was a singer,

334
00:19:52,240 --> 00:19:53,960
my dad died when I was very
young.

335
00:19:53,960 --> 00:19:57,080
My stepdad didn't really have
any of those kinds of creative

336
00:19:57,080 --> 00:20:00,560
talents or anything.
But there was always music

337
00:20:00,560 --> 00:20:03,120
playing in my house, you know,
whether it was Elvis or Conway

338
00:20:03,120 --> 00:20:07,960
Twitty or, you know, all of that
old stuff and always music

339
00:20:07,960 --> 00:20:10,840
playing.
And I just always everything was

340
00:20:10,840 --> 00:20:12,880
based around music.
Like where were you when this

341
00:20:12,880 --> 00:20:14,240
happened?
Where were you when this song

342
00:20:14,240 --> 00:20:15,080
came out?
Where were you?

343
00:20:15,560 --> 00:20:19,560
And but, you know, I can't say
that there was anything where it

344
00:20:19,560 --> 00:20:21,920
just.
Moved me like what you just

345
00:20:22,000 --> 00:20:26,480
described in in jumping Jack
flash and I just why that song?

346
00:20:26,480 --> 00:20:29,680
Like I don't see it as an
inspirational song necessarily.

347
00:20:30,160 --> 00:20:33,680
Well, I was, I was trying to be
a guitar player back then and

348
00:20:33,680 --> 00:20:37,600
was really lousy at it.
And so I put that down and tried

349
00:20:37,600 --> 00:20:39,760
to play bass.
I was worse at that, you know,

350
00:20:39,760 --> 00:20:43,320
but I just really, really
enjoyed, you know, listening to

351
00:20:43,320 --> 00:20:47,600
good guitar work and, and, and
just good beats and, and just

352
00:20:47,720 --> 00:20:52,440
just loved it.
When I, when we built Ejs, we'd

353
00:20:52,440 --> 00:20:55,840
close down the club, get
everyone out and it'd be like

354
00:20:55,840 --> 00:20:58,240
2:00 AM in the morning and
everyone was gone.

355
00:20:59,000 --> 00:21:03,680
I would go up in the DJ booth
and put on something and just go

356
00:21:03,680 --> 00:21:07,880
down and sit on the middle of
the stage and just look and

357
00:21:07,880 --> 00:21:10,440
think and breathe it in and
listen to.

358
00:21:10,720 --> 00:21:15,120
I remember I was into Chicago
back then and I would play

359
00:21:15,160 --> 00:21:19,760
everything Chicago and, and
blood, sweat and tears and, and

360
00:21:20,000 --> 00:21:23,960
it was just one of those 2230
AM, 3:00 AM in the morning

361
00:21:23,960 --> 00:21:29,320
moments where you were all alone
in something you created and you

362
00:21:29,320 --> 00:21:33,920
were surrounding yourself with
what you loved, which was music.

363
00:21:34,200 --> 00:21:38,320
And it it was just a a.
Probably when you started to

364
00:21:38,320 --> 00:21:41,160
envision it as a as a live club
too, right as.

365
00:21:41,160 --> 00:21:44,480
Opposed to.
Yeah, yeah, I love that.

366
00:21:44,800 --> 00:21:48,120
So you know, it's funny because
I started out as a singer 1st

367
00:21:48,520 --> 00:21:51,800
and how I became a singer is
quite funny.

368
00:21:51,800 --> 00:21:53,880
You'll get this because it's all
through the church.

369
00:21:54,280 --> 00:22:01,440
So I was 6, I think, and I was
at some Sunday school thing and,

370
00:22:01,440 --> 00:22:06,960
and with my family and I, I
believe it was one of the, the,

371
00:22:07,120 --> 00:22:10,400
the nuns who, who asked if
anyone had a song that they'd

372
00:22:10,400 --> 00:22:13,400
like to come up and sing.
And, you know, I'm little Johnny

373
00:22:13,400 --> 00:22:16,200
like I always was.
I was always the little Johnny

374
00:22:16,200 --> 00:22:18,400
guy, you know?
Me, me, me, me, me.

375
00:22:18,400 --> 00:22:19,240
Pick me.
Pick me.

376
00:22:19,680 --> 00:22:21,960
And my parents are looking at me
like, what the heck?

377
00:22:21,960 --> 00:22:25,000
What are you going to do?
You know, what song do you know?

378
00:22:25,520 --> 00:22:30,040
And so I go running up onto the
stage in front of I grew up in a

379
00:22:30,040 --> 00:22:33,280
very tiny town, like 200 and
5300 people.

380
00:22:33,840 --> 00:22:36,480
So everybody knew everybody.
And they're all like, what's

381
00:22:36,480 --> 00:22:38,520
Marcel going to do?
You know?

382
00:22:38,840 --> 00:22:42,120
So I get up and I start singing
bottle of wine, fruit of the

383
00:22:42,120 --> 00:22:44,400
vine.
When you going to let me get

384
00:22:44,400 --> 00:22:48,480
sober or whatever, right?
How did I know this song?

385
00:22:48,480 --> 00:22:50,600
Nobody really knows.
Obviously.

386
00:22:50,600 --> 00:22:52,480
I'd heard it through my parents
or something.

387
00:22:53,000 --> 00:22:56,480
And the whole place was laughing
and I was hooked.

388
00:22:56,640 --> 00:22:59,480
Like even though they were
laughing at my silly song, I was

389
00:22:59,480 --> 00:23:04,440
hooked.
And so a few years later, I was

390
00:23:04,440 --> 00:23:09,640
in 6th grade and there was a, a
little thing hanging up in the

391
00:23:09,640 --> 00:23:13,640
church saying looking for a
singer for a rock band hanging

392
00:23:13,640 --> 00:23:17,520
in the church.
And so I was like, I want to do

393
00:23:17,520 --> 00:23:19,360
this.
And I told my parents I want to

394
00:23:19,360 --> 00:23:22,200
go and audition for this singer
in a rock band.

395
00:23:22,520 --> 00:23:25,640
They're like, you've never sang
except that one time in church,

396
00:23:25,640 --> 00:23:29,760
you know, and you can't do this.
And I'm like, oh, yeah, watch

397
00:23:29,760 --> 00:23:32,280
me.
So the rehearsals are the

398
00:23:32,560 --> 00:23:35,800
auditions were in the basement
of the church, like the next day

399
00:23:35,800 --> 00:23:38,840
or something.
And I went and auditioned and I

400
00:23:38,840 --> 00:23:43,120
got the gig.
And so it was a rock band that

401
00:23:43,120 --> 00:23:46,680
rehearsed in the basement of a
church, that played every

402
00:23:46,680 --> 00:23:49,960
Saturday night in the church,
this thing called the Rock Mass.

403
00:23:49,960 --> 00:23:52,880
And it was these German songs
translated into English.

404
00:23:53,640 --> 00:23:57,000
And because at the time there
was no Christian rock or

405
00:23:57,000 --> 00:24:01,000
anything, rock music was still
devil's music at that time.

406
00:24:01,920 --> 00:24:06,920
And so we played to basically
pay our rent for the basement

407
00:24:06,920 --> 00:24:09,640
rehearsal space.
We played this thing on Saturday

408
00:24:09,640 --> 00:24:12,840
nights that was standing room
only at every teenager.

409
00:24:13,000 --> 00:24:17,080
This by now I was in Calgary in
a real city, and every teenager

410
00:24:17,080 --> 00:24:20,040
around came to this thing.
There would be, you know, 5-6

411
00:24:20,040 --> 00:24:25,000
hundred teenagers in church
every Saturday night and, and we

412
00:24:25,000 --> 00:24:28,240
would go play gigs at high
schools and community centers

413
00:24:28,240 --> 00:24:30,720
and stuff.
And I was all of what, 12 years

414
00:24:30,720 --> 00:24:34,520
old or something, signing
autographs for 15 year old girls

415
00:24:34,520 --> 00:24:39,160
and stuff.
And yeah, so it was fun, lots of

416
00:24:39,160 --> 00:24:43,040
fun, but fantastic.
You know, you get inspiration

417
00:24:43,040 --> 00:24:45,720
from different places, I guess.
Bottle of wine with mine.

418
00:24:47,760 --> 00:24:51,080
So you you, I believe had
initially.

419
00:24:51,640 --> 00:24:56,800
Wanted to go after broadcasting?
Yes yes, Main Light, a trusted

420
00:24:56,800 --> 00:24:59,200
name in dry, higher lighting and
stage equipment rentals.

421
00:24:59,400 --> 00:25:02,200
Whether you're lighting a
theater show, producing a major

422
00:25:02,200 --> 00:25:05,920
concert, or building out a
broadcast set, Main Light

423
00:25:05,920 --> 00:25:08,760
delivers the gear you need to
make your vision a reality.

424
00:25:09,160 --> 00:25:12,040
They offer a massive inventory
of the latest moving lights,

425
00:25:12,040 --> 00:25:16,920
control consoles, trust LED
fixtures, and durable IP65 rated

426
00:25:16,920 --> 00:25:20,960
gear that's perfect for both
indoor and outdoor environments.

427
00:25:21,360 --> 00:25:25,200
From small scale productions to
massive stadium tours, Main

428
00:25:25,200 --> 00:25:27,960
Light is known across the
industry as the partner you

429
00:25:27,960 --> 00:25:31,680
trust with the gear you want.
But that's not all.

430
00:25:31,920 --> 00:25:34,720
Main Light also offer new
equipment, sales from your

431
00:25:34,720 --> 00:25:38,280
favorite brands and used gear
pulled direct from their rental

432
00:25:38,280 --> 00:25:40,920
fleet.
Every used item is rigorously

433
00:25:40,920 --> 00:25:44,600
maintained and backed by a 60
day depot warranty, giving you

434
00:25:44,600 --> 00:25:46,880
confidence and value in every
purchase.

435
00:25:47,320 --> 00:25:51,560
With three strategically located
facilities in Teterboro, NJ,

436
00:25:51,800 --> 00:25:56,080
Wilmington, DE, and Las Vegas,
NV, you get nationwide access

437
00:25:56,080 --> 00:25:58,520
and the responsiveness of a
local provider.

438
00:25:58,920 --> 00:26:04,320
Explore their rental inventory,
request a custom coat quote, or

439
00:26:04,320 --> 00:26:08,640
browse their sales offerings
online today at mainlight.com.

440
00:26:09,160 --> 00:26:14,280
And I wanted to be a DJ because
obviously hearing Jumping Jack

441
00:26:14,280 --> 00:26:18,240
Flash on the radio, I thought,
oh, wow, this is if I'm a DJ, I

442
00:26:18,240 --> 00:26:19,800
can play anything I want to
play.

443
00:26:19,800 --> 00:26:22,080
I can hear any, you know, I can
connect.

444
00:26:22,080 --> 00:26:25,640
But I, I, I, I sucked at that as
well, so you know.

445
00:26:25,880 --> 00:26:28,440
Man.
It just it just didn't work.

446
00:26:28,440 --> 00:26:32,120
So, you know, I struggled
through early aspirations and

447
00:26:32,120 --> 00:26:35,760
failures and, you know, finally
ended up where I am.

448
00:26:35,760 --> 00:26:37,680
But.
You know, Jim, for a guy with no

449
00:26:37,680 --> 00:26:39,920
skills, you've done pretty well
for yourself.

450
00:26:41,480 --> 00:26:43,320
You keep saying that, but I
sucked at it.

451
00:26:43,480 --> 00:26:45,200
And you know everything.
I sucked at it.

452
00:26:45,640 --> 00:26:47,720
You know, I want to do this, but
I sucked at it.

453
00:26:48,280 --> 00:26:50,960
Yeah.
No, that's, that's, that's

454
00:26:50,960 --> 00:26:52,880
interesting.
And, and The funny thing is like

455
00:26:53,280 --> 00:26:56,480
if you could think of an area
where it's probably harder to

456
00:26:56,480 --> 00:26:59,160
make money than it is in our
industry, it's probably

457
00:26:59,160 --> 00:27:02,080
broadcast, you know, like
especially now with.

458
00:27:02,080 --> 00:27:04,600
Podcasts and you know, it's come
to that.

459
00:27:04,600 --> 00:27:06,000
It's come to that for sure, you
know.

460
00:27:06,000 --> 00:27:08,440
Yeah, I mean, there's so many
different ways to get your

461
00:27:08,440 --> 00:27:11,800
message out that, you know, most
of them don't earn you a lot of

462
00:27:11,800 --> 00:27:12,680
money.
So.

463
00:27:13,800 --> 00:27:14,400
So.
Yeah.

464
00:27:15,000 --> 00:27:18,640
So you and Jeff got together.
You created.

465
00:27:19,040 --> 00:27:20,360
So what was it originally
called?

466
00:27:20,360 --> 00:27:23,720
It wasn't called.
Well, in the beginning there

467
00:27:23,880 --> 00:27:26,280
there were no lighting companies
over in the Carolina.

468
00:27:26,280 --> 00:27:28,120
This bandit was the nearest
lighting company.

469
00:27:28,120 --> 00:27:32,280
So we formed Southern Lights and
Michael Strickland was

470
00:27:32,280 --> 00:27:35,440
instrumental in helping me get
started.

471
00:27:35,440 --> 00:27:38,880
We bought all of our first
equipment from him and then we

472
00:27:38,880 --> 00:27:41,960
would also sub back to him when
he needed help.

473
00:27:41,960 --> 00:27:46,360
We'd we'd go do gigs for him.
And then then that a year later,

474
00:27:46,360 --> 00:27:48,800
we thought, well, you know, it'd
be nice to have an audio

475
00:27:48,800 --> 00:27:51,880
component.
And we went and got Don Kate's

476
00:27:51,880 --> 00:27:58,520
Bogey and we formed SE Audio.
And so here we are with Southern

477
00:27:58,520 --> 00:28:03,360
Lights and Southeast Audio.
And a couple years later we're

478
00:28:03,360 --> 00:28:07,120
doing a lot of corporate events.
And there was this company out

479
00:28:07,120 --> 00:28:09,400
of New Jersey.
I, I don't remember the name of

480
00:28:09,400 --> 00:28:12,680
them now, but they, they, they
had an office in Winston Salem.

481
00:28:12,680 --> 00:28:15,640
Their main clients were like RJ
Reynolds and some other people

482
00:28:15,640 --> 00:28:19,440
and, and we were doing the sound
and lights for them and they

483
00:28:19,440 --> 00:28:22,640
would do all the slide
projectors and the creative and

484
00:28:22,640 --> 00:28:25,680
all of that jazz.
They just shut their doors one

485
00:28:25,680 --> 00:28:29,640
day and move back to New Jersey
and left three people sitting

486
00:28:30,080 --> 00:28:33,360
there with no job.
And I said, hey, come on up here

487
00:28:33,360 --> 00:28:37,160
on Patterson Ave. and throw in
to us and we'll just, we'll just

488
00:28:37,600 --> 00:28:40,760
call it something.
And we toyed around with some

489
00:28:40,760 --> 00:28:44,720
names and we finally came up
with special event services

490
00:28:44,720 --> 00:28:48,280
because we were doing corporate,
we're doing amphitheaters, we're

491
00:28:48,280 --> 00:28:51,880
doing festivals, we're doing the
occasional frat gig.

492
00:28:52,160 --> 00:28:56,960
And, you know, just it was it.
Once again, we're not marketing

493
00:28:56,960 --> 00:29:01,280
geniuses by any stretch.
It's a very, very common name.

494
00:29:01,280 --> 00:29:04,640
And I just thought, you know,
well, you know, this, this kind

495
00:29:04,640 --> 00:29:09,000
of defines what we do.
So, yeah, no, I, it totally

496
00:29:09,000 --> 00:29:13,640
makes sense.
And so I, you know, for me, for

497
00:29:13,640 --> 00:29:16,840
some reason, like one of the
things that I've always kind of

498
00:29:16,840 --> 00:29:20,120
tied you guys to is, is Hoodie,
you know, Hoodie and the

499
00:29:20,120 --> 00:29:22,360
Blowfish.
Obviously you've been doing it

500
00:29:22,360 --> 00:29:25,440
for years and years and years
since I guess probably his first

501
00:29:25,440 --> 00:29:30,800
gig or their first gig.
And so how did that happen?

502
00:29:30,800 --> 00:29:33,680
How did you you find that band?
They find you.

503
00:29:35,120 --> 00:29:37,080
Do you remember?
Yeah, yeah.

504
00:29:37,080 --> 00:29:42,360
In, in, in the early 90s,
ninety, 1234, they were frat

505
00:29:42,360 --> 00:29:44,320
band.
You know, they played clubs and

506
00:29:44,320 --> 00:29:47,800
frats and they, they were going
to USC, University of South

507
00:29:47,800 --> 00:29:51,440
Carolina.
And they would often show up on

508
00:29:51,440 --> 00:29:53,840
stages that we were doing
production on.

509
00:29:54,480 --> 00:30:00,160
And in 1993, they were on at
both of the amphitheaters that

510
00:30:00,160 --> 00:30:02,800
we did production for at that
time in the Carolinas.

511
00:30:03,400 --> 00:30:08,400
And they weren't the headliners.
They were direct support and

512
00:30:08,520 --> 00:30:12,840
they had no production manager.
So I would step in and make sure

513
00:30:12,840 --> 00:30:17,080
they were treated properly and
make sure they had their 16 feet

514
00:30:17,080 --> 00:30:21,320
downstage and, and I would fight
with the headliner for them and,

515
00:30:21,360 --> 00:30:25,520
and all of that.
So when, when 94 came around,

516
00:30:25,560 --> 00:30:28,440
we, I ended up seeing them a
lot.

517
00:30:28,440 --> 00:30:32,240
And they, we, they asked us to
go throughout the Southeast and

518
00:30:32,240 --> 00:30:35,360
do frat gigs with them.
So we, we developed a pretty

519
00:30:35,360 --> 00:30:39,320
close relationship.
And then in 95 when they, they

520
00:30:39,320 --> 00:30:43,800
were going to tour, they called
me and said, we want you to go

521
00:30:43,800 --> 00:30:46,080
on the road with us.
And I said, yeah, well, I, I

522
00:30:46,080 --> 00:30:48,720
don't tour.
You know, I'm, I'm, I'm a

523
00:30:48,760 --> 00:30:52,520
regional guy and I'm, I'm happy
right here in the South and

524
00:30:52,840 --> 00:30:56,920
everything's going fine.
We're happy to go work with you,

525
00:30:56,920 --> 00:30:59,000
but we just don't tour.
Yeah.

526
00:30:59,160 --> 00:31:03,280
And they and they persisted and
we were working, actually we're

527
00:31:03,280 --> 00:31:06,360
working both with Hootie and
Dave Matthews at that time.

528
00:31:06,360 --> 00:31:10,240
And we really didn't have the
bandwidth to do both of them and

529
00:31:10,520 --> 00:31:12,760
thought maybe we don't get a
given today, you know some.

530
00:31:13,680 --> 00:31:16,320
Things happened today, you know.
Oh, absolutely.

