#292 - Chris Chalk

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What a fun conversation that was
with Chris Chalk.

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I learned a ton about the
basically what it's like to be a

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lighting programmer on movies
and and television and wildlife.

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This guy's had he's made some
really good decisions, had some

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really good luck and there are
some really good lessons along

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the way for sure as well.
So I think anybody who has any

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interest in getting into
television lighting or movie

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00:00:32,560 --> 00:00:34,480
lighting, this would be a great
podcast for you.

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00:00:34,480 --> 00:00:42,000
So please enjoy episode #292.
Episode 292 is also brought to

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you by Elation, a privately held
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Hello and thanks for joining me

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00:01:58,120 --> 00:02:03,920
on Gears of Gear episode #292.
Today's podcast is brought to

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Episode 292 here we are.
And so if you haven't already,

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00:03:54,480 --> 00:03:57,440
please check out the first
episode of our new Future Tech

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00:03:57,440 --> 00:04:01,360
podcast.
This one is really interesting

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00:04:01,360 --> 00:04:04,960
and exciting.
You may not have noticed while

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00:04:04,960 --> 00:04:09,480
you were watching this episode,
the first future tech episode,

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00:04:09,480 --> 00:04:13,680
but it is fully AI generated.
It's the first fully AI

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generated podcast that I'm aware
of in our industry and it is

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entirely focused on new products
and news, press releases,

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product releases, etcetera.
So instead of sitting and

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00:04:26,280 --> 00:04:31,120
reading a paper magazine or you
know, scrolling on your phone

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00:04:31,120 --> 00:04:35,560
and reading these press releases
or product announcements, you

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can now actually listen to them.
You can listen to them in your

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car.
There's not really much to

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watch.
You'll see a logo.

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That's about it.
So listening is probably the

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preferred method on this one,
but it is, it's an awesome

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00:04:50,960 --> 00:04:52,760
format.
I'm really proud of it.

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00:04:52,760 --> 00:04:57,280
We're really excited to get this
growing quickly and I think it's

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00:04:57,280 --> 00:05:00,560
going to become the preferred
method of learning about new

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00:05:00,560 --> 00:05:05,160
products going forward.
So please listen, support it,

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00:05:05,320 --> 00:05:08,120
share it, subscribe to it,
etcetera.

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00:05:09,200 --> 00:05:13,280
And, and I hope you like it.
I hope you, you find it as fun

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00:05:13,280 --> 00:05:16,400
as, as we do.
And I'm still shocked about

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episode 286.
You know, I, I listened back to

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some parts of it the other day.
I'm a little bit embarrassed,

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but you know, I shouldn't be
because I do the same thing to

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people every week on the
podcast.

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You know, I, I look for facts
from their past and stuff.

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So, but in this one, they just
got me.

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I wasn't prepared for it.
Like I didn't have notes or

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thoughts or anything.
It was just like, boom, you

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know, tell us about your life.
And so they definitely got me.

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And now Sarah thinks she's being
smart by posting all these old

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pictures of me on socials.
And don't worry, Sarah, I have a

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very long memory, and I love to
get back at people.

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So work is underway to put Sarah
into the spotlight at some point

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in the future.
We'll see when that happens.

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It'll be when you least expect
it, I promise.

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And so, yeah, back to this, this
AI podcast, one of the things I

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did want to point out is is as I
said, it's it future tech is

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totally AI and we're not really
promoting that on the podcast,

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but we're certainly not hiding
it.

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We're not trying to dupe people
or trick people into listening

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an AI podcast and that they
think is hosted.

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Like people have told me we
should, you know, we should

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create Facebook pages for the
hosts and create these

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fictitious characters and all
this stuff sounds fun, but it

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felt deceptive to me, so I
didn't really want to do it.

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But we used several tools.
We used a proprietary tool to

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really create the podcast, but
we used some widely available

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tools like Suno for the music.
The music for the podcast is was

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created on Suno by me and it
wasn't like a 30 second thing.

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I went through probably 200
iterations of that song and

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finally settled on the one that
we've got.

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Some might say 200 iterations
and you pick that one.