531
00:31:16,320 --> 00:31:21,360
And so finally I get this call
one day from their manager and

532
00:31:21,360 --> 00:31:23,720
said, look, the band's in the
office and they want to meet

533
00:31:23,720 --> 00:31:25,680
with you.
Will you drive down to Columbia

534
00:31:25,680 --> 00:31:29,280
and meet with us?
And I drove down the next day

535
00:31:29,280 --> 00:31:33,320
and they were all in the office.
And I said, look, we need you.

536
00:31:33,440 --> 00:31:37,240
We want you to go do this.
And we're very comfortable with

537
00:31:37,240 --> 00:31:38,840
you.
We know you'll take care of us

538
00:31:38,840 --> 00:31:43,840
and we just need you to do it.
I said, OK, I'll do it.

539
00:31:44,360 --> 00:31:49,680
And I got I got up to leave and
and I think Paul Graham at the

540
00:31:49,680 --> 00:31:53,840
time was their tour manager.
He said, hey, grammar, just want

541
00:31:53,840 --> 00:31:57,160
you to know, he opened up a desk
drawer and he took out a folder

542
00:31:57,440 --> 00:32:01,120
that was about that thick of all
the production companies that

543
00:32:01,120 --> 00:32:06,560
sent in quotes and bids and and
tried to get the band.

544
00:32:06,720 --> 00:32:09,000
And he said, once, you know,
these are all the guys that

545
00:32:09,000 --> 00:32:13,080
wanted the gig we just gave you.
And he threw them in the trash

546
00:32:13,080 --> 00:32:15,520
can and said we never once
looked at them, one of them.

547
00:32:16,160 --> 00:32:19,040
So that kind of that kind of
started it, you know, and.

548
00:32:19,960 --> 00:32:22,680
So how hard was that figuring
out how to become a touring

549
00:32:22,680 --> 00:32:25,240
company?
Well, you know, it was, it

550
00:32:25,240 --> 00:32:28,880
wasn't hard because the band was
trying to figure out how to tour

551
00:32:28,880 --> 00:32:30,840
as well.
So we kind of figured it out

552
00:32:30,840 --> 00:32:35,160
together, you know, and, and we
got most of it right.

553
00:32:35,280 --> 00:32:40,800
You know, we, we and, and we had
a lot of people throughout the

554
00:32:40,800 --> 00:32:44,880
country that were on our side
because, you know, as far as

555
00:32:44,880 --> 00:32:48,080
bands go, Hootie and the
Blowfish is a great success

556
00:32:48,080 --> 00:32:50,840
story.
It's kind of like good guys wear

557
00:32:50,840 --> 00:32:54,400
hats, you know, and, and, and we
were out there, you know,

558
00:32:54,800 --> 00:32:58,280
Carolina boys make it big.
You know, crack rear view is

559
00:32:58,280 --> 00:33:01,800
flying off the shelves and it's
great feel good music.

560
00:33:01,800 --> 00:33:06,640
And we were we were kind of like
the the hit of of the summer.

561
00:33:06,840 --> 00:33:10,200
I remember getting a call from
Bob Rue, who back at that time

562
00:33:10,320 --> 00:33:15,680
was working with Pace and Louis
Messina and to advance the shows

563
00:33:15,680 --> 00:33:19,640
he was doing in Texas.
And he says thank God for Jim

564
00:33:19,640 --> 00:33:23,400
and Hootie and the Blowfish.
You've saved our summer because

565
00:33:23,400 --> 00:33:27,600
when we booked all of these
gigs, the deal was very, very

566
00:33:27,600 --> 00:33:32,360
small for the band and very few
of them had percentage deals on

567
00:33:32,360 --> 00:33:34,720
them.
And we were selling out 20,000

568
00:33:34,720 --> 00:33:38,240
Cedars, 25,000 Cedars.
And the promoters were doing

569
00:33:38,240 --> 00:33:40,640
really well, you know, and they
loved us.

570
00:33:40,640 --> 00:33:43,320
But it was, it was fun figuring
that out.

571
00:33:43,320 --> 00:33:46,520
It really was, yeah.
That's really, that's really an

572
00:33:46,520 --> 00:33:49,120
incredible success story.
I mean, the fact that they

573
00:33:49,120 --> 00:33:52,320
basically dragged you kicking
and screaming into the touring

574
00:33:52,320 --> 00:33:54,920
business.
And if you look back and, and

575
00:33:55,280 --> 00:33:59,240
think of, you know, what that
did for your business and for

576
00:33:59,240 --> 00:34:02,040
for your growth and for all
kinds of things.

577
00:34:02,040 --> 00:34:08,840
I mean, obviously you know, a
bit of a turning point moment I

578
00:34:08,840 --> 00:34:11,159
guess in a.
Sense well, you know, that's

579
00:34:11,159 --> 00:34:13,320
that same.
You're another focal point,

580
00:34:13,320 --> 00:34:16,480
another turning point moment.
I'm sitting in my office one day

581
00:34:16,480 --> 00:34:20,520
and and back then Wilson Rogers
was managing the Walnut Creek

582
00:34:20,520 --> 00:34:23,239
Amphitheater for what would
become Live Nation.

583
00:34:23,560 --> 00:34:25,600
And he calls me up and says,
hey, what are you doing?

584
00:34:25,600 --> 00:34:27,840
I said, well, I'm sitting in the
office talking to you, Wilson.

585
00:34:27,840 --> 00:34:29,280
He said, get in your car and
come down here.

586
00:34:29,280 --> 00:34:32,920
Now the Billy Graham folks are
getting ready to come down and

587
00:34:32,920 --> 00:34:35,880
do a walkthrough and they want
to do a crusade here.

588
00:34:36,040 --> 00:34:40,320
And you got to do it.
OK, so a couple hours later, I'm

589
00:34:40,320 --> 00:34:42,840
there talking with the Billy
Graham advance team.

590
00:34:43,199 --> 00:34:47,719
And we ended up doing an event
there for four days that was so

591
00:34:47,719 --> 00:34:51,679
successful that they hired us.
So here we are.

592
00:34:51,719 --> 00:34:55,280
I've got Billy Graham on one
side and Hootie and the Blowfish

593
00:34:55,280 --> 00:34:59,160
on the other side.
And wow, what what a, what an

594
00:34:59,160 --> 00:35:03,440
interesting paradigm and.
I read AI read a funny story

595
00:35:03,440 --> 00:35:07,320
about that one too.
Where I guess, I guess I think

596
00:35:07,320 --> 00:35:11,320
it was your first Billy Graham
crusade and you had a week off

597
00:35:11,320 --> 00:35:15,200
on Hoodie and so you brought in
the crew and the gear and stuff

598
00:35:15,200 --> 00:35:18,640
from Hoodie and there was a guy
with AT shirt on.

599
00:35:18,640 --> 00:35:21,440
That was a little inappropriate,
I guess the monitor guy.

600
00:35:21,880 --> 00:35:24,320
Yes.
Yeah, How'd that work out?

601
00:35:24,800 --> 00:35:28,760
Well, it it you know, at at
sound check and rehearsals

602
00:35:28,760 --> 00:35:33,520
tonight before the 1st gig.
Tom Bledsoe, who was the crusade

603
00:35:33,520 --> 00:35:36,000
director back then, walked over
to me and said, Jim, we need to

604
00:35:36,000 --> 00:35:38,720
talk about a couple of things.
Number one, this is very

605
00:35:38,720 --> 00:35:40,800
inappropriate to tire your boys
have on here.

606
00:35:40,800 --> 00:35:44,200
So I want that cleaned up for
tomorrow and I'll see you at

607
00:35:44,200 --> 00:35:46,720
Devotions in the morning and you
better have a suit on.

608
00:35:47,360 --> 00:35:50,600
So you know.
OK, Yeah.

609
00:35:50,600 --> 00:35:55,000
So I was at Devotions the next
morning with a suit on and and

610
00:35:55,000 --> 00:35:56,920
and that and that began that
career.

611
00:35:57,280 --> 00:36:00,320
And, and all of your team who
were going to go out and do

612
00:36:00,320 --> 00:36:02,360
those shows suddenly had to
wear.

613
00:36:02,480 --> 00:36:05,120
Long sleeve shirts, no hats.
Yeah.

614
00:36:05,120 --> 00:36:07,480
Yeah, exactly.
Probably cover the tattoos.

615
00:36:07,720 --> 00:36:11,680
Yeah, yeah, that's.
I mean, it's an interesting way

616
00:36:11,680 --> 00:36:14,240
to have to learn it, but you got
to learn somehow, right?

617
00:36:14,800 --> 00:36:17,920
And so now, back then, you did
whatever you had to do, you

618
00:36:17,920 --> 00:36:19,600
know?
Yeah, yeah.

619
00:36:19,600 --> 00:36:23,400
You just got sucked into the
moment and you know, you never

620
00:36:23,400 --> 00:36:26,400
said no.
You know, you you figured out a

621
00:36:26,400 --> 00:36:28,200
way to do it.
The cool thing about all of

622
00:36:28,200 --> 00:36:31,640
these stories that I'm so
grateful for getting to hear

623
00:36:31,640 --> 00:36:36,360
these on a weekly basis, but it,
it's always like, you know, you

624
00:36:36,360 --> 00:36:39,520
were there at kind of the
foundation, like there wasn't an

625
00:36:39,520 --> 00:36:43,400
industry for all of these
different things prior to then.

626
00:36:43,400 --> 00:36:47,200
So, you know, while you can sit
and complain about what it's

627
00:36:47,200 --> 00:36:50,920
like to be old, which I do
everyday, you know, I'm also

628
00:36:50,920 --> 00:36:54,920
happy that I was here when
moving lights were created and

629
00:36:54,920 --> 00:36:59,240
when the cell phone first
happened and all of these

630
00:36:59,240 --> 00:37:03,040
different things, personal
computers and the Internet and

631
00:37:03,040 --> 00:37:05,720
all of those things.
You know, I got to see what it

632
00:37:05,720 --> 00:37:09,880
was like before it and then
adapted into my life.

633
00:37:09,880 --> 00:37:15,440
And then you know, sort of, you
know, look back and go, I

634
00:37:15,440 --> 00:37:17,800
remember the days before we had
cell phones and when you

635
00:37:17,800 --> 00:37:19,880
actually got to rest on the
weekend and stuff.

636
00:37:20,400 --> 00:37:24,240
So yeah, I mean, it's great to
have that foundation and that

637
00:37:24,240 --> 00:37:26,600
knowledge and those stories and
history and stuff.

638
00:37:26,600 --> 00:37:28,840
I like it.
Yeah, it's, it's kind of neat

639
00:37:28,840 --> 00:37:32,160
being first generation, you
know, because there was no

640
00:37:32,160 --> 00:37:34,840
playbook.
No one had gone before us, you

641
00:37:34,840 --> 00:37:38,360
know, and, you know, we, we had
to make it up a lot of times

642
00:37:38,360 --> 00:37:42,120
and, and go on the fly.
And, you know, there was a

643
00:37:42,120 --> 00:37:45,360
certain camaraderie.
I remember Jean and Roy Claire

644
00:37:45,360 --> 00:37:49,000
in the early days and being able
to talk to them and just call

645
00:37:49,000 --> 00:37:51,920
them up and have a conversation
with them and, you know, try to

646
00:37:51,920 --> 00:37:55,000
figure things out and, and
people around the country and

647
00:37:55,960 --> 00:37:58,280
they were heady times.
I mean, because you didn't have,

648
00:37:58,640 --> 00:38:01,720
you built all of your own PDS.
You made all of your own cables.

649
00:38:02,000 --> 00:38:03,840
Some built their own speaker
cabinets.

650
00:38:03,840 --> 00:38:06,680
We we mostly, really.
Yeah, most did.

651
00:38:06,680 --> 00:38:09,720
Exactly.
So yeah, it was kind of fun.

652
00:38:09,720 --> 00:38:13,200
Building our cans out of
pineapple, but you know, cans or

653
00:38:13,200 --> 00:38:14,840
whatever like.
Yeah, yeah, right.

654
00:38:14,840 --> 00:38:17,280
Or the the square Robert Roth
Park cans.

655
00:38:17,280 --> 00:38:18,680
I'm sure you know Roth really
well.

656
00:38:18,680 --> 00:38:20,680
I.
Know Robert very well, yeah.

657
00:38:20,680 --> 00:38:22,720
Yeah, yeah.
Well-being in the South?

658
00:38:22,720 --> 00:38:25,520
You have to know, Robert.
Yeah, he and I did our first

659
00:38:25,520 --> 00:38:28,520
show together in 1977.
It was Mother's finest.

660
00:38:28,840 --> 00:38:30,920
Really.
Yes. 77.

661
00:38:30,920 --> 00:38:34,520
Wow. 77, yes.
Yeah, I talked to him a few days

662
00:38:34,520 --> 00:38:36,800
ago about some of the old time
stuff.

663
00:38:36,800 --> 00:38:39,640
Every once in a while we'll get
into some really great old

664
00:38:39,640 --> 00:38:42,080
stories 'cause I love them.
Even when I'm not on a podcast,

665
00:38:42,080 --> 00:38:45,120
I love hearing the old stories
and stuff 'cause this industry,

666
00:38:45,120 --> 00:38:50,920
I didn't get into the industry
until 1990, really 1991.

667
00:38:51,440 --> 00:38:56,400
And you know, prior to that I
was on the music side of things.

668
00:38:57,200 --> 00:39:01,000
And then I moved into, you know,
production or whatever, but I

669
00:39:01,000 --> 00:39:03,120
never did production.
I only I worked for

670
00:39:03,120 --> 00:39:06,120
manufacturers.
So I was sort of once removed

671
00:39:06,120 --> 00:39:07,960
from the road.
You know, I didn't know what it

672
00:39:07,960 --> 00:39:11,360
was like to share a tour bus
with eight other gentlemen.

673
00:39:12,800 --> 00:39:15,200
So not always gentlemanly, by
the way.

674
00:39:15,680 --> 00:39:18,000
Yeah.
But the the Billy Graham thing

675
00:39:18,000 --> 00:39:22,440
was, was really the the start
for you in I don't know what you

676
00:39:22,440 --> 00:39:25,720
call it, ministries or what
would you call it?

677
00:39:25,720 --> 00:39:28,560
Yeah.
Yeah, absolutely.

678
00:39:28,560 --> 00:39:32,440
I mean what we do has a ministry
effect to it.

679
00:39:33,200 --> 00:39:36,400
We like to think, you know, our
ministry is getting the

680
00:39:36,400 --> 00:39:41,240
microphone ready for an A
spokesperson of God to deliver

681
00:39:41,240 --> 00:39:44,520
the gospel.
And that's, that's what we like

682
00:39:44,520 --> 00:39:47,960
to say our ministry is.
Yeah, it was found.

683
00:39:48,160 --> 00:39:50,840
It was foundational.
Yes, it was very foundational

684
00:39:51,160 --> 00:39:57,520
early on for a lot of us, Jeff,
myself, Bogey and my family.

685
00:39:58,080 --> 00:40:03,000
Yeah, but but you went on to do
stuff for Joyce and and Joel and

686
00:40:03,400 --> 00:40:07,360
some of the biggest, like not
even arguably the biggest, but

687
00:40:07,360 --> 00:40:12,600
the biggest in in what they did.
Well, I, you know, I like to say

688
00:40:12,600 --> 00:40:16,880
that, you know, hoodie put the
rock in SES, but Joyce put the

689
00:40:16,880 --> 00:40:22,320
soul in SES and she she's, she's
my favorite lady.

690
00:40:22,320 --> 00:40:26,560
She really is.
She's she, she's what a what?

691
00:40:26,560 --> 00:40:30,280
A gift from God she is, yes.
I don't know much about her.

692
00:40:30,280 --> 00:40:33,520
I mean, I've certainly seen a
couple of videos and stuff, but

693
00:40:33,520 --> 00:40:36,720
I don't know much about her.
You know, Joel, obviously

694
00:40:36,720 --> 00:40:40,320
everyone knows about Joel and,
and certainly Billy Graham.

695
00:40:40,320 --> 00:40:44,160
That's kind of what I grew up on
more than more than the others.

696
00:40:44,160 --> 00:40:48,800
But is there something like,
other than the obvious stuff

697
00:40:48,800 --> 00:40:51,400
where, yes, your people maybe
need to be cleaned up a little

698
00:40:51,400 --> 00:40:54,640
bit and need to watch their
language and, and all of that,

699
00:40:54,880 --> 00:40:57,920
is there anything else wildly
different about doing those

700
00:40:57,920 --> 00:41:01,920
types of shows and events
versus, you know, the rest?

701
00:41:01,920 --> 00:41:04,800
Festivals, Rock'n'roll.
In corner.

702
00:41:05,680 --> 00:41:07,960
Initially I thought there were,
there was.

703
00:41:08,440 --> 00:41:13,640
And I remember calling, and I'll
call him out by name, my dear

704
00:41:13,640 --> 00:41:16,240
friend Ken Porter over at
Spectrum Sound in Nashville.

705
00:41:17,560 --> 00:41:22,280
I remember in 1998, I called him
up and I said, you know, I'm

706
00:41:22,280 --> 00:41:24,440
just going to do Christian work
from now on.

707
00:41:25,760 --> 00:41:29,680
And he came over to see me
because Kenny was doing a lot of

708
00:41:29,680 --> 00:41:32,880
Christian work before.
I was like Promise Keepers and,

709
00:41:33,160 --> 00:41:35,200
and, and a lot of, a lot of
work.

710
00:41:35,280 --> 00:41:39,560
And he and Beverly became
friends with Lynn and me.

711
00:41:39,560 --> 00:41:41,360
And it's, it's been a great
friendship.

712
00:41:41,360 --> 00:41:46,280
But he came over and he said,
Jim, if you only do work for

713
00:41:46,280 --> 00:41:50,480
Christians, how are you going to
be an effective disciple?

714
00:41:51,680 --> 00:41:57,520
I said OK, and he said besides
going broke, which you will,

715
00:41:57,680 --> 00:42:02,600
you're not going to be doing
what you have been asked to do,

716
00:42:02,640 --> 00:42:07,240
which is be a disciple.
And I thought, you know, he's

717
00:42:07,240 --> 00:42:13,720
got a point there and for a man
to take his time and come 7

718
00:42:13,720 --> 00:42:18,240
hours and tell me that face to
face and talk me through that.

719
00:42:18,720 --> 00:42:20,960
Oh, I've, I've never forgotten
that.

720
00:42:20,960 --> 00:42:24,960
And, and I give him credit for
not only that, but for

721
00:42:24,960 --> 00:42:29,440
discipling me or mentoring me
through a lot of the early on

722
00:42:29,440 --> 00:42:32,360
Christian work that I did.
We would see, we would see each

723
00:42:32,360 --> 00:42:35,480
other often because he often
supported the Billy Graham

724
00:42:35,480 --> 00:42:38,000
events.
You know, he, he, he, he being a

725
00:42:38,000 --> 00:42:40,880
gear head, a lot of times had
the gear that we didn't have.

726
00:42:40,880 --> 00:42:43,560
So he he would always come out
but but.

727
00:42:43,560 --> 00:42:46,360
It's funny when when you told me
he jumped in his car and drove

728
00:42:46,360 --> 00:42:49,240
out, I thought you were gonna
say he sat in front of you and

729
00:42:49,240 --> 00:42:51,880
said, Jim, have you lost your
damn mind you?

730
00:42:55,200 --> 00:42:58,040
Know, but he might say that
today if you ask him if I've

731
00:42:58,040 --> 00:43:00,080
lost my mind.
He probably said that, but in a

732
00:43:00,080 --> 00:43:03,920
much kinder and gentler way.
You know, like you need to, you

733
00:43:03,920 --> 00:43:08,440
need to, you know, follow your
calling here, which I think you

734
00:43:08,440 --> 00:43:12,880
know from the stories you tell.
Like it, it, it was a, a, a bit

735
00:43:12,880 --> 00:43:16,080
of a jagged line, but it was a
relatively linear line.

736
00:43:16,080 --> 00:43:19,560
Like it, it was, you know, this
is the stuff I want to do.

737
00:43:19,560 --> 00:43:23,400
And things kept distracting you
like the Navy and like this and

738
00:43:23,400 --> 00:43:26,680
like this and like whatever.
But it, you know, that's how

739
00:43:26,680 --> 00:43:28,640
life goes.
I mean, it's not perfectly

740
00:43:28,640 --> 00:43:31,680
linear, unfortunately.
You know, it's not like, OK,

741
00:43:31,680 --> 00:43:35,120
here's where I am and I'm going
to go exactly right over there

742
00:43:35,520 --> 00:43:38,280
and I'm just going to take the
shortest path to get there.

743
00:43:38,360 --> 00:43:40,280
That just doesn't happen, you
know?

744
00:43:40,760 --> 00:43:43,600
Well, I don't think anyone can
accuse me of having lived my

745
00:43:43,600 --> 00:43:46,800
life in a bubble so.
No, no, no.

746
00:43:46,800 --> 00:43:49,480
You've done some stuff.
You've done some stuff.

747
00:43:49,480 --> 00:43:53,120
So where do I go from here?
There's so many different

748
00:43:53,120 --> 00:43:55,240
directions.
So, you know, one of the things

749
00:43:55,240 --> 00:44:00,440
that I really love fast
forwarding a whole bunch is this

750
00:44:00,440 --> 00:44:05,960
concert stuff, you know, and I
actually had, I had chance on

751
00:44:05,960 --> 00:44:08,280
the podcast recently and we
talked a little bit about the

752
00:44:08,280 --> 00:44:12,320
name because I love the name.
Well, what do you sell concert

753
00:44:12,320 --> 00:44:15,800
stuff?
I mean, it's like it's obvious,

754
00:44:15,800 --> 00:44:18,040
right?
Did he tell you how we got to

755
00:44:18,040 --> 00:44:20,320
that name?
I don't remember, but I want to

756
00:44:20,320 --> 00:44:24,720
hear your version of it anyways.
So when Michael came to work for

757
00:44:24,720 --> 00:44:28,600
me, you know, he, he took on the
role of not only being an

758
00:44:28,880 --> 00:44:32,560
account Rep and, and learning
about the business, but he also

759
00:44:32,560 --> 00:44:35,880
took on the social media role in
the websites and all of that.

760
00:44:35,880 --> 00:44:38,720
And he came in one day and
convinced me that we needed to

761
00:44:38,720 --> 00:44:44,280
hire a marketing guy.
I said, OK, fine, go out and you

762
00:44:44,280 --> 00:44:47,560
know, go to Appalachian or High
Point or one of the colleges and

763
00:44:47,560 --> 00:44:51,280
get you a graduate and interview
him and get a couple of

764
00:44:51,280 --> 00:44:54,000
candidates and we'll make the
best one.

765
00:44:54,200 --> 00:44:55,080
Yeah.
Yeah.

766
00:44:55,080 --> 00:45:00,000
So we do that and he hires, he
gets it down to two guys and he

767
00:45:00,000 --> 00:45:02,000
hires the one.
I told him not to, of course.

768
00:45:02,320 --> 00:45:08,880
But then we're a year into this
and I'm just not seeing results

769
00:45:08,880 --> 00:45:12,280
that I think I should see.
And so I walked down the hall

770
00:45:12,280 --> 00:45:15,760
one day and I called Michael
into his office at the young

771
00:45:15,760 --> 00:45:18,760
man's office.
And I'm I'm ranting and raving

772
00:45:18,760 --> 00:45:23,320
about you guys have been on this
for a year and the web, the

773
00:45:23,320 --> 00:45:26,120
website stink, the social media
stinks.

774
00:45:26,120 --> 00:45:28,760
I mean, we're not getting
penetration here.

775
00:45:28,760 --> 00:45:30,400
What the hell are you guys
doing?

776
00:45:30,400 --> 00:45:35,600
You know, and, and he looks up
at me and says, well, what would

777
00:45:35,600 --> 00:45:38,440
you do?
I said I would create a portal

778
00:45:39,000 --> 00:45:44,320
that you could go to with one
click and see everything we have

779
00:45:44,320 --> 00:45:46,880
going on.
I said, you can do that.

780
00:45:46,880 --> 00:45:48,840
You got technology to do that,
right?

781
00:45:49,280 --> 00:45:51,600
He said, well, what would you
call that?

782
00:45:52,040 --> 00:45:55,480
I said concert stuff because
that wasn't what we did.

783
00:45:55,480 --> 00:45:58,280
It was that organic, huh?
That, that was that organic.

784
00:45:58,280 --> 00:46:00,240
It just came right off the top
of my mind.

785
00:46:00,240 --> 00:46:01,800
You know, I said it's, it's
stuff.

786
00:46:01,920 --> 00:46:04,320
It's concert stuff.
We'll call it concert stuff.

787
00:46:04,920 --> 00:46:06,480
And that's how that's how it
happened.

788
00:46:06,480 --> 00:46:09,040
That's hilarious.
So you went and incorporated

789
00:46:09,040 --> 00:46:11,320
concert stuff and that became
the holding company?

790
00:46:11,600 --> 00:46:14,680
Well, we, we, we first
incorporated, we, we got the

791
00:46:14,680 --> 00:46:18,120
name and we just, we're going to
use it as a marketing tool.

792
00:46:18,600 --> 00:46:22,000
You know, it's remarkable, Jim,
that Concert Stuff Group was

793
00:46:22,000 --> 00:46:25,560
available as a name.
It it it is, you know, kind of

794
00:46:25,560 --> 00:46:30,800
joking, but this but this was
probably 2015 or 16.

795
00:46:30,800 --> 00:46:33,480
And I turned the mic on I said
go in there and see if we can

796
00:46:33,480 --> 00:46:37,360
get that name And he 5 minutes
later, yeah, we got it GoDaddy

797
00:46:37,360 --> 00:46:38,920
bam done.
I said OK great.

798
00:46:39,360 --> 00:46:42,600
So it kind of set there for a
long time.

799
00:46:43,120 --> 00:46:48,400
Coming out of the pandemic, we
were approached by several

800
00:46:48,400 --> 00:46:53,040
private equity groups and coming
out of the pandemic, I, I was

801
00:46:53,040 --> 00:46:56,080
scared, quite frankly.
You know, here I, here I am a

802
00:46:56,080 --> 00:46:57,960
little bit, yeah, we all were
here.

803
00:46:58,320 --> 00:47:01,800
Here I am.
We're, I'm approaching 70 and

804
00:47:01,920 --> 00:47:05,240
I've got all these employees.
I've got my family.

805
00:47:05,760 --> 00:47:09,080
I don't have an exit strategy.
I don't have a plan.

806
00:47:09,360 --> 00:47:12,560
Maybe we should do this.
Maybe we should just sell to

807
00:47:12,560 --> 00:47:15,800
private equity.
So this one company came in and

808
00:47:15,800 --> 00:47:20,360
they took a look at everything
and they said we want to buy

809
00:47:20,360 --> 00:47:25,040
concert stuff.
I said, well, that's just a

810
00:47:25,040 --> 00:47:27,440
marketing term.
No, no, no, no, no.

811
00:47:27,560 --> 00:47:31,920
We want to buy all the companies
and we want to call it concert

812
00:47:31,920 --> 00:47:36,000
stuff.
I said, OK, how would that work?

813
00:47:36,120 --> 00:47:38,960
Well, we just fold them into one
holding company.

814
00:47:39,080 --> 00:47:43,280
We create, you know, shared
services at the top, which

815
00:47:43,280 --> 00:47:46,200
includes accounting,
consolidated financial

816
00:47:46,200 --> 00:47:48,280
statements, all this PE talk,
right.

817
00:47:48,520 --> 00:47:51,840
And they and they try to
convince you that you're broken,

818
00:47:51,880 --> 00:47:54,080
but they're there to fix you.
Yeah, yeah.

819
00:47:54,080 --> 00:47:58,880
And so, so you know, we, we bit
into it for a moment and we did

820
00:47:58,880 --> 00:48:02,320
about a year of due diligence
and got right up to the altar

821
00:48:02,320 --> 00:48:05,560
and said I don't think so.
Good for you.

822
00:48:06,000 --> 00:48:08,880
But maybe we'll do this
ourselves.

823
00:48:09,280 --> 00:48:11,840
Yeah, and.
Thanks for the idea.

824
00:48:12,040 --> 00:48:13,640
Yeah, thanks for the idea,
right.

825
00:48:14,520 --> 00:48:18,160
I mean, you know, you're sitting
in these meetings and they bring

826
00:48:18,160 --> 00:48:22,120
in like their marketing people
and you're trying to explain to

827
00:48:22,120 --> 00:48:25,320
them who you are and what you do
and they don't get it.

828
00:48:25,720 --> 00:48:29,760
They bring in their IT people
and their IT people are used to

829
00:48:29,760 --> 00:48:34,880
creating parts list for some job
or somewhere and they don't get

830
00:48:34,880 --> 00:48:38,240
what you do.
And they kept bringing in people

831
00:48:38,240 --> 00:48:43,160
that didn't get it and finally
in frustration said, you know,

832
00:48:43,400 --> 00:48:47,360
these guys don't get it.
And we're not as broken as they

833
00:48:47,360 --> 00:48:50,960
say we are.
We just need a little help in

834
00:48:50,960 --> 00:48:53,000
certain areas.
And so we went out and hired

835
00:48:53,680 --> 00:48:57,000
some good advisors and we put it
together.

836
00:48:57,000 --> 00:49:01,560
And the very banking
organization that had given the

837
00:49:02,200 --> 00:49:06,680
private equity Group A term
sheet called us afterwards when

838
00:49:06,680 --> 00:49:10,560
we said no to the deal and now
they ended up having our credit

839
00:49:10,560 --> 00:49:13,160
facility and doing it and do all
our stuff for.

840
00:49:13,160 --> 00:49:16,000
Us so they just invested
directly into you as opposed to

841
00:49:16,000 --> 00:49:19,280
becoming a partner in the
exactly yeah.

842
00:49:19,640 --> 00:49:20,880
So it, so it's worked out
pretty.

843
00:49:20,880 --> 00:49:23,760
It's been painful.
Yeah, it's been, it's been very.

844
00:49:23,760 --> 00:49:24,760
Painful.
It always is.

845
00:49:25,000 --> 00:49:27,040
You know, I don't care what
business you're in.

846
00:49:27,040 --> 00:49:31,560
I don't care what you're, you
know, it always business people

847
00:49:31,560 --> 00:49:33,920
think it's easy.
You know, people think that, you

848
00:49:33,920 --> 00:49:37,600
know, oh, you're so lucky, Jim.
You know, again, they think that

849
00:49:37,600 --> 00:49:40,880
it was a linear line from
poverty to to riches.

850
00:49:41,200 --> 00:49:44,360
And you never had a a headache
at any.

851
00:49:44,360 --> 00:49:47,960
Point in there.
Yeah, I, I spent the first half

852
00:49:47,960 --> 00:49:52,840
of my life learning how to do
the business and I've spent the

853
00:49:52,840 --> 00:49:56,200
second-half of my life learning
how to run the business.

854
00:49:56,680 --> 00:49:58,960
Yeah.
When you go from

855
00:49:59,160 --> 00:50:03,680
entrepreneurship to
intentionality and trying to

856
00:50:03,680 --> 00:50:07,360
create, you know, it's, it's no
wonder that nine, what 97% of

857
00:50:07,360 --> 00:50:11,320
entrepreneurs fail at converting
or taking the next level or

858
00:50:11,320 --> 00:50:13,840
converting their business.
It's it's difficult.

859
00:50:13,920 --> 00:50:14,560
It's.
Just.

860
00:50:14,560 --> 00:50:17,280
Extremely difficult.
You know, I've been an

861
00:50:17,280 --> 00:50:21,520
entrepreneur for, for basically
most of my career.

862
00:50:21,520 --> 00:50:24,880
I, I was an entrepreneur when I
worked for, for big companies,

863
00:50:25,160 --> 00:50:30,120
But you know, like you said,
when you go from, I forget the

864
00:50:30,120 --> 00:50:32,720
exact term you said, but from
being an entrepreneur to being

865
00:50:32,720 --> 00:50:34,600
more intentional, I think is
what you said.

866
00:50:35,240 --> 00:50:38,280
I'm still trying to do that.
And I've owned one company for

867
00:50:38,280 --> 00:50:41,560
23 years and I've started some
other ones along the way.

868
00:50:42,040 --> 00:50:46,080
And, you know, it just seems to
always change and you need to

869
00:50:46,080 --> 00:50:50,400
adapt to that change.
And I'm always growth minded and

870
00:50:50,400 --> 00:50:53,320
always very entrepreneurial.
So I'm always looking for ways,

871
00:50:53,320 --> 00:50:55,480
well, if we've got to change,
how can we make it better?

872
00:50:55,480 --> 00:50:57,320
How can we make it better?
I'm gonna make it better.

873
00:50:57,720 --> 00:51:03,040
And, you know, as you get older,
it's hard work, it's tiring.

874
00:51:03,040 --> 00:51:06,560
It's, you know, like I this
weekend, everybody I knew had

875
00:51:06,560 --> 00:51:11,920
fun and I worked probably 24
hours this weekend between

876
00:51:11,920 --> 00:51:15,560
Saturday and Sunday, you know,
because I've got a lot of stuff

877
00:51:15,560 --> 00:51:18,480
going on right now and much of
it flows through me.

878
00:51:18,480 --> 00:51:22,880
So, you know, it's, it's
something, it's a love hate

879
00:51:22,880 --> 00:51:25,640
relationship for me because I
love everything I do.

880
00:51:25,640 --> 00:51:28,720
I love why I do it.
I love who I do it for me.

881
00:51:29,200 --> 00:51:33,000
And you know, I love guiding and
leading A-Team.

882
00:51:33,360 --> 00:51:36,560
But at the same time, sometimes
you just go, I'm exhausted, you

883
00:51:37,200 --> 00:51:39,720
know, I really do.
I wish somebody could come and

884
00:51:39,720 --> 00:51:44,400
give me a hall pass so I could
take 30 days and just go relax

885
00:51:44,400 --> 00:51:46,680
somewhere in the jungle.
I don't care where it is.

886
00:51:47,440 --> 00:51:50,760
But that hasn't come.
Yeah, I, I, I remember, you

887
00:51:50,760 --> 00:51:53,400
know, 911 was a pivotal point
for us.

888
00:51:53,400 --> 00:51:56,160
And that's when I decided I
better figure out how to start

889
00:51:56,720 --> 00:51:59,920
to, to figure out how to run
these businesses rather than

890
00:51:59,920 --> 00:52:02,880
just do them.
And, you know, I, I was a

891
00:52:02,880 --> 00:52:05,280
sponge.
I would read books by Peter

892
00:52:05,280 --> 00:52:09,000
Drucker, Jack Welch, anyone I
could get my hands on.

893
00:52:09,000 --> 00:52:13,200
And, and over the years, I've
still continued to, to read and

894
00:52:13,200 --> 00:52:18,440
try to excerpt the little things
from the reading to get beyond

895
00:52:18,440 --> 00:52:21,360
all the crap, but, you know, get
down to the Nuggets.

896
00:52:21,360 --> 00:52:23,280
Yeah.
And and, and figure that out.

897
00:52:23,280 --> 00:52:26,000
And one thing I read about a
month ago, which I've been

898
00:52:26,000 --> 00:52:30,320
trying to put in practice, which
is the most productive time of

899
00:52:30,320 --> 00:52:32,880
your day are going to be the
first couple of hours of the

900
00:52:32,880 --> 00:52:36,320
morning.
And after that your, your

901
00:52:36,320 --> 00:52:41,600
ability to process and to take
in and retain and, and, and

902
00:52:41,600 --> 00:52:44,480
process information rapidly
diminishes.

903
00:52:44,480 --> 00:52:47,440
And an hour, four and five, it's
like falling off a Cliff.

904
00:52:47,440 --> 00:52:50,640
Because you go from controlling
your day to being controlled by

905
00:52:50,640 --> 00:52:52,600
your day.
Exactly, Yeah.

906
00:52:52,760 --> 00:52:55,720
And once e-mail.
Mental people, your mental

907
00:52:55,720 --> 00:52:58,560
capacity just diminishes along
the way, you know?

908
00:52:58,560 --> 00:53:03,760
So I've made a conscious effort
to, hey, at around 3:30, I'm

909
00:53:03,760 --> 00:53:08,400
looking to really dial it back.
And once we get to like 5, I'm

910
00:53:08,400 --> 00:53:12,200
ready for that first nice glass
of Cabernet because I'm not

911
00:53:12,200 --> 00:53:15,640
taking anyone's phone call after
5.

912
00:53:15,760 --> 00:53:18,960
If it's an emergency, I may talk
to them up to six.

913
00:53:18,960 --> 00:53:22,440
But at six, it's just me, the
wife and the cab.

914
00:53:22,720 --> 00:53:24,240
Good for you.
Good for you.

915
00:53:24,240 --> 00:53:27,040
That's that's perfect.
You know I will give you 1

916
00:53:27,400 --> 00:53:29,000
pointer if you're not already
doing it.

917
00:53:29,000 --> 00:53:34,720
Are you using AI at all yet?
So we, my wife and my daughter

918
00:53:34,720 --> 00:53:41,840
have gotten me into some AI and
some chat and, you know, putting

919
00:53:41,840 --> 00:53:45,320
together some things like that.
So and I, I was reading up on

920
00:53:45,320 --> 00:53:48,080
you and I hear that that's where
you're getting ready to take

921
00:53:48,080 --> 00:53:50,360
part of your business as well.
And I did.

922
00:53:50,360 --> 00:53:52,000
Maybe you can help me out with
that.

923
00:53:52,120 --> 00:53:55,120
Yeah.
No, no, I'm I'm so by the way,

924
00:53:55,120 --> 00:53:57,880
Ioffer basically free lessons to
people.

925
00:53:57,880 --> 00:54:01,440
I put it on my LinkedIn and I
said, anyone in our industry, if

926
00:54:01,440 --> 00:54:04,560
I, it can help you because our
industry is very against AI.

927
00:54:04,720 --> 00:54:07,520
Yeah, some reasons are good
reasons.

928
00:54:07,560 --> 00:54:11,280
You know, AI is not friendly to
creatives because it's, that's

929
00:54:11,280 --> 00:54:12,400
right.
And it's not.

930
00:54:12,960 --> 00:54:16,400
Here's my take on it.
It's not replacing creatives,

931
00:54:16,400 --> 00:54:18,680
it's augmenting creatives who
use it.

932
00:54:19,080 --> 00:54:21,600
And so what's going to happen is
you're not going to lose your

933
00:54:21,600 --> 00:54:25,280
design job to AI.
You're gonna lose your design

934
00:54:25,280 --> 00:54:27,520
job to a designer who's using
AI.

935
00:54:27,760 --> 00:54:31,000
That's right.
And because it makes you, it

936
00:54:31,000 --> 00:54:33,160
gives you super powers is really
what it does.

937
00:54:33,360 --> 00:54:34,720
So I'll give you 1 quick
pointer.

938
00:54:34,720 --> 00:54:37,840
So you talked about books and
you said reading books to get

939
00:54:37,840 --> 00:54:39,680
those Nuggets in the books,
right?

940
00:54:40,080 --> 00:54:44,440
And I do the same because if you
like, I know some people who

941
00:54:44,440 --> 00:54:48,640
have read a book or a system or
a model, a business, you know,

942
00:54:48,640 --> 00:54:52,440
like, let's say you read what's
it called winning from Jack

943
00:54:52,440 --> 00:54:56,600
Wells.
If you just went verbatim and

944
00:54:56,600 --> 00:54:59,240
did everything he told you to
do, you'd fail miserably.

945
00:54:59,720 --> 00:55:03,760
But but you take the Nuggets out
of it that matter to you.

946
00:55:04,120 --> 00:55:09,160
And so with AI, when you start
creating, like even ChatGPT,

947
00:55:09,160 --> 00:55:13,960
when you start creating your
little realm inside ChatGPT so

948
00:55:13,960 --> 00:55:16,360
that it, it knows you.
And by the way, you do that by

949
00:55:16,360 --> 00:55:18,280
putting a lot of information in
about you.

950
00:55:18,280 --> 00:55:19,960
Here's who I am, here's who I'm
not.

951
00:55:20,160 --> 00:55:22,320
Here's my resume.
Here's some of the things I've

952
00:55:22,320 --> 00:55:23,640
done.
Here's some writing that I've

953
00:55:23,640 --> 00:55:24,840
done.
Here's my blog.

954
00:55:24,840 --> 00:55:29,160
Here's like you give it as much
information as you possibly can.

955
00:55:29,160 --> 00:55:31,880
Here's my wedding photos.
Here's everything about me, you

956
00:55:31,880 --> 00:55:35,320
know.
And so now that it knows you,

957
00:55:36,240 --> 00:55:40,800
what you do is you say, I'm
interested in reading Jack Welch

958
00:55:40,800 --> 00:55:45,080
winning, but I don't have time.
So knowing who I am and what is

959
00:55:45,080 --> 00:55:49,120
most important to me, give me
the 10 takeaways that I'm going

960
00:55:49,120 --> 00:55:53,920
to get from that book.
And you won't believe what it

961
00:55:53,920 --> 00:55:56,360
gives you next.
You know, you won't believe the

962
00:55:56,360 --> 00:55:58,080
10 things that it tells you
next.

963
00:55:58,360 --> 00:56:00,280
You'll just be like, it just
saved you.

964
00:56:00,560 --> 00:56:03,720
And so that sounds kind of
shallow that it saved me the

965
00:56:03,720 --> 00:56:06,200
time from reading the book
'cause I happen to like Jack,

966
00:56:06,280 --> 00:56:09,040
Jack Welch and I love that book
winning if that's the one you're

967
00:56:09,040 --> 00:56:13,840
talking about.
But so, you know, but like, The

968
00:56:13,840 --> 00:56:17,040
thing is, when you just need a
quick fix and you want it from

969
00:56:17,040 --> 00:56:19,240
that book, it really does give
it to you.

970
00:56:19,280 --> 00:56:21,360
And, you know, I'll give you
another example.

971
00:56:21,360 --> 00:56:26,080
So, you know, I'm looking to
hire a fractional CFO right now

972
00:56:26,080 --> 00:56:28,760
because we're in, we're in the
process of doing a raise and,

973
00:56:28,760 --> 00:56:31,640
and we're, you know, because
I've created an AI company and a

974
00:56:31,640 --> 00:56:34,480
lot of things going on and I'm
still hurting from COVID, to be

975
00:56:34,480 --> 00:56:37,400
perfectly honest, my, my
business is different than other

976
00:56:37,400 --> 00:56:40,680
businesses.
And so we're doing the first

977
00:56:40,680 --> 00:56:43,840
time ever in my life that I've
ever raised or took on, you

978
00:56:43,840 --> 00:56:46,680
know, loans and debt or
whatever, any of those things.

979
00:56:47,200 --> 00:56:51,760
So, you know, one of the things
I need is I really need a smart

980
00:56:51,760 --> 00:56:56,280
financial partner at the table.
And we don't need a CFO.

981
00:56:56,280 --> 00:57:00,000
Our company's too small and, and
uncomplicated in a sense for a

982
00:57:00,000 --> 00:57:03,000
CFO, but a fractional CFO.
Perfect.

983
00:57:03,440 --> 00:57:07,160
And so I've gotten a lot of
guidance from people and from AI

984
00:57:07,160 --> 00:57:10,600
about this.
So I put a post on my LinkedIn

985
00:57:10,600 --> 00:57:14,880
just a few days ago saying I'm
looking to hire a fractional

986
00:57:14,880 --> 00:57:16,640
CFO.
Here's sort of what we need,

987
00:57:16,640 --> 00:57:18,120
here's what it's for, blah,
blah, blah.

988
00:57:18,720 --> 00:57:22,200
And so LinkedIn said, would you
like to turn this into a job

989
00:57:22,200 --> 00:57:25,200
post?
And I went, right, OK, why not

990
00:57:25,200 --> 00:57:27,040
sure.
And so I said, yes.

991
00:57:27,040 --> 00:57:30,680
So AI in LinkedIn created the
job post and I went, well,

992
00:57:30,680 --> 00:57:32,960
that's pretty remarkable.
That's pretty much exactly what

993
00:57:32,960 --> 00:57:35,640
we're looking for.
And so I said, OK, great.

994
00:57:35,680 --> 00:57:38,800
And it said would you like to
promote this job post?

995
00:57:38,800 --> 00:57:40,680
And I said, Nope, I'm not
spending any money.

996
00:57:40,680 --> 00:57:43,160
I don't want to promote this.
Oh, well, we'll give you a free

997
00:57:43,160 --> 00:57:46,000
$100 credit to start promoting
your job post.

998
00:57:46,720 --> 00:57:49,880
OK, sure.
And so now I've got a free

999
00:57:49,880 --> 00:57:53,400
promoted job post and I'm happy.
I'm thinking, you know, within a

1000
00:57:53,400 --> 00:57:55,640
couple weeks I'll get some good
applicants.

1001
00:57:56,400 --> 00:58:00,200
Within a few hours, I had 250
applicants for this.

1002
00:58:00,280 --> 00:58:04,200
For this, because it's remote,
you know, you can be anywhere in

1003
00:58:04,200 --> 00:58:07,280
the world literally because it's
fully remote.

1004
00:58:07,760 --> 00:58:11,480
It's in a fun business, it's
technology based, it's moving

1005
00:58:11,480 --> 00:58:13,760
fast, it's right at the point of
a raise.

1006
00:58:13,760 --> 00:58:16,280
So a lot of people want to get
in at that moment because they

1007
00:58:16,280 --> 00:58:17,800
think there's going to be good
opportunity.

1008
00:58:17,800 --> 00:58:20,480
So I had 250 applicants right
away.

1009
00:58:21,200 --> 00:58:25,440
It's just me reviewing these
applicants and I've got so much

1010
00:58:25,440 --> 00:58:30,080
on my plate right now.
And So what do I do?

1011
00:58:30,080 --> 00:58:35,440
I download the 250 resumes that
came in and put them into Chachi

1012
00:58:35,440 --> 00:58:38,000
PT.
And I said, based on what you

1013
00:58:38,000 --> 00:58:41,760
know about the role, about the
raise, about our businesses,

1014
00:58:41,760 --> 00:58:47,840
about my style of management, I
want you to choose the best 20

1015
00:58:47,840 --> 00:58:52,920
applicants from all of these and
tell me why each one is the

1016
00:58:52,920 --> 00:58:57,320
best.
And, and then I'm going to

1017
00:58:57,360 --> 00:58:59,920
create, I'm going to set up
interviews for those 20

1018
00:58:59,920 --> 00:59:01,840
applicants.
And I want you to help me with

1019
00:59:01,840 --> 00:59:06,720
the interview questions for each
one based on who that person is

1020
00:59:06,800 --> 00:59:09,240
to our business.
You wouldn't believe what it

1021
00:59:09,240 --> 00:59:11,720
gave me next.
I mean, it's just unbelievable.

1022
00:59:11,720 --> 00:59:16,000
So it really like, I'm not
saying you should use AI to

1023
00:59:16,000 --> 00:59:17,520
write all your emails or
anything.

1024
00:59:17,520 --> 00:59:22,320
People go to the sort of lowest
a possible scenario that you

1025
00:59:22,320 --> 00:59:26,200
could use it to replace you in
the tasks that you don't like.

1026
00:59:27,040 --> 00:59:29,120
Yeah, you can do some of that,
but that's not where you're

1027
00:59:29,120 --> 00:59:31,280
going to get the best value.
You're going to get the best

1028
00:59:31,280 --> 00:59:35,120
value by who is Jim Brammer?
What's he really good at?

1029
00:59:35,120 --> 00:59:39,880
What's he really smart with?
And let's augment that with this

1030
00:59:39,880 --> 00:59:43,920
new AI solution or assistant
that he brings on board.

1031
00:59:44,720 --> 00:59:47,400
The other thing is sometimes
you're just sitting there at

1032
00:59:47,400 --> 00:59:50,760
9:00 at night with your head and
your hands at your desk going,

1033
00:59:51,000 --> 00:59:53,280
what am I going to do to solve
this problem?

1034
00:59:53,520 --> 00:59:58,200
How am I going to fix this?
You now have a combination of

1035
00:59:58,200 --> 01:00:01,920
the smartest lawyers, doctors,
medical professionals,

1036
01:00:02,560 --> 01:00:06,520
philosophers, artists,
musicians, whatever you want.

1037
01:00:06,720 --> 01:00:09,400
They're all in the room at the
same time ready to give you

1038
01:00:09,400 --> 01:00:12,520
their best answers.
And so that's how I use it.

1039
01:00:13,120 --> 01:00:15,600
Well, you've certainly sold me
on it and you and I are going to

1040
01:00:15,600 --> 01:00:17,840
be talking later on.
Anytime, anytime.

1041
01:00:17,920 --> 01:00:25,040
And you bring up LinkedIn before
the pandemic, 2015, 2016, I set

1042
01:00:25,040 --> 01:00:28,360
out looking for a fractional
CFO, okay?

1043
01:00:28,760 --> 01:00:32,720
And I went to LinkedIn and
bought the job posting.

1044
01:00:32,840 --> 01:00:35,520
I think it's like 500 bucks.
You're you're way richer than

1045
01:00:35,520 --> 01:00:39,120
me, so you can afford that.
But but this was before check

1046
01:00:39,120 --> 01:00:40,440
GPT, right?
Yeah, yeah.

1047
01:00:40,440 --> 01:00:45,400
So I 87 applicants and I'm
sitting there all by myself

1048
01:00:45,400 --> 01:00:47,400
thinking, golly, how am I going
to do this?

1049
01:00:47,400 --> 01:00:49,760
But I got them down to six.
Yeah.

1050
01:00:50,000 --> 01:00:53,760
And the one thing I learned then
was, and you and you have great

1051
01:00:53,760 --> 01:00:56,480
instincts as well.
You you wouldn't have succeeded

1052
01:00:56,480 --> 01:00:59,880
as an entrepreneur this long
without great instincts and

1053
01:00:59,880 --> 01:01:01,480
survive.
And sometimes, yeah.

1054
01:01:01,480 --> 01:01:04,040
And sometimes you just got to
trust those instincts, right?

1055
01:01:04,040 --> 01:01:08,080
Yeah.
Out of those 87 people, one kept

1056
01:01:08,080 --> 01:01:12,200
sticking out, one kept sticking
out, and we got down to six and

1057
01:01:12,200 --> 01:01:15,440
that one kept sticking out.
And that was the first one I

1058
01:01:15,440 --> 01:01:18,840
physically interviewed and flew
her in.

1059
01:01:19,160 --> 01:01:24,000
And the price was double what I
was expecting.

1060
01:01:25,520 --> 01:01:31,600
And so I interviewed the whole 6
and I went back to #2 yeah,

1061
01:01:31,840 --> 01:01:34,880
which was exactly where my
budget was.

1062
01:01:35,000 --> 01:01:40,280
Yeah.
And I offered him a job and he

1063
01:01:40,280 --> 01:01:45,520
had to finish out a job in South
Carolina, and six weeks or so he

1064
01:01:45,520 --> 01:01:50,520
was going to be moving to
Winston Salem three weeks into

1065
01:01:50,520 --> 01:01:53,080
it.
It just ate me alive that I

1066
01:01:53,080 --> 01:01:56,800
couldn't get who I really.
Yeah, the number one, yeah.

1067
01:01:56,800 --> 01:02:00,800
That I couldn't get the number
one and I decided that rather

1068
01:02:00,800 --> 01:02:06,080
than settle for #2 I would just
suffer through another year and

1069
01:02:06,080 --> 01:02:10,240
try to figure out how to raise
the money to hire #1 and so I

1070
01:02:10,240 --> 01:02:12,520
had to call him and withdraw the
offer.

1071
01:02:12,680 --> 01:02:15,320
But I ultimately got to hire
number 10.

1072
01:02:15,640 --> 01:02:17,040
Good.
And then the, and then the

1073
01:02:17,040 --> 01:02:20,240
pandemic came.
But then after that we started

1074
01:02:20,240 --> 01:02:23,000
to re engage.
But then the whole PE deal came

1075
01:02:23,000 --> 01:02:25,760
up and now I have a full time
CFO.

1076
01:02:26,040 --> 01:02:28,960
Yeah, it all works the same.
Person, it's a different.

1077
01:02:29,040 --> 01:02:31,480
Number one, you know, yeah,
yeah, you mentioned, you

1078
01:02:31,480 --> 01:02:33,800
mentioned that Jack Welch, I
think his first book, it was

1079
01:02:33,800 --> 01:02:35,880
Straight from the Gut by Jack
Welch.

1080
01:02:35,880 --> 01:02:38,280
Yeah, I didn't read that one.
And that was back in the 80s.

1081
01:02:38,280 --> 01:02:41,680
And, and the one nugget I took
away from Jack was the early

1082
01:02:41,680 --> 01:02:44,880
days of GE when he was building
into a powerhouse.

1083
01:02:45,000 --> 01:02:49,320
He had every one of his
divisional managers to assess

1084
01:02:49,600 --> 01:02:53,640
and fire the weakest 10% of
their department every year.

1085
01:02:54,240 --> 01:02:58,880
And I, I said, well, I certainly
can't do that SES, but I have a

1086
01:02:58,880 --> 01:03:00,880
problem in the trucking
department.

1087
01:03:01,560 --> 01:03:05,160
And so I walked down the hall
and said, hey, list all the

1088
01:03:05,160 --> 01:03:08,440
drivers.
And, and this was Tom.

1089
01:03:08,520 --> 01:03:13,960
And I said, I want you to rank
them in order of, of job

1090
01:03:13,960 --> 01:03:18,640
performance and attitude and how
they get along with their

1091
01:03:18,640 --> 01:03:22,160
customers and all of that.
And I want to take a look at the

1092
01:03:22,520 --> 01:03:25,040
bottom 10%.
And I think we had like 50

1093
01:03:25,040 --> 01:03:28,240
drivers at that point.
So the bottom 5, we fired three

1094
01:03:28,240 --> 01:03:31,720
of those guys and he was kicking
and screaming the whole way and

1095
01:03:31,720 --> 01:03:33,640
I said trust me, this is going
to work.

1096
01:03:33,640 --> 01:03:35,280
I know it is, I know it is.
It does.

1097
01:03:35,280 --> 01:03:39,000
So we did that for like 4 or
five years running and we ended

1098
01:03:39,000 --> 01:03:42,040
up with such a great team of
drivers.

1099
01:03:42,240 --> 01:03:44,600
It was phenomenal process to go
through.

1100
01:03:44,880 --> 01:03:47,480
You know, it's funny because
Jack Welsh also did that with

1101
01:03:47,480 --> 01:03:50,240
business units.
Like if yes, that's business if

1102
01:03:50,240 --> 01:03:52,680
you were not number one in your
industry.

1103
01:03:52,680 --> 01:03:55,400
That's right, yeah.
They killed the company, you

1104
01:03:55,440 --> 01:03:59,920
know, which like to me was like,
whoa, number one, really, if

1105
01:03:59,920 --> 01:04:03,880
you're not number one in your
industry, not top five, not top

1106
01:04:03,880 --> 01:04:06,840
10, number one in your industry,
we're going to kill the kill the

1107
01:04:06,840 --> 01:04:09,120
company.
So that's a little bit of

1108
01:04:09,120 --> 01:04:11,040
pressure.
But by the way, what you just

1109
01:04:11,040 --> 01:04:15,480
explained about all the drivers,
perfect case for ChatGPT again.

1110
01:04:15,800 --> 01:04:20,520
So you basically take those,
maybe there's an assessment test

1111
01:04:20,520 --> 01:04:23,640
or whatever and ChatGPT can even
tell you here's what you want to

1112
01:04:23,640 --> 01:04:27,240
test them on, have them each
fill out this thing once a week

1113
01:04:27,240 --> 01:04:29,760
or whatever, or you can do it
based on automation and all

1114
01:04:29,760 --> 01:04:33,240
kinds of other things.
But you take those reports and

1115
01:04:33,240 --> 01:04:36,920
put them all in and it could be
hundreds of reports and you say

1116
01:04:36,920 --> 01:04:40,320
I want the bottom 10% and tell
me why.

1117
01:04:40,680 --> 01:04:45,080
And you can put in any kind of
criteria you want and it gives

1118
01:04:45,080 --> 01:04:47,320
you such great information.
The other thing that I'll do.

1119
01:04:48,000 --> 01:04:51,560
So let's say when you're down to
those last six applicants for

1120
01:04:51,560 --> 01:04:57,120
the CFO job, put the six.
So what I do, all of our

1121
01:04:57,120 --> 01:04:59,480
meetings happen on a platform
called Rome.

1122
01:04:59,480 --> 01:05:03,520
It's our, it's, it's a remote
business platform and it's

1123
01:05:03,520 --> 01:05:05,600
amazing.
It looks like a real office.

1124
01:05:05,600 --> 01:05:08,200
You can go knock on someone's
door in their office and stuff.

1125
01:05:08,680 --> 01:05:14,120
But one of the things it's got
is it's got an AI like it.

1126
01:05:14,200 --> 01:05:19,760
It records notes during every
one of your meetings using AI,

1127
01:05:20,000 --> 01:05:22,320
and it'll tell you exactly what
the meeting was about, what you

1128
01:05:22,320 --> 01:05:25,680
talked about, all this stuff.
You can ask questions and go

1129
01:05:25,680 --> 01:05:28,800
back and forth with it.
But at the end of every meeting

1130
01:05:28,840 --> 01:05:31,880
or at the end of every job
interview, I print out the

1131
01:05:31,880 --> 01:05:34,920
transcript.
And so now you've got my

1132
01:05:34,920 --> 01:05:37,560
interview of the person, you've
got their resume.

1133
01:05:37,960 --> 01:05:41,200
So I'll put the interviews and
the resumes all in for those six

1134
01:05:41,200 --> 01:05:43,760
people.
And I'll say based on these six

1135
01:05:43,760 --> 01:05:49,680
interviews and the six resumes,
who should I hire from 1:00 to

1136
01:05:49,680 --> 01:05:54,880
6:00 and why?
And who should I absolutely not

1137
01:05:54,880 --> 01:05:57,720
hire and why?
And I mean, usually I'll use

1138
01:05:57,720 --> 01:05:59,680
that when it comes down to two
people, right?

1139
01:05:59,680 --> 01:06:01,480
Like which one of these should I
hire?

1140
01:06:01,600 --> 01:06:03,800
Give me 5 reasons I should hire
this person.

1141
01:06:03,960 --> 01:06:08,440
Give me 5 reasons I shouldn't.
And I mean, it's just, it's the

1142
01:06:08,440 --> 01:06:13,920
decision maker and the, and the
sort of, you know, stalemate

1143
01:06:13,920 --> 01:06:16,920
breaker, you know, like if, if
you're just like, oh, I can't

1144
01:06:16,920 --> 01:06:19,000
make this decision.
It's so amazing.

1145
01:06:19,000 --> 01:06:22,800
It's such I talk to ChatGPT more
than I talk to anyone on my team

1146
01:06:22,800 --> 01:06:26,200
now.
Well, you know that this is this

1147
01:06:26,200 --> 01:06:28,840
is going to be bad for my team
because you know, I'm going to

1148
01:06:28,840 --> 01:06:31,240
I'm going to get off of this
call and I'm going to call

1149
01:06:31,400 --> 01:06:34,600
Chance and Michael and those
guys and say, hey, I got a whole

1150
01:06:34,600 --> 01:06:36,840
new way of doing things and
taught me something.

1151
01:06:36,960 --> 01:06:39,280
Yeah, yeah.
You, you guys just buckle.

1152
01:06:39,680 --> 01:06:42,160
They're going to be Chance is
going to be calling you first,

1153
01:06:42,200 --> 01:06:42,880
I'm sure.
And that's.

1154
01:06:42,880 --> 01:06:44,360
All right, dude, what are you?
Yeah.

1155
01:06:45,000 --> 01:06:47,680
You what are you trying to?
Do to me, no, you know what,

1156
01:06:47,680 --> 01:06:49,640
though?
That's it's not to replace him.

1157
01:06:49,640 --> 01:06:53,040
I, I had one of those meetings
this morning with my operations

1158
01:06:53,040 --> 01:06:57,720
manager and, you know, because
we're raising capital right now,

1159
01:06:57,720 --> 01:07:00,280
one of the things we're starting
to focus on is scaling the

1160
01:07:00,280 --> 01:07:03,480
businesses.
Come January 1st, 2026, we're

1161
01:07:03,480 --> 01:07:05,280
going to be really focused on
scaling.

1162
01:07:05,800 --> 01:07:09,160
And so I've gone to every
manager in my business and said,

1163
01:07:10,120 --> 01:07:13,000
you know, give me your plan on
how you plan to scale.

1164
01:07:13,000 --> 01:07:15,560
What are the like?
It was 7 questions basically

1165
01:07:15,560 --> 01:07:18,960
answer these seven questions for
me and it was, you know, what

1166
01:07:18,960 --> 01:07:21,200
are the roadblocks?
What are the things you need?

1167
01:07:21,200 --> 01:07:22,600
What are the things you don't
need?

1168
01:07:22,600 --> 01:07:24,960
What are people that you might
want to replace or add?

1169
01:07:25,320 --> 01:07:27,800
Like it was 7 really distinct
questions.

1170
01:07:28,280 --> 01:07:31,760
And I fed that all into ChatGPT
and for every one of my leaders,

1171
01:07:31,760 --> 01:07:36,240
it gives me back, you know, this
person's really task oriented.

1172
01:07:36,240 --> 01:07:40,280
They're not very strategic.
They're not using a strategic

1173
01:07:40,280 --> 01:07:44,280
thought process to build out
this, this function or process

1174
01:07:44,280 --> 01:07:47,360
or to really scale the business.
You need to coach them on.

1175
01:07:47,640 --> 01:07:49,800
Like it's, it's answering
questions that I'm not even

1176
01:07:49,800 --> 01:07:52,320
asking it.
And it was so useful because him

1177
01:07:52,320 --> 01:07:54,800
and I just sat there and talked
through this thing and he's

1178
01:07:54,800 --> 01:07:58,080
like, you know, that's so right.
I need to, I need to think more

1179
01:07:58,080 --> 01:08:01,520
at the 5000 foot level than
right here on the ground level.

1180
01:08:01,520 --> 01:08:04,960
And it was so useful.
Like, you know, every day I'm

1181
01:08:04,960 --> 01:08:07,640
discovering things where I'm
just like, wow, this is so

1182
01:08:07,640 --> 01:08:08,520
great.
I love it.

1183
01:08:08,880 --> 01:08:12,560
You know you should.
You should join concert stuff

1184
01:08:12,560 --> 01:08:14,960
group.
You would bring such a dynamic,

1185
01:08:15,000 --> 01:08:16,359
you know?
Well, you know, we are doing a

1186
01:08:16,359 --> 01:08:18,920
raise right now and there are
some opportunities here, Jim, we

1187
01:08:18,920 --> 01:08:22,680
could talk about.
But no, you know, I, I honestly,

1188
01:08:22,680 --> 01:08:25,760
and this isn't Tooting my own
horn or anything, but the, the

1189
01:08:25,760 --> 01:08:29,240
things that I've learned to do
with AI and just with my own

1190
01:08:29,359 --> 01:08:34,359
crazy business mind as it is
really lend themselves well to

1191
01:08:34,359 --> 01:08:36,319
some of the larger companies in
our industry.

1192
01:08:36,319 --> 01:08:38,840
And therefore I've done some
consulting with some groups who

1193
01:08:38,840 --> 01:08:43,560
have either done roll ups or
were, you know, growing or doing

1194
01:08:43,560 --> 01:08:46,680
something different or whatever.
So I do some of that stuff on

1195
01:08:46,680 --> 01:08:50,319
the side.
But but yeah, like I always

1196
01:08:50,319 --> 01:08:53,920
wonder if I would manage my life
differently and instead of

1197
01:08:54,319 --> 01:08:58,040
building small entrepreneurial
businesses, went and worked for

1198
01:08:58,040 --> 01:09:01,399
a large company.
It might have been a a lot

1199
01:09:01,399 --> 01:09:04,720
easier and probably be I could
have used some of my talents a

1200
01:09:04,720 --> 01:09:07,960
little bit more because in a
small company you can only break

1201
01:09:07,960 --> 01:09:10,200
so many things before you're
bankrupt, right?

1202
01:09:10,880 --> 01:09:15,600
So, so anyways, back to the
regular schedule program.

1203
01:09:17,600 --> 01:09:21,520
So yeah, but I again, I'm happy
to spend an hour with you.

1204
01:09:21,760 --> 01:09:24,479
OK, great.
On a screen share just doing

1205
01:09:24,479 --> 01:09:26,800
real world stuff like I'll show
you examples.

1206
01:09:26,800 --> 01:09:29,640
I'll go.
OK, look like you can feed an

1207
01:09:29,640 --> 01:09:33,800
expense report in and say, you
know, based on this sales report

1208
01:09:33,800 --> 01:09:39,040
compared to this expense report,
is my sales manager doing the

1209
01:09:39,040 --> 01:09:43,160
right things with money?
You know, like is he investing

1210
01:09:43,439 --> 01:09:46,160
effectively?
Just every example you could

1211
01:09:46,160 --> 01:09:48,479
possibly think of, like you
could say, well, I've had this

1212
01:09:48,479 --> 01:09:51,640
problem in my warehouse.
I'll tell you exactly how to

1213
01:09:51,800 --> 01:09:56,360
solve it using AI seriously like
or at least to put put programs

1214
01:09:56,360 --> 01:09:58,280
in place that will get you to
solving it.

1215
01:09:58,280 --> 01:10:03,200
So so back to concert stuff
groups.

1216
01:10:03,200 --> 01:10:07,640
So right now your main
businesses are G2 structures,

1217
01:10:07,640 --> 01:10:13,680
special event transportation
which I love, Guardian Bear,

1218
01:10:13,920 --> 01:10:16,960
Guardian Barrier Services.
What am I missing?

1219
01:10:17,680 --> 01:10:24,440
Well, let's see SESSE TG2G2
Mobile, which specializes in we,

1220
01:10:24,560 --> 01:10:27,240
we were the first joint venture
with Stage Line and we have

1221
01:10:27,240 --> 01:10:29,880
several Stage Line products
throughout North America.

1222
01:10:31,040 --> 01:10:34,760
Guardian Fuel Protection Agency,
which we just do turf protection

1223
01:10:35,160 --> 01:10:38,840
in stadiums for concerts.
Interesting concert chairs,

1224
01:10:38,840 --> 01:10:40,840
which you know, is exactly what
it is.

1225
01:10:40,840 --> 01:10:45,000
We set up chairs for concerts
and it'll do.

1226
01:10:45,280 --> 01:10:48,400
By the end of this year, we'll
have done like a couple of 100

1227
01:10:48,760 --> 01:10:53,440
gigs and that's yeah, with the.
Field protection, I mean these

1228
01:10:53,440 --> 01:10:57,040
are these are relatively small.
Yes.

1229
01:10:57,160 --> 01:11:01,440
Needs big problems because you
know, the last thing that that

1230
01:11:01,640 --> 01:11:04,920
like these field people are
crazy like they you don't mess

1231
01:11:04,920 --> 01:11:07,720
with my grass.
No, you know, I remember I did a

1232
01:11:07,720 --> 01:11:11,640
Super Bowl halftime show one
time and that person was God

1233
01:11:11,800 --> 01:11:16,040
like they they sprayed water at
our non IP rated lighting

1234
01:11:16,040 --> 01:11:19,080
fixtures and we went to yell at
them and they were like, excuse

1235
01:11:19,080 --> 01:11:22,560
me, you know, you may not
understand this, but you're

1236
01:11:22,560 --> 01:11:24,240
standing on holy ground right
now.

1237
01:11:24,440 --> 01:11:26,440
You're absolutely standing here.
Yes.

1238
01:11:26,760 --> 01:11:28,960
So that's a really, really
important thing.

1239
01:11:28,960 --> 01:11:33,000
And obviously you saw a need to
create a business around it.

1240
01:11:33,720 --> 01:11:35,920
So what did people do before
that before you?

1241
01:11:35,920 --> 01:11:40,720
Created this business plywood,
you know, Yeah, we would go into

1242
01:11:40,840 --> 01:11:45,120
the last.
So we at one time SES was the

1243
01:11:45,120 --> 01:11:48,160
largest purveyor of rental
plywood in the nation.

1244
01:11:48,480 --> 01:11:51,480
We would tour plywood with big
stadium shows.

1245
01:11:51,480 --> 01:11:56,200
The last, the last tour we did
was In Sync, and then by that

1246
01:11:56,200 --> 01:11:59,480
time we'd gotten into some
composite materials and some

1247
01:11:59,720 --> 01:12:03,960
reusable drivable stuff.
But we would buy plywood in

1248
01:12:03,960 --> 01:12:07,200
January on the spot market when
the prices were the lowest.

1249
01:12:07,440 --> 01:12:11,200
Then I'd cut a deal with the
meals to hold the shipment and

1250
01:12:11,200 --> 01:12:15,040
deliver it to the first concert,
wherever that might be, in March

1251
01:12:15,040 --> 01:12:18,320
or April.
And and then we would pick it up

1252
01:12:18,320 --> 01:12:22,280
from there and tour it with the
show, with the Stones, with

1253
01:12:22,280 --> 01:12:24,800
*NSYNC, with Pink Ford,
whomever.

1254
01:12:24,800 --> 01:12:25,560
Yeah.
Yeah.

1255
01:12:25,920 --> 01:12:29,120
So now it's not plywood anymore.
Though no, no, it's it's

1256
01:12:29,120 --> 01:12:34,760
actually drivable roadway which
is a molded product from either

1257
01:12:34,760 --> 01:12:37,880
high density polyethylene or
high density polypropylene.

1258
01:12:38,280 --> 01:12:42,200
And it rolls up I would assume.
No, it it actually breaks apart

1259
01:12:42,200 --> 01:12:45,640
and lay as panels.
Yes, yes, there are there are

1260
01:12:45,640 --> 01:12:49,560
some rolls, but those are
temporary roadways to get like a

1261
01:12:49,560 --> 01:12:52,440
forklift out to a spot tower
front of house mix.

1262
01:12:52,440 --> 01:12:55,600
But when you're doing a whole
end zone of a football stay and

1263
01:12:55,600 --> 01:12:58,320
you want to put it down and so.
It's like the puzzle pieces that

1264
01:12:58,320 --> 01:13:01,160
all go together and interlock or
whatever.

1265
01:13:01,160 --> 01:13:03,600
Yes.
Oh, that's, that's cool that

1266
01:13:03,600 --> 01:13:05,680
that's got to be a great
business because everything's a

1267
01:13:05,680 --> 01:13:07,960
stadium show these days, it
seems.

1268
01:13:08,560 --> 01:13:10,400
Thankfully.
Yes, yeah.

1269
01:13:10,400 --> 01:13:13,560
I mean, it's crazy how big
stadium shows have become, you

1270
01:13:13,560 --> 01:13:17,200
know, and half of me thinks that
that's just a dirty trick done

1271
01:13:17,200 --> 01:13:19,680
by Live Nation, who owns a bunch
of these stadiums.

1272
01:13:19,680 --> 01:13:24,120
But, you know, so they're
forcing bands into stadiums and

1273
01:13:24,120 --> 01:13:26,000
making it.
I don't know, It just seems to

1274
01:13:26,000 --> 01:13:28,920
make more sense like in in a lot
of ways.

1275
01:13:29,600 --> 01:13:33,960
Well, you know, I, I don't think
anyone has done more research on

1276
01:13:33,960 --> 01:13:37,360
how to monetize the ticket
buying public than Live Nation.

1277
01:13:37,360 --> 01:13:41,920
And, and even they are looking
at the entire vertical from top

1278
01:13:41,920 --> 01:13:44,680
to bottom.
And one of their most recent

1279
01:13:44,680 --> 01:13:50,840
endeavors is to build 55,000
seat venues across North America

1280
01:13:50,840 --> 01:13:54,000
over the next five years.
And if you think about it,

1281
01:13:54,080 --> 01:13:57,520
that's pretty brilliant because
let's take Winston Salem, NC,

1282
01:13:57,520 --> 01:14:01,280
which within its triad
population is about a million,

1283
01:14:01,280 --> 01:14:04,240
2,000,000 three.
But all the big shows go to

1284
01:14:04,240 --> 01:14:06,360
either Charlotte or Raleigh.
Yeah.

1285
01:14:06,360 --> 01:14:09,800
And and that there's.
So if you're going to go see a

1286
01:14:09,800 --> 01:14:12,640
big show, you got to drive to
one place or the other.

1287
01:14:12,880 --> 01:14:17,800
But there's this whole ecosystem
at the 5000 seat range that, you

1288
01:14:17,800 --> 01:14:21,760
know, you got artists like what
Darius Rucker, Joe Bonamassa,

1289
01:14:21,760 --> 01:14:25,560
Brad Paisley.
They're thriving in these 5000

1290
01:14:25,560 --> 01:14:30,560
seaters and they can play
Charlotte, Raleigh and Winston

1291
01:14:30,560 --> 01:14:34,560
Salem and hit 3 succinct 5000
seat markets.

1292
01:14:34,560 --> 01:14:38,360
So it's brilliant on Live
Nation's part, but it's also

1293
01:14:38,360 --> 01:14:45,560
giving new breath and new new
energy to these smaller markets

1294
01:14:45,560 --> 01:14:48,360
that don't normally get any
shows at all.

1295
01:14:48,520 --> 01:14:51,600
That reminds me, you know, I
used to do when I was with

1296
01:14:51,600 --> 01:14:57,200
Martin 100 years ago, I used to
do business with a, a magician

1297
01:14:57,280 --> 01:15:00,760
from Bozeman, Mt.
His name is J Owen House.

1298
01:15:01,280 --> 01:15:05,600
And I remember he called Martin
and Sales and the receptionist

1299
01:15:05,600 --> 01:15:08,400
pushed the call through to me.
And he was like, yeah, you know,

1300
01:15:08,400 --> 01:15:11,600
I'm, I'm this magician and I'm
looking to start using automated

1301
01:15:11,600 --> 01:15:13,440
lighting.
And I've never really used it.

1302
01:15:13,800 --> 01:15:17,280
And and I said, well, you know,
we don't sell direct.

1303
01:15:17,280 --> 01:15:19,600
And he goes, but can you help me
figure out what I need?

1304
01:15:19,600 --> 01:15:21,760
And then you can tell me which
dealer I got to buy from.

1305
01:15:21,760 --> 01:15:23,600
And I said, yeah, yeah, I can
work with you on that.

1306
01:15:23,800 --> 01:15:26,840
We became really good friends
over time, but we sold him a

1307
01:15:26,840 --> 01:15:30,160
lighting package through I think
it was pro sound and stage light

1308
01:15:30,160 --> 01:15:32,160
in California or something.
I don't even remember.

1309
01:15:32,680 --> 01:15:36,640
But you know him and his, he's
got his whole family involved,

1310
01:15:36,640 --> 01:15:39,800
his son, two of his daughters.
And so they learned how to

1311
01:15:39,800 --> 01:15:41,320
program all this stuff and
whatever.

1312
01:15:41,320 --> 01:15:46,040
But Long story short, so this
guy, instead of going to Vegas,

1313
01:15:46,200 --> 01:15:50,240
what he did is he bought a tour
bus, a really nice prevo tour

1314
01:15:50,240 --> 01:15:52,520
bus that his family would tour
on.

1315
01:15:53,200 --> 01:15:55,400
And they bought their own
staging.

1316
01:15:55,400 --> 01:15:58,560
They bought their own lighting,
they bought their own sound, and

1317
01:15:58,560 --> 01:16:02,280
they played high school
gymnasiums, community centers.

1318
01:16:03,280 --> 01:16:11,840
They would sell between 502,000
seats in places that never, ever

1319
01:16:12,360 --> 01:16:16,760
got any entertainment period.
They had to drive to the nearest

1320
01:16:16,760 --> 01:16:19,160
city.
Like I'm talking towns that

1321
01:16:19,160 --> 01:16:23,880
have, you know, 20,000 people
and 10% of those would go to his

1322
01:16:23,880 --> 01:16:26,680
show, you know that.
And they kept all the money.

1323
01:16:27,000 --> 01:16:29,920
And they kept all the money.
That's they, they even sold the

1324
01:16:29,920 --> 01:16:32,280
tickets.
Like he had a, he had basically

1325
01:16:32,280 --> 01:16:36,160
a phone room in his house where
he just had four people.

1326
01:16:36,440 --> 01:16:39,040
Yep, we're there next Tuesday
and, you know, we've got some

1327
01:16:39,040 --> 01:16:41,560
tickets left, blah, blah, blah.
You know, and it was just like

1328
01:16:41,600 --> 01:16:45,480
this machine that he had going.
And this guy probably made more

1329
01:16:45,480 --> 01:16:49,080
money than than most magicians
who had shows in Vegas

1330
01:16:49,080 --> 01:16:52,080
showrooms.
You know, he just did very, very

1331
01:16:52,080 --> 01:16:55,120
well.
And so, yeah, what you're

1332
01:16:55,120 --> 01:16:58,760
talking about, like bringing it
all down to that local economy.

1333
01:16:58,760 --> 01:17:01,760
Not everybody wants to jump in
their car and drive 4 hours to

1334
01:17:01,760 --> 01:17:04,840
go to a stadium show to see a
band that they'd rather see in a

1335
01:17:04,840 --> 01:17:08,080
small theater or a soft cedar or
whatever it is, you know?

1336
01:17:08,680 --> 01:17:13,760
I I think some of the research I
saw was that Live Nation had

1337
01:17:13,760 --> 01:17:21,160
figured that they could monetize
50% more of the ticket buyers

1338
01:17:21,240 --> 01:17:25,680
that they currently have if they
take the event to those markets.

1339
01:17:26,680 --> 01:17:29,760
Yeah, true.
I, I completely agree with that.

1340
01:17:30,080 --> 01:17:34,200
Like, you know, if if my
favorite band was playing in in

1341
01:17:34,200 --> 01:17:37,800
Orlando, which is 2 1/2 hours
for me, I wouldn't want to go.

1342
01:17:38,160 --> 01:17:41,080
Like, you know, but I'm not
their target audience either.

1343
01:17:41,080 --> 01:17:43,840
But you know, probably 40 years
ago, I would have gone.

1344
01:17:43,840 --> 01:17:45,640
I would have been like, let's go
on a road trip.

1345
01:17:45,640 --> 01:17:47,040
We're going to see whoever you
know.

1346
01:17:47,560 --> 01:17:51,040
But yeah, I don't know the whole
business.

1347
01:17:51,840 --> 01:17:54,760
In some ways.
I can't figure it out anymore.

1348
01:17:54,760 --> 01:17:57,880
I just don't understand it
anymore as much as I used to

1349
01:17:57,880 --> 01:18:02,360
think I really did, because so
many things are just unusual or

1350
01:18:02,360 --> 01:18:04,800
don't make much sense.
I had a ticketing guy on my

1351
01:18:04,800 --> 01:18:09,920
podcast recently who actually
has created a ticketing platform

1352
01:18:10,280 --> 01:18:13,640
against Git Master.
You know, like, I don't know if

1353
01:18:13,640 --> 01:18:16,080
I'm a small entrepreneur.
I don't know that that's who I'm

1354
01:18:16,080 --> 01:18:19,200
going to go pick on today, you
know, right, Like that's, that's

1355
01:18:19,200 --> 01:18:22,360
brave.
And but he's doing really well

1356
01:18:22,360 --> 01:18:26,080
because he focused on a real
niche business, which is mostly

1357
01:18:26,080 --> 01:18:30,160
like EDM kind of stuff and
especially smaller EDM stuff

1358
01:18:30,160 --> 01:18:33,160
like rave parties.
He does ticketing for rave

1359
01:18:33,160 --> 01:18:36,920
parties, but he does all the
ticketing for, I forget which

1360
01:18:36,920 --> 01:18:40,640
festival, one of the big EDM
festivals he does all of the

1361
01:18:40,680 --> 01:18:43,240
ticketing for.
And he's doing really well.

1362
01:18:43,240 --> 01:18:46,960
And, and it was just interesting
talking to him about, you know,

1363
01:18:47,320 --> 01:18:50,160
what can be done better and how
to do that better.

1364
01:18:50,160 --> 01:18:53,800
And you do it by, you know, like
Ticketmaster is here and has

1365
01:18:53,800 --> 01:18:56,640
become rather vanilla.
And you go down here and you

1366
01:18:56,640 --> 01:19:00,800
give 42 different flavors and
you really customize that

1367
01:19:00,800 --> 01:19:04,040
experience for the the person
buying the ticket.

1368
01:19:05,400 --> 01:19:07,840
You can open up some new markets
so you.

1369
01:19:07,880 --> 01:19:11,640
You can't, you can.
And I mean, it's, it's just your

1370
01:19:11,640 --> 01:19:14,760
different perspective on it.
Like, you know, all my young

1371
01:19:14,760 --> 01:19:18,640
guys like to tell me all this
thing about EDNEDNEDM and we

1372
01:19:18,640 --> 01:19:23,120
just did, we just did this
stadium gig this past weekend

1373
01:19:23,120 --> 01:19:26,800
and, and at Folsom and at
Boulder, Co, University of

1374
01:19:26,800 --> 01:19:30,360
Colorado with John Summit and I,
I didn't know who John Summit

1375
01:19:30,360 --> 01:19:33,040
was, but still he's, he's this
huge, huge.

1376
01:19:33,600 --> 01:19:36,760
If he can sell a stadium in
Boulder, Co, he's got to be

1377
01:19:36,760 --> 01:19:40,240
someone, you know.
So that is like 40,000 people in

1378
01:19:40,240 --> 01:19:42,480
there and wow.
And, and they say, you know, Ed

1379
01:19:42,520 --> 01:19:44,080
and Dad, you got to get up
speed.

1380
01:19:44,080 --> 01:19:49,360
I said, dude, EDM is only a
continuation of disco because it

1381
01:19:49,360 --> 01:19:52,800
became disco, then it became
raves, and now it's EDM.

1382
01:19:52,800 --> 01:19:55,560
I was doing this stuff when it
was really cool.

1383
01:19:55,560 --> 01:19:57,600
Guys, you know, don't, don't,
don't get all that's.

1384
01:19:57,600 --> 01:19:59,880
Hilarious.
Excited about yourselves here?

1385
01:19:59,880 --> 01:20:04,040
Yeah, yeah, except it's got
lighting budgets now that, you

1386
01:20:04,040 --> 01:20:06,000
know, you wouldn't have dreamed
of back then.

1387
01:20:06,000 --> 01:20:09,320
Video Oh my.
Goodness, unbelievable how much

1388
01:20:09,320 --> 01:20:13,440
gear they're putting on.
These This LED screen was 160

1389
01:20:13,440 --> 01:20:18,720
feet wide by 60 80 feet tall.
Whoa, that is massive.

1390
01:20:18,920 --> 01:20:23,720
Massive A.
Thousand row CB5 tiles, I said

1391
01:20:24,160 --> 01:20:28,040
wow, how many trucks is that?
That's incredible.

1392
01:20:28,360 --> 01:20:30,440
Yeah.
A really good friend of mine is

1393
01:20:30,440 --> 01:20:33,920
Steve Lieberman, who's a
lighting designer, lives in

1394
01:20:33,920 --> 01:20:36,480
California now.
He's from New York, but he

1395
01:20:36,480 --> 01:20:39,600
started out doing little clubs
in New York and stuff and he

1396
01:20:39,600 --> 01:20:43,600
somehow locked into this whole
EDM thing and now he's, I don't

1397
01:20:43,600 --> 01:20:46,000
know if he's head of lighting
design or whatever.

1398
01:20:46,000 --> 01:20:51,600
For Insomniac who own all these
big festivals and stuff and the

1399
01:20:51,600 --> 01:20:56,920
shows that this guy puts on his
on his Instagram and stuff, just

1400
01:20:56,960 --> 01:20:59,720
unbelievable.
The amount of lighting he's

1401
01:20:59,720 --> 01:21:01,760
using on these things.
It's just wild.

1402
01:21:02,000 --> 01:21:05,360
It is wild.
The production, the production

1403
01:21:05,360 --> 01:21:08,440
budgets on these shows is just
unbelievable.

1404
01:21:08,640 --> 01:21:12,680
And you got a guy up there who's
pretending to DJ like he's

1405
01:21:12,680 --> 01:21:15,440
touching buttons on the mixer
and just kind of doing some of

1406
01:21:15,440 --> 01:21:18,680
his dancing around and touching
buttons and doesn't actually

1407
01:21:18,680 --> 01:21:20,280
ever do anything right.
Let's.

1408
01:21:20,280 --> 01:21:24,080
Face, he shows up with the
briefcase and walks up on stage

1409
01:21:24,720 --> 01:21:28,960
and he flew in on a private jet
and he's living on a private

1410
01:21:28,960 --> 01:21:31,240
jet.
And yeah, and some of the

1411
01:21:31,680 --> 01:21:35,320
paychecks these guys are, it's
unbelievable what they're

1412
01:21:35,320 --> 01:21:37,840
making.
You know, so one of the people

1413
01:21:38,320 --> 01:21:42,520
my my ex neighbor here in South
Florida, this is 15 years ago or

1414
01:21:42,520 --> 01:21:46,000
something.
Her name is Pam and they called

1415
01:21:46,000 --> 01:21:50,560
her Pam DJ.
And a long, long time ago, she,

1416
01:21:50,560 --> 01:21:53,760
she basically started working
with DJs when they were making,

1417
01:21:54,240 --> 01:21:59,080
you know, 1000 to $5000 a night.
She started working with them

1418
01:21:59,080 --> 01:22:02,360
and, and convincing them that
you really are rock stars and,

1419
01:22:02,360 --> 01:22:04,680
and you know, we need to treat
you differently.

1420
01:22:04,960 --> 01:22:06,880
We need to get you into better
gigs.

1421
01:22:06,880 --> 01:22:10,280
And she literally was, most
people would tell you this like

1422
01:22:10,280 --> 01:22:14,200
the old school DJ guys like
Paul, Paul, what's his name,

1423
01:22:14,200 --> 01:22:20,480
Sonnenfeld or something.
But some of these guys, she got

1424
01:22:20,480 --> 01:22:24,280
them from 5000 a night to like
100,000 a night like that and

1425
01:22:24,280 --> 01:22:29,240
got them from flying on WestJet
to or flying on Southwest to

1426
01:22:29,240 --> 01:22:34,680
flying, you know, private and
and she was, she was really

1427
01:22:34,680 --> 01:22:36,640
monumental in making that
happen.

1428
01:22:36,640 --> 01:22:41,160
Pam DJI don't know what she does
now, but yeah, it's amazing what

1429
01:22:41,160 --> 01:22:43,600
that thing has done.
And and you know, you look at

1430
01:22:43,600 --> 01:22:47,440
these guys doing residencies in
Las Vegas clubs, you know,

1431
01:22:47,440 --> 01:22:52,160
making 253040 grand a night as
DJs wild.

1432
01:22:52,720 --> 01:22:56,600
Is this a great country or what?
It is a great country, you know,

1433
01:22:56,680 --> 01:23:01,000
a schmuck Canadian like me can
come in and and somehow find a

1434
01:23:01,000 --> 01:23:03,720
way and make a career out of it,
you know, there you go.

1435
01:23:03,720 --> 01:23:08,560
So the, so let me just
understand the corporate

1436
01:23:08,560 --> 01:23:10,960
structure.
So okay, concert stuff, group

1437
01:23:11,160 --> 01:23:14,120
holding company with all the
shared services in it, right.

1438
01:23:14,160 --> 01:23:16,720
And then all the other
businesses are separate

1439
01:23:16,720 --> 01:23:19,640
businesses underneath and they
have separate leadership teams

1440
01:23:19,640 --> 01:23:21,400
and things like that, that
that's great.

1441
01:23:22,200 --> 01:23:24,920
So.
We basically have 4 verticals

1442
01:23:25,040 --> 01:23:28,240
and the verticals are
technology, which is sound,

1443
01:23:28,240 --> 01:23:31,600
lights, video, etcetera,
transportation, which is trucks

1444
01:23:31,600 --> 01:23:36,200
and buses structures, which is
G2 and G2 mobile and support

1445
01:23:36,200 --> 01:23:39,560
services, which is Guardian,
barrier, FPA, concert chairs,

1446
01:23:39,560 --> 01:23:43,120
etcetera.
And then within those verticals,

1447
01:23:43,120 --> 01:23:47,440
we have managing directors and,
and it kind of falls under the

1448
01:23:47,800 --> 01:23:50,840
the whole corporate umbrella,
but each one of those companies

1449
01:23:50,840 --> 01:23:54,560
are autonomous to their brand.
But then over here, we just

1450
01:23:54,560 --> 01:23:59,040
created integration as well
because that grew out of the

1451
01:23:59,040 --> 01:24:03,920
ministry work and the touring
work with Billy and Joyce and

1452
01:24:03,920 --> 01:24:07,400
Joel.
So integration is over here and

1453
01:24:07,400 --> 01:24:10,760
we've acquired one other
integration company and now

1454
01:24:10,760 --> 01:24:14,280
we've set that up as our fifth
vertical and we're looking to

1455
01:24:14,280 --> 01:24:16,920
expand that footprint.
Is that primarily houses of

1456
01:24:16,920 --> 01:24:18,280
worship?
Or anything.

1457
01:24:18,280 --> 01:24:22,120
Yes, yes.
Well, we do serve the Live

1458
01:24:22,120 --> 01:24:25,800
Nation venues that we're in
contact with constantly.

1459
01:24:25,800 --> 01:24:30,640
And yeah, and, and we're kind of
a, a backup go to for, for Live

1460
01:24:30,640 --> 01:24:33,440
Nation if they need help at a
venue with a delay line or

1461
01:24:33,440 --> 01:24:35,440
something like that.
We, we go do that.

1462
01:24:35,440 --> 01:24:40,240
But by and large, we're
primarily 95% houses of worship.

1463
01:24:40,520 --> 01:24:43,480
But are you selling them the
gear for their 50 new venues

1464
01:24:43,480 --> 01:24:46,840
that they're building?
Well, I, we haven't had that

1465
01:24:46,840 --> 01:24:51,480
conversation yet.
We are building a venue in

1466
01:24:51,480 --> 01:24:54,200
downtown Winston Salem that's a
5000 seater.

1467
01:24:54,640 --> 01:24:59,720
And we, we hope that that's
going to become a model for not

1468
01:24:59,720 --> 01:25:04,440
only Live Nation or AG or Danny
Wimmer or whoever, but, you

1469
01:25:04,440 --> 01:25:09,840
know, but really become a model
also for municipalities like

1470
01:25:09,880 --> 01:25:14,160
Missoula, Mt, They could use a
5000 seater in Missoula, Mt, you

1471
01:25:14,160 --> 01:25:17,040
mentioned Bozeman, you know,
they could use a 5000 seater.

1472
01:25:17,360 --> 01:25:23,640
And so I have a partner in this
venue and he's in the automotive

1473
01:25:23,640 --> 01:25:27,280
business, but he's got a
terrific heart and a passion for

1474
01:25:27,280 --> 01:25:29,760
Winston Salem.
And in the last couple of

1475
01:25:29,760 --> 01:25:33,320
decades, I don't know of a, a
person and an individual that's

1476
01:25:33,320 --> 01:25:37,400
done more for, for downtown
Winston Salem than Don Flow.

1477
01:25:37,640 --> 01:25:41,720
And it, it's just really, you
can call it serendipity or

1478
01:25:41,720 --> 01:25:43,960
divine intervention.
I prefer to call it divine

1479
01:25:43,960 --> 01:25:47,960
intervention.
But we got together and he, he

1480
01:25:47,960 --> 01:25:52,560
had this vision to do this.
And I like to think that, you

1481
01:25:52,560 --> 01:25:55,280
know, it's a focal point in life
when opportunity and

1482
01:25:55,280 --> 01:25:59,200
preparedness meet.
And I felt like I was prepared

1483
01:25:59,200 --> 01:26:03,120
and I was meeting opportunity.
And we halfway through a

1484
01:26:03,120 --> 01:26:06,080
meeting, I just said, Hey, why
don't you and me just do this

1485
01:26:06,080 --> 01:26:08,200
together?
And he got up, extended his

1486
01:26:08,200 --> 01:26:11,160
hand, and we shook hands.
And now we're building a 5000

1487
01:26:11,160 --> 01:26:12,680
Cedar.
They on sound wisdom Salem.

1488
01:26:13,040 --> 01:26:15,160
How involved are you in that?
Like are you?

1489
01:26:15,960 --> 01:26:20,600
Every day, really.
Yes, yes, that is cool.

1490
01:26:20,880 --> 01:26:23,400
And is it going to have, is it
going to have house sound and

1491
01:26:23,400 --> 01:26:28,120
lights or or?
It's going to have house sound

1492
01:26:28,120 --> 01:26:33,480
and lights when the tour will
let us, or if the tour doesn't

1493
01:26:33,480 --> 01:26:38,160
want to use their own.
We're gonna have big video

1494
01:26:38,160 --> 01:26:40,720
screens, we're gonna have Core 7
cinematics.

1495
01:26:40,720 --> 01:26:46,520
We'll be doing all the imag and
we'll have the, we're under a

1496
01:26:46,520 --> 01:26:53,480
pretty strict noise environment.
So we have to use DNB, KSL, L

1497
01:26:53,480 --> 01:26:55,600
acoustics.
I mean, we have to use a speaker

1498
01:26:55,600 --> 01:26:59,200
cabinet has great back of box
rejection and off axis

1499
01:26:59,200 --> 01:27:01,800
rejection.
So we can't just let someone

1500
01:27:01,800 --> 01:27:05,160
come in with a point source
system and spray stuff all over

1501
01:27:05,160 --> 01:27:07,800
the neighborhood.
So yeah, but for the most part,

1502
01:27:07,800 --> 01:27:10,240
yeah, we're going to be able to
offer the full gamut.

1503
01:27:11,280 --> 01:27:16,760
We're very excited about it.
I've always, well, in the last

1504
01:27:16,760 --> 01:27:20,680
20 years, I've been able to kind
of have a personal project

1505
01:27:20,760 --> 01:27:24,680
because I've got such a great,
great team behind me and, you

1506
01:27:24,680 --> 01:27:26,360
know, and great team supporting
me.

1507
01:27:26,360 --> 01:27:29,720
And now with chance, you know, I
feel like, wow, I can just

1508
01:27:29,720 --> 01:27:32,160
really go out and do something
crazy and wild kick.

1509
01:27:32,280 --> 01:27:35,520
Back now.
Well, I don't know what that

1510
01:27:35,520 --> 01:27:38,120
looks like, and my wife will
tell you she doesn't know what

1511
01:27:38,120 --> 01:27:40,960
it looks like either, but good.
For you, you know what, like too

1512
01:27:40,960 --> 01:27:43,960
many people I know, they take
their foot off the gas and

1513
01:27:44,120 --> 01:27:47,160
that's when they hit the wall.
You know, like yeah, they get

1514
01:27:47,240 --> 01:27:50,040
sick or lose passion or whatever
it is.

1515
01:27:50,040 --> 01:27:56,640
And I happen to love working and
my now fiance that says you're

1516
01:27:56,640 --> 01:27:59,920
never going to quit working.
And I'm not like I'm just going

1517
01:27:59,920 --> 01:28:02,560
to that's going to evolve into
different things, whatever it

1518
01:28:02,560 --> 01:28:04,200
becomes.
You know, I probably won't do

1519
01:28:04,400 --> 01:28:08,840
exactly what I'm doing today
forever, you know, but I'm going

1520
01:28:08,840 --> 01:28:11,120
to continue working and I'm
going to continue working in

1521
01:28:11,120 --> 01:28:13,920
this industry because I like it.
So same.

1522
01:28:13,920 --> 01:28:15,080
Here.
Same here.

1523
01:28:15,240 --> 01:28:17,040
Yeah, well, I'm good for you,
man.

1524
01:28:17,040 --> 01:28:20,000
Like, why stop?
You know, I had this

1525
01:28:20,000 --> 01:28:23,040
conversation with another friend
of mine who's in his early 60s

1526
01:28:23,040 --> 01:28:25,280
recently.
And and I said, I'm really

1527
01:28:25,280 --> 01:28:27,920
tired, like, I need a break.
And he goes, be careful what you

1528
01:28:27,920 --> 01:28:31,520
wish for because, you know, I'm
going to work until I drop

1529
01:28:31,520 --> 01:28:34,160
someday.
And I said, but that sounds

1530
01:28:34,160 --> 01:28:36,000
depressing.
And he said it's really not.

1531
01:28:36,000 --> 01:28:39,000
I love when I do.
Why would I want to stop?

1532
01:28:39,280 --> 01:28:41,960
Like look at hockey players and
football players and stuff.

1533
01:28:41,960 --> 01:28:45,480
When they have to retire, it's
the most depressing time of

1534
01:28:45,480 --> 01:28:47,400
their life.
Like they're not happy.

1535
01:28:47,720 --> 01:28:50,400
They they're stopping doing what
they love to go and do with the

1536
01:28:50,400 --> 01:28:52,160
people they love to do it with
every day.

1537
01:28:52,160 --> 01:28:55,680
And that's that's problematic.
All you got to do is live

1538
01:28:55,680 --> 01:28:58,040
through one global pandemic and
you'll have a whole new

1539
01:28:58,040 --> 01:29:00,800
appreciation for our industry
and what we get to do.

1540
01:29:00,800 --> 01:29:03,680
And yeah, and, and all of those
things, you know, so.

1541
01:29:03,680 --> 01:29:07,360
Well when I did this red alert
restart thing off of one of my

1542
01:29:07,360 --> 01:29:11,320
zoom calls I remember just
looking at it around and going.

1543
01:29:11,960 --> 01:29:15,480
I can't believe how happy people
are just to be out hanging

1544
01:29:15,480 --> 01:29:18,880
lights to light up a bridge or a
building or something.

1545
01:29:19,040 --> 01:29:21,400
For free it was not.
Getting paid, Yeah.

1546
01:29:21,560 --> 01:29:24,920
Everyone was just so happy to
put on their show blacks and go

1547
01:29:24,920 --> 01:29:27,120
out and program some lights,
even though they were just

1548
01:29:27,280 --> 01:29:31,480
turning them red, you know?
But it was, it was just such a

1549
01:29:31,480 --> 01:29:34,720
cool moment because you realize
that people aren't doing this

1550
01:29:34,720 --> 01:29:38,080
for a paycheck, you know?
Certainly, you know, we got it.

1551
01:29:38,080 --> 01:29:41,520
But we got the call from The
Avett Brothers manager,

1552
01:29:41,560 --> 01:29:44,640
management and from his manager
and they said, hey, we want to

1553
01:29:44,640 --> 01:29:48,080
do a drive in show at Charlotte
Motor Speedway.

1554
01:29:48,520 --> 01:29:51,440
And so we're sitting around
doing nothing, right.

1555
01:29:51,840 --> 01:29:55,520
And I would have worked for
free, but I just wanted to do

1556
01:29:55,520 --> 01:29:57,400
something.
And he said would you mind

1557
01:29:57,400 --> 01:30:00,320
coming down here tomorrow?
Exactly.

1558
01:30:00,760 --> 01:30:02,680
Would you mind coming down here
tomorrow and meeting with me?

1559
01:30:02,680 --> 01:30:05,560
I said yeah, absolutely.
So Jeff and Michael and I get in

1560
01:30:05,560 --> 01:30:09,000
the car and we go down, we meet
with it's the Speedway people

1561
01:30:09,000 --> 01:30:11,640
and and the a vets management
team and all of that.

1562
01:30:11,640 --> 01:30:16,680
And we pull over onto the track
and they go to the second, the

1563
01:30:16,680 --> 01:30:20,240
3rd and 4th turns and they're
thinking like a little 320

1564
01:30:20,240 --> 01:30:23,160
mobile stage and they're going
to play up a hill, right?

1565
01:30:23,840 --> 01:30:26,960
Well, at Charlotte Motor
Speedway, there's this 200 foot

1566
01:30:26,960 --> 01:30:33,320
long by 85 foot tall LED board
that is designed to show the

1567
01:30:33,320 --> 01:30:38,320
track environment 1100 feet away
to the for the people in the

1568
01:30:38,320 --> 01:30:41,520
start finish line.
Everyone's walking over there

1569
01:30:41,520 --> 01:30:44,880
and I'm looking at this giant
LED board and I go running over

1570
01:30:44,880 --> 01:30:48,640
there and I'm looking out across
this track and I'm saying, guys

1571
01:30:48,640 --> 01:30:52,320
come over here, come over here.
This is where we're doing this

1572
01:30:52,320 --> 01:30:55,200
gig.
And you know, it was so

1573
01:30:55,200 --> 01:30:59,200
difficult to convince them
because audio, for example, you

1574
01:30:59,200 --> 01:31:02,000
know, if we tried to think
traditional audio, it would have

1575
01:31:02,000 --> 01:31:06,920
been like 20 freaking delay
towers and, and multiple rivals.

1576
01:31:06,920 --> 01:31:11,000
And no two, I said, we're going
to embed the audio in the video

1577
01:31:11,080 --> 01:31:15,160
and broadcast it and you'll be
able to dial it in on your FM

1578
01:31:15,160 --> 01:31:21,400
radio in the there you go.
So I, I think someone listening

1579
01:31:21,400 --> 01:31:24,560
may correct me, but we did 15150
cars.

1580
01:31:24,880 --> 01:31:27,680
I think it might have been the
largest drive in during the

1581
01:31:27,680 --> 01:31:29,360
pandemic.
It certainly wasn't in North

1582
01:31:29,360 --> 01:31:35,160
America, as I recall, and it was
so cool to walk out through

1583
01:31:35,240 --> 01:31:40,160
those 15150 cars and listen to
people chamming to their radio.

1584
01:31:40,480 --> 01:31:44,960
People rented every pickup truck
in the Carolinas, I think, that

1585
01:31:44,960 --> 01:31:48,840
you could get and they put sofas
in the bed and their stereo

1586
01:31:48,840 --> 01:31:51,640
systems out of their house.
And it was crazy.

1587
01:31:51,840 --> 01:31:52,880
Oh, it was.
It was.

1588
01:31:53,080 --> 01:31:55,360
But the.
Problem is, even at that scale,

1589
01:31:55,640 --> 01:31:59,040
it was, you know, it was
impossible.

1590
01:31:59,120 --> 01:32:01,800
It was just an impossible
business model like.

1591
01:32:01,960 --> 01:32:03,480
It was.
You couldn't make money.

1592
01:32:03,480 --> 01:32:04,920
The promoter couldn't make
money.

1593
01:32:04,920 --> 01:32:07,800
No, the actor performer couldn't
make money.

1594
01:32:08,040 --> 01:32:11,680
Like it was just it, you know,
or when they did those cubes

1595
01:32:11,680 --> 01:32:15,000
that were like 10 foot by 10
foot or whatever and five people

1596
01:32:15,000 --> 01:32:18,360
in each one of those cubes, like
you just couldn't make any money

1597
01:32:18,360 --> 01:32:21,040
from it.
It was, you know, the the like

1598
01:32:21,120 --> 01:32:23,720
Bush used to say the arithmetic
don't work.

1599
01:32:24,280 --> 01:32:25,720
Definitely, you know that's.
Right.

1600
01:32:25,720 --> 01:32:29,280
We made no money on that show
because I had to custom design

1601
01:32:29,280 --> 01:32:32,080
this roofing system that could
do this and do that.

1602
01:32:32,080 --> 01:32:35,360
And you know, it was like it
just gave us something to do

1603
01:32:35,360 --> 01:32:36,920
but.
Yeah, yeah.

1604
01:32:36,920 --> 01:32:39,200
Well, that's what it was all
about, you know, like it was.

1605
01:32:39,560 --> 01:32:42,720
I don't know that you were ever
part of one, but I, I started

1606
01:32:42,720 --> 01:32:47,160
these weekly Zoom calls every
Wednesday at 5:00 PM and it was

1607
01:32:47,160 --> 01:32:50,320
a, a happy hour.
It's like a industry happy hour

1608
01:32:50,320 --> 01:32:53,160
for for just anybody.
It was a drop in thing, anybody

1609
01:32:53,160 --> 01:32:55,200
who wanted to come.
And I started it like in

1610
01:32:55,640 --> 01:33:00,520
probably March of 2020, maybe
around March, February.

1611
01:33:00,520 --> 01:33:02,440
I don't know when it was
exactly, but.

1612
01:33:02,440 --> 01:33:05,440
March 13th, when the music
stopped.

1613
01:33:05,800 --> 01:33:08,240
Yeah.
So it was around that time and

1614
01:33:08,240 --> 01:33:11,800
we ended up doing like 100 of
them or something, you know,

1615
01:33:11,800 --> 01:33:15,560
because I had this, I had this,
you know, incredibly brilliant

1616
01:33:15,560 --> 01:33:19,600
saying that was this is a 90 day
problem.

1617
01:33:20,000 --> 01:33:22,760
What do you want to look like on
day 91?

1618
01:33:22,760 --> 01:33:26,160
Like get yourself in shape, get
your business in shape, you

1619
01:33:26,160 --> 01:33:29,960
know, add that component, that
wrinkle, whatever it is, you

1620
01:33:29,960 --> 01:33:32,120
know, like get things cleaned
up.

1621
01:33:32,120 --> 01:33:35,640
Don't sit on the couch and eat
Cheetos and and watch Netflix.

1622
01:33:36,200 --> 01:33:40,240
Little did I know it was like
391 days or whatever.

1623
01:33:40,240 --> 01:33:47,000
Not 91 days, but I started this
Zoom call and 1st week was

1624
01:33:47,000 --> 01:33:50,120
probably 20 people, then it was
40, then it was 60, then it was

1625
01:33:50,120 --> 01:33:53,600
100 or whatever.
And it was guys like you,

1626
01:33:53,600 --> 01:33:59,560
company owners, production
managers, all the lighting

1627
01:33:59,560 --> 01:34:04,800
manufacturers, anybody lighting
designers, sound engineers,

1628
01:34:05,280 --> 01:34:09,720
anyone could come to it.
And just to be able to have

1629
01:34:09,720 --> 01:34:13,080
other people from the industry
talking to each other on a Zoom

1630
01:34:13,080 --> 01:34:15,440
call.
What are your problems?

1631
01:34:15,480 --> 01:34:17,360
You know, how can we help you
with this?

1632
01:34:17,360 --> 01:34:20,480
And, you know, like, honestly, I
hate to say it, but the last

1633
01:34:20,480 --> 01:34:24,440
time I saw Nook was on one of my
Zoom calls.

1634
01:34:24,480 --> 01:34:29,120
And John Wiseman was making fun
of him because Nook was smoking

1635
01:34:29,120 --> 01:34:31,920
weed in the basement of his
house because his wife didn't

1636
01:34:31,920 --> 01:34:35,280
like him to smoke upstairs.
So he's sitting like next to a

1637
01:34:35,280 --> 01:34:38,600
furnace or something.
And and Wiseman goes, Nook, are

1638
01:34:38,600 --> 01:34:41,600
you in the basement?
And he goes, yeah, yeah, my, my

1639
01:34:41,600 --> 01:34:46,600
wife doesn't like when I smoke
upstairs, you know, And I mean,

1640
01:34:46,600 --> 01:34:48,640
I have such a vivid memory of
that.

1641
01:34:48,640 --> 01:34:52,480
And and sadly it's the last time
I saw Nook I think but.

1642
01:34:53,440 --> 01:34:56,720
Yeah, but those things were so
therapeutic though, you know,

1643
01:34:57,000 --> 01:35:00,680
And it was.
And it just goes to the strength

1644
01:35:00,800 --> 01:35:04,640
of the fabric of our industry,
you know, when when no one's a

1645
01:35:04,640 --> 01:35:08,240
competitor during those times,
we're all in it together, We're

1646
01:35:08,240 --> 01:35:10,760
all friends.
And if anyone's got an idea,

1647
01:35:10,760 --> 01:35:12,760
please throw it out there.
We're all ears.

1648
01:35:13,000 --> 01:35:18,320
There were some dumb ideas too.
Somehow I got I got involved in

1649
01:35:18,320 --> 01:35:21,320
so many of them because I was so
willing to listen to people.

1650
01:35:21,320 --> 01:35:25,680
You know, I always put myself
out as, as, you know, the

1651
01:35:25,680 --> 01:35:29,480
helper, you know, and, and
actually my fiance is the one

1652
01:35:29,480 --> 01:35:32,080
person in my life now who's
saying, Marcel, you got to be

1653
01:35:32,080 --> 01:35:33,960
careful.
You know, there's only this many

1654
01:35:33,960 --> 01:35:36,600
hours in a day.
And if you're giving away this

1655
01:35:36,600 --> 01:35:39,360
many, you know, you're going to
run into some problems.

1656
01:35:39,360 --> 01:35:42,080
So, yeah.
So one of the things that I've

1657
01:35:42,080 --> 01:35:46,240
always heard, you know, from
people who work for you and who

1658
01:35:46,240 --> 01:35:52,160
have worked for you in the past
or whatever, is that you're very

1659
01:35:52,160 --> 01:35:55,720
generous from a standpoint of
like rewarding your team and

1660
01:35:55,720 --> 01:35:59,640
empowering your team and
bringing team members in as

1661
01:35:59,920 --> 01:36:02,640
managers or owners in some
cases.

1662
01:36:04,000 --> 01:36:08,760
And, and I remember your, I read
about your integration company

1663
01:36:08,760 --> 01:36:13,120
that the, the bonuses were
larger than some of the, your

1664
01:36:13,120 --> 01:36:15,320
salary, for example, or
whatever.

1665
01:36:16,320 --> 01:36:21,880
So how do you balance because I
love being generous, but

1666
01:36:21,880 --> 01:36:25,440
unfortunately, especially since
COVID, I'm probably one of the,

1667
01:36:25,480 --> 01:36:29,800
the shittiest payers in the
industry with regard to how much

1668
01:36:29,800 --> 01:36:33,120
salary and stuff I pay.
And it's just not a necessity.

1669
01:36:33,120 --> 01:36:37,600
Like, you know, I'm trying to
mitigate losses, not to, not to

1670
01:36:37,600 --> 01:36:40,160
extend them by being the biggest
payer out there.

1671
01:36:40,520 --> 01:36:45,600
So how do you balance generosity
and and like sustainability?

1672
01:36:46,520 --> 01:36:49,920
Well, you know, it's tough, but
I remember very early on and,

1673
01:36:49,920 --> 01:36:53,080
and I think Joyce was the one
that taught me this lesson that,

1674
01:36:53,480 --> 01:36:56,600
you know, Jim, you're never
going to be able to outgive God.

1675
01:36:56,880 --> 01:36:59,680
So the more you can give back,
the more you're going to be

1676
01:36:59,680 --> 01:37:02,120
blessed with.
And you know, I, I took that to

1677
01:37:02,120 --> 01:37:04,680
heart, but I didn't do it just
to be blessed.

1678
01:37:04,680 --> 01:37:08,320
I, I did it because it really
made me feel good.

1679
01:37:08,320 --> 01:37:12,600
It made me feel like, wow,
what's the best way I can impact

1680
01:37:12,600 --> 01:37:15,400
people's lives?
And it's to enrich them in one

1681
01:37:15,400 --> 01:37:18,000
way or the other.
Either give them the opportunity

1682
01:37:18,920 --> 01:37:22,400
either monetize them or help
their family, help them in times

1683
01:37:22,400 --> 01:37:27,040
of distress.
What whatever we can do that is

1684
01:37:27,040 --> 01:37:31,840
a generation older or more that
can enrich the lives of

1685
01:37:31,840 --> 01:37:34,840
generations under us.
You know, we need to do that.

1686
01:37:34,840 --> 01:37:37,560
There's there hasn't been enough
of that.

1687
01:37:37,680 --> 01:37:41,120
And since World War 2, if you
think about it, you know, we're,

1688
01:37:41,440 --> 01:37:45,280
we're kind of boomers and we're
a product of everyone coming

1689
01:37:45,280 --> 01:37:50,320
home from the big war and having
all of these babies, but then

1690
01:37:50,320 --> 01:37:54,480
their parents becoming dual
income earners and latchkey kids

1691
01:37:54,480 --> 01:37:57,880
and all of that jazz.
And the family unit just kind of

1692
01:37:57,880 --> 01:38:01,600
went away there.
There's there's no more huge

1693
01:38:01,600 --> 01:38:06,840
family reunions anymore.
There's no more, I mean, outside

1694
01:38:06,840 --> 01:38:10,280
of your own individual wife,
children, grandchildren, you

1695
01:38:10,280 --> 01:38:14,440
know, there's no 12 or 13 aunts
and uncles that are getting

1696
01:38:14,440 --> 01:38:18,000
together at Thanksgiving or
Christmas and celebrating the

1697
01:38:18,000 --> 01:38:20,800
family unit and the United
States and the country and all

1698
01:38:20,800 --> 01:38:23,960
of that jazz.
You know, it, it's kind of like

1699
01:38:24,360 --> 01:38:27,560
we've lost something that made
this nation great.

1700
01:38:28,080 --> 01:38:31,320
And I think it's, it's some
people like you.

1701
01:38:31,320 --> 01:38:34,400
And yeah, it bugs me too.
It bugs the hell out of me.

1702
01:38:34,400 --> 01:38:37,480
And, and I, you know, it, it,
it, it's, it's up to us, though,

1703
01:38:37,480 --> 01:38:40,960
to do something about it.
You know, and I came to this

1704
01:38:40,960 --> 01:38:46,200
country as an immigrant and I
like, I came from Canada.

1705
01:38:46,200 --> 01:38:50,520
So it's not like I came from the
Ukraine during a war or some

1706
01:38:50,520 --> 01:38:53,160
war-torn country or something.
I came from Canada to the United

1707
01:38:53,160 --> 01:38:56,840
States.
So I'm not trying to cry for me,

1708
01:38:57,120 --> 01:39:01,000
but I am saying I came as an
immigrant with so much respect

1709
01:39:01,000 --> 01:39:04,840
and so much willingness to like,
I came here with the what can I

1710
01:39:04,840 --> 01:39:07,920
do for you attitude, not what
can you do for me, but the what

1711
01:39:07,920 --> 01:39:11,680
can I do for you Miss America.
Like, how can I make this

1712
01:39:11,680 --> 01:39:14,400
country better?
And one of the things I decided

1713
01:39:14,400 --> 01:39:17,720
at some point was by creating
opportunities, by creating jobs

1714
01:39:17,720 --> 01:39:21,640
for people, by, you know,
procreating never worked out

1715
01:39:21,640 --> 01:39:24,840
really well for me because I was
too busy to be in the same state

1716
01:39:25,000 --> 01:39:30,360
as my, as my now ex-wife.
But I did have one son.

1717
01:39:30,360 --> 01:39:34,480
And, and, you know, God, God
help us.

1718
01:39:34,480 --> 01:39:38,040
Maybe at some point he'll have
grandkids for me too.

1719
01:39:38,760 --> 01:39:42,200
But, you know, I've just always
had that attitude, like, I love

1720
01:39:42,200 --> 01:39:43,880
this country.
I love the opportunity.

1721
01:39:43,880 --> 01:39:48,360
It's, it's provided me, you
know, I, I don't understand why

1722
01:39:48,360 --> 01:39:51,960
everyone doesn't think like
that, like, you know, it could

1723
01:39:51,960 --> 01:39:55,000
be worse either, you know.
Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

1724
01:39:55,000 --> 01:39:57,720
And and don't beat yourself up
because you know you can't

1725
01:39:57,720 --> 01:40:01,920
afford to give what you would
really like to, because at the

1726
01:40:01,920 --> 01:40:05,040
end of the day, you're giving
something and at the end of the

1727
01:40:05,040 --> 01:40:08,200
day, you are creating jobs.
And at the end of the day, if

1728
01:40:08,200 --> 01:40:10,840
you're not healthy and if you
don't?

1729
01:40:11,520 --> 01:40:14,720
Stay in business.
All that's going away for.

1730
01:40:14,720 --> 01:40:17,280
Everyone if the company goes
away.

1731
01:40:17,320 --> 01:40:20,440
Yeah, you know, and and you
know, it, it golly, it took me

1732
01:40:20,440 --> 01:40:23,360
25 years to get to a point to be
able to do that.

1733
01:40:23,360 --> 01:40:25,800
So yeah, you know.
I love that though.

1734
01:40:25,800 --> 01:40:28,160
I love that mentality.
I love that you do that.

1735
01:40:28,160 --> 01:40:31,280
I like to me it's how I've
always been, you know?

1736
01:40:31,280 --> 01:40:34,120
And I'll give you an example
though, it always bites you or

1737
01:40:34,480 --> 01:40:37,880
people find a way to turn a good
thing like that into a bad

1738
01:40:37,880 --> 01:40:38,920
thing.
And I'll give you an example,

1739
01:40:39,720 --> 01:40:43,240
not long after I started Gear
Source, we weren't remote.

1740
01:40:43,320 --> 01:40:49,120
I had a building here in South
Florida and probably 2020 people

1741
01:40:49,120 --> 01:40:53,880
inside the building or whatever.
And I started bringing in a car

1742
01:40:53,880 --> 01:40:57,520
wash guy every or a car wash
company.

1743
01:40:57,520 --> 01:41:00,440
It was more than one guy, but I
brought him in every Wednesday I

1744
01:41:00,440 --> 01:41:02,480
think.
And he'd come in at 9:00 in the

1745
01:41:02,480 --> 01:41:05,160
morning and he'd be there till
6:00 in the afternoon and he'd

1746
01:41:05,160 --> 01:41:07,880
wash everybody's cars or him and
his partners would wash

1747
01:41:07,880 --> 01:41:10,480
everybody's cars.
And I paid for that every week.

1748
01:41:11,000 --> 01:41:14,960
And so then what I started
seeing is 1 particular employee,

1749
01:41:14,960 --> 01:41:18,320
and I won't shame him on this
podcast, but one particular

1750
01:41:18,320 --> 01:41:23,520
employee would come in the
morning, get his car washed, go

1751
01:41:23,520 --> 01:41:25,640
home for lunch and bring his
wife's car back in the

1752
01:41:25,640 --> 01:41:28,600
afternoon.
You know, and it's just like, I

1753
01:41:28,880 --> 01:41:34,280
that made me so angry because it
was just like, it's petty, but

1754
01:41:34,600 --> 01:41:38,720
at the same time, so I, you just
ruined it for everybody, you

1755
01:41:38,880 --> 01:41:41,920
know, because you found the
little loophole where you could

1756
01:41:41,920 --> 01:41:44,040
take advantage.
You just ruined it for

1757
01:41:44,040 --> 01:41:46,680
everybody, you know, And we
stopped him in the car washes,

1758
01:41:47,160 --> 01:41:49,400
you know?
And that's a shame.

1759
01:41:49,400 --> 01:41:52,360
You know, I've had some things
like that happen in the.

1760
01:41:52,360 --> 01:41:55,000
Past, and there's always been
somebody who takes advantage.

1761
01:41:55,000 --> 01:41:59,040
Always and and you know, not too
long into it, I decided I'm not

1762
01:41:59,040 --> 01:42:01,480
going to let one guy ruin it for
everyone.

1763
01:42:01,520 --> 01:42:04,880
I'm going to call him out, you
know, and a lot of times I would

1764
01:42:04,880 --> 01:42:07,600
call him out and I'd say, you
know, come on, you with the

1765
01:42:07,600 --> 01:42:10,880
little teeny mind, you know, get
with the program.

1766
01:42:10,880 --> 01:42:13,640
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Well, I mean, at some point

1767
01:42:13,640 --> 01:42:16,840
everybody just looks at him and
goes, you horrible man.

1768
01:42:17,160 --> 01:42:19,320
No, Yes.
And and they shame him, you

1769
01:42:19,320 --> 01:42:22,040
know, but I don't know.
I probably handled it all wrong.

1770
01:42:22,040 --> 01:42:26,640
But like, you know, like you, I,
when I can, I love to be the guy

1771
01:42:26,680 --> 01:42:30,640
who gives, gives, you know,
Christmas bonuses and gives, you

1772
01:42:30,640 --> 01:42:35,000
know, free meals and gives
whatever I can because at the

1773
01:42:35,000 --> 01:42:37,720
end of the day, I only need so
much and the rest goes to all of

1774
01:42:37,720 --> 01:42:40,280
you.
And so.

1775
01:42:40,280 --> 01:42:41,040
Yeah.
Yeah.

1776
01:42:41,480 --> 01:42:45,880
Well, you know, I, I, I think,
you know, when we're in a

1777
01:42:45,880 --> 01:42:49,240
position that we can do
something impactful, you know,

1778
01:42:49,880 --> 01:42:54,080
like concert for Carolina, you
know, we were just in a perfect

1779
01:42:54,080 --> 01:42:58,120
position to be able to do that.
And we, we had a couple of

1780
01:42:58,120 --> 01:43:02,480
artists that, you know, it, it
just all fell into place And it,

1781
01:43:02,480 --> 01:43:07,160
it, it, that'll go down as a
pivotal moment in my career to

1782
01:43:07,160 --> 01:43:10,280
be, to have been involved in
that one event.

1783
01:43:10,320 --> 01:43:13,920
You know, that's great.
So are you planning to duplicate

1784
01:43:14,680 --> 01:43:17,480
the, it's an amphitheater,
right?

1785
01:43:17,560 --> 01:43:20,520
It's an outdoor, Yeah, yes.
You're planning to duplicate

1786
01:43:20,520 --> 01:43:24,720
that into other cities or.
Well, we're planning to use that

1787
01:43:24,720 --> 01:43:29,000
as a model in case someone were
to want it.

1788
01:43:29,240 --> 01:43:34,240
And then we will provide either
the staging structure or the VIP

1789
01:43:34,280 --> 01:43:38,920
structures or the seating or
whatever components they choose

1790
01:43:38,920 --> 01:43:42,440
to get from us or the entire
thing.

1791
01:43:42,560 --> 01:43:46,680
You know, I just want to be able
to provide a model for cities

1792
01:43:46,680 --> 01:43:51,080
like Winston Salem, be able to
say, OK, they did it and it

1793
01:43:51,080 --> 01:43:54,240
didn't cost a fortune.
And you know, there's proof of

1794
01:43:54,240 --> 01:43:57,440
concept, so we'll try it.
Sorry, you're going to end up

1795
01:43:57,440 --> 01:44:00,960
with like, you know, I'm next to
G2, you're going to have V2 like

1796
01:44:00,960 --> 01:44:04,480
venue, you know, not another
business.

1797
01:44:04,960 --> 01:44:07,640
No, no, no.
You know, and, and I'm, I'm

1798
01:44:07,680 --> 01:44:11,240
going back to my days of running
the foreign music theatre when,

1799
01:44:11,240 --> 01:44:14,640
you know, I, I built the live
music theatre and I used to book

1800
01:44:14,640 --> 01:44:18,160
it and run it and all that.
And I'm thinking, Jim, don't get

1801
01:44:18,160 --> 01:44:20,880
sucked backwards.
You know, let's let's not get

1802
01:44:20,880 --> 01:44:24,920
into this, you know, above,
above your head.

1803
01:44:24,920 --> 01:44:28,200
So we'll see how it goes.
So I'm having fun with it right

1804
01:44:28,200 --> 01:44:30,280
now.
Yeah, Speaking of which, like

1805
01:44:30,280 --> 01:44:34,960
one final question, cuz I know I
can't keep you all day, but you

1806
01:44:34,960 --> 01:44:38,560
said something somewhere that I
read called refocusing rather

1807
01:44:38,560 --> 01:44:41,560
than retiring.
And you, you know, you've

1808
01:44:41,560 --> 01:44:47,040
mentioned I, I won't go into
your age, but you know, do you

1809
01:44:47,040 --> 01:44:51,480
still think about work life
balance or anything like that,

1810
01:44:51,480 --> 01:44:56,520
retiring, God forbid?
Or do those thoughts creep into

1811
01:44:56,520 --> 01:44:59,080
your mind?
Or do you just keep trying to

1812
01:44:59,640 --> 01:45:00,840
maybe?
Well, they do.

1813
01:45:01,080 --> 01:45:04,600
They do.
And you know, if there's one

1814
01:45:04,600 --> 01:45:09,560
major regret I have is that I
didn't spend enough time with my

1815
01:45:09,840 --> 01:45:12,400
kids growing up in the formative
years.

1816
01:45:12,400 --> 01:45:15,520
And although whenever I could, I
took them on the road with me.

1817
01:45:15,520 --> 01:45:20,240
And you know, the I I have a St.
for a wife.

1818
01:45:20,240 --> 01:45:23,920
I mean, my goodness, you know,
she homeschooled them and, and,

1819
01:45:24,320 --> 01:45:28,240
and suffered through 40 odd
years of this industry.

1820
01:45:28,240 --> 01:45:30,720
But that's probably the one
regret.

1821
01:45:30,720 --> 01:45:33,880
But recently, coming out of the
pandemic, it's all about

1822
01:45:33,880 --> 01:45:36,120
refocus.
Because if there's anything I

1823
01:45:36,120 --> 01:45:38,760
can do for my grandkids, I want
to do that.

1824
01:45:39,040 --> 01:45:43,480
I want to re establish a
stronger bond with my two kids,

1825
01:45:43,680 --> 01:45:47,240
with my wife.
And she and I are having a lot

1826
01:45:47,240 --> 01:45:49,200
of fun now.
We're probably having more fun

1827
01:45:49,200 --> 01:45:52,880
than we've had in a decade.
And good for you.

1828
01:45:52,880 --> 01:45:56,480
Yeah.
It's, it's, it's trying to do do

1829
01:45:56,480 --> 01:46:01,080
a work life balance in the later
years that I never did early on.

1830
01:46:01,560 --> 01:46:05,720
Well, and I think work life
balance is a bit of a, you know,

1831
01:46:05,800 --> 01:46:08,480
it's like a Bigfoot, you know,
people talk about it, but

1832
01:46:08,480 --> 01:46:11,640
nobody's ever actually seen
perfect version of it, right?

1833
01:46:11,640 --> 01:46:16,120
Yeah, right, right.
And but, you know, I think we

1834
01:46:16,120 --> 01:46:18,600
should be focused on quality of
life.

1835
01:46:18,600 --> 01:46:22,280
And, you know, if the quality of
life is working 12 hours a day

1836
01:46:22,280 --> 01:46:24,600
and that's the only thing that
gives you joy, then that's what

1837
01:46:24,600 --> 01:46:28,440
you should be doing.
But, you know, you also have to

1838
01:46:28,440 --> 01:46:31,000
think about what does that take
away from the people you love,

1839
01:46:31,000 --> 01:46:35,000
The people around you, you know,
are what's their quality of life

1840
01:46:35,000 --> 01:46:39,320
as a result of your choices?
And so, yeah, I mean, I don't

1841
01:46:39,320 --> 01:46:43,320
believe necessarily in work life
balance, but I do believe in,

1842
01:46:43,320 --> 01:46:45,400
like, I'm a huge fan of remote
work.

1843
01:46:45,720 --> 01:46:49,600
And there is a downside to it.
There's a downside where not

1844
01:46:49,600 --> 01:46:52,560
having your team in the same
room or in the same building

1845
01:46:53,200 --> 01:46:57,160
does come with some challenges.
But I've figured it out and I

1846
01:46:57,160 --> 01:47:00,880
think I've nailed it now to a
point where I have a lot to

1847
01:47:00,880 --> 01:47:03,240
offer to somebody who's looking
for a job.

1848
01:47:03,240 --> 01:47:07,680
And like if they were going to
go be a, a CFO at company A and

1849
01:47:07,680 --> 01:47:14,120
make X, you know, they might
choose Company B me for X -, 20%

1850
01:47:14,160 --> 01:47:17,720
because of that mythical work
life balance.

1851
01:47:17,880 --> 01:47:19,520
That's right.
They get to be around their kids

1852
01:47:19,520 --> 01:47:22,240
when their kids get home from
school or leave for school or

1853
01:47:22,720 --> 01:47:26,120
have lunch with their wife every
day, or go for a walk through

1854
01:47:26,120 --> 01:47:28,760
their neighborhood that they've
spent a fortune to live in or

1855
01:47:28,760 --> 01:47:31,280
whatever.
So, you know, those things

1856
01:47:31,280 --> 01:47:33,680
really matter to me.
Like, you know, I have a house

1857
01:47:33,680 --> 01:47:39,760
up in Canada and in the Banff
area, and now I spend basically

1858
01:47:39,760 --> 01:47:42,760
the entire like from May until
October.

1859
01:47:42,760 --> 01:47:44,520
I just got back last week.
Wow.

1860
01:47:44,960 --> 01:47:47,400
And I love it.
There's so much, you know.

1861
01:47:47,640 --> 01:47:50,400
But I love it's one of the most
gorgeous places on the planet.

1862
01:47:50,520 --> 01:47:52,920
It's, I'm biased, but I happen
to agree.

1863
01:47:53,160 --> 01:47:55,960
Yes, but I mean, just the
ability to go for a walk in the

1864
01:47:55,960 --> 01:48:00,800
mountains, you know, in between
two meetings or something like

1865
01:48:00,800 --> 01:48:05,880
that is so valuable to me.
It really is so valuable to me.

1866
01:48:05,880 --> 01:48:09,520
So as long as I can do those
things, that's my work life

1867
01:48:09,520 --> 01:48:13,520
balance like that I can balance
my day where there are, you

1868
01:48:13,520 --> 01:48:17,520
know, sort of sanity moments
throughout the day that that,

1869
01:48:17,640 --> 01:48:20,960
you know, so.
Yeah, well, I've really enjoyed

1870
01:48:20,960 --> 01:48:25,320
this Jim and and honest to
goodness, I Ioffer you an hour

1871
01:48:25,320 --> 01:48:29,640
of my time anytime you want to
to give you a bit of a a deep

1872
01:48:29,640 --> 01:48:34,320
dive quickly into some AI stuff
that'll literally change your

1873
01:48:34,320 --> 01:48:36,440
day right now.
I'm going to take you up on

1874
01:48:36,440 --> 01:48:37,920
that.
Anytime, anytime.

1875
01:48:37,920 --> 01:48:40,480
Just shoot me an e-mail and
we'll schedule some time and.

1876
01:48:40,880 --> 01:48:43,080
Well, we're going to schedule
some time because I'm still one

1877
01:48:43,080 --> 01:48:44,840
of those physical connectivity
guys.

1878
01:48:44,840 --> 01:48:48,400
I'm going to fly you up to
Charlotte, pick you up and we're

1879
01:48:48,400 --> 01:48:51,240
going to do the little tour and
then we're going to we're going

1880
01:48:51,240 --> 01:48:54,200
to break bread together and then
you're going to then you're

1881
01:48:54,200 --> 01:48:58,280
going to show me how to do it.
I'll I'll committed right now.

1882
01:48:58,280 --> 01:49:01,840
All right, so fantastic.
Absolutely All right, Jim.

1883
01:49:01,840 --> 01:49:05,480
Well, thank you so much and and
enjoy the rest of your week and.

1884
01:49:06,080 --> 01:49:07,920
It's well been a pleasure.
All right.

1885
01:49:08,320 --> 01:49:09,440
Thank.
You talk to you soon.

1886
01:49:09,600 --> 01:49:10,640
All right.
Bye.

1887
01:49:10,680 --> 01:49:10,800
Bye.