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Don't ask me why.
I just did and used a part of

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ChatGPT to create the future
tech logo and I think we used

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Claude to script it.
And so, you know, a lot of stuff

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is being used in the background
to make it come out as clean and

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nice as it does.
So I hope you'll take a listen

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to it, understanding that it is
a completely AI generated

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podcast and it's still fun to
listen to.

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I mean, that's the crazy part
it, it doesn't sound like AI.

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You know, I'm certainly positive
that I could have duped a lot of

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you into not knowing it.
It was AI, but it's AI, so enjoy

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that one.
And so today's guest is a

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gentleman who Sarah says I met
but I don't recall meeting.

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So I'm gonna be interested to
find out if if that's the case

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or not.
Chris Chalky Chalk Hailing from

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Perth, WA, Chris discovered his
passion for production lighting

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during high school, sparking a
career that began with an

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Advanced Diploma of of
Performing Arts in Lighting at

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WAAPA, WAAPA in 2000 and an
internship at the Oregon

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Shakespeare Festival.
After joining the festival as a

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lighting technician in 2003, he
transitioned to film lighting in

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2005.
Lighting A Launching a

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successful career in the
industry, Chris has worked on

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acclaimed productions for Wanda
Vision, Perry Mason and Twin

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Peaks.
With a foundation in theatrical

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lighting, Chris specializes in
systems design and programming.

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Known for his creative onset
solutions.

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In 2024, he returned to
Australia as Sales and Marketing

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Manager at a megatech,
continuing his innovative work

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in the field.
And I'm also looking forward to

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talking to him about his
controls business.

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So please join me and welcome
Chris Chucky.

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Chuck, how are how are you
Chris?

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Should I call you Chris or
Chalky?

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Chris is Chris is fine.
All right, as we get older,

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those nicknames seem to drop off
a little bit for some of.

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Us.
No, mine hasn't.

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It's still.
It's still.

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Pretty, pretty relevant.
We always talk about these,

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these like touring nicknames and
stuff.

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And you know, some of them, I
think the guys want them to go

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away.
Like I don't know if you know

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James Poop.
No, you don't know poop.

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His name is His last name is
Popping James Popping.

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And so I don't know, his
nickname ended up being pooped.

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That one you kind of want to
drop off, you know?

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Yeah.
That's a little unfortunate.

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Yeah, yeah.
Or if you have a nickname like

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pedophile or something, you
probably want that one to go

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away pretty quickly.
Now you know that's not a good

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one.
I was kind of born into mine

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because my last name's chalk, so
it's just kind of stuck pretty

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easy.
Since I was a kid, everyone

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called me chalky.
Although when I was a kid it was

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I was a little chalky and my
dad, my dad was big chalky.

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I mean, even to this day I'm
still a little chalky, even

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though I'm, you know, 6 inches
taller than my dad.

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You know, that's funny, isn't
it?

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That's funny.
But you know mine, I never

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really got one because, you
know, my last name is Fairbairn.

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And so often times in school it
was fart brain or, you know,

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like just dumb shit that you
could make up out of that name.

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But there was never one that
really stuck to me, thankfully.

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I, I, I think the most
unfortunate one I got was

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Duster.
People would call me Duster.

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Yeah.
What did that mean?

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You know, like the dusters on
the you know, your teacher

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taken.
I get it.

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I get it.
Yeah, Duster, I get it.

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Yeah, that was the worst one I
ever got.

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So yeah, you.
Know so we were talking in the

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in the pre thing here about your
trip up to Calgary last year to

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to go to a Mustang event yeah I
wish I would have known about it

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because I would have actually I
I my house is like an hour and

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20 minutes or something from
Calgary so it's pretty.

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Cool.
It's called the International

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Mustang Mate, and it travels
each year between the US and

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Canada because it's either
hosted by an American club or a

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Canadian club, and I've gone to
several of them over the years.

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It's, I think, I think this year
was the 45th one or something

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and it's been going for a long
time.

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Wow.
And I have a, I have a Mustang

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that's currently stored in
Seattle and I have friends up

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there that have a resto shop.
And so there's about six of us,

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you know, pulled out.
What do you have?

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I have 84 SVO, which is a rare
Fox body car in the fact that

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it's not a 5 litre V8, it's a
2.3 litre turbo.

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So it's a fuel injected turbo.
Yeah.

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And then they made, then they
made it for like 3 years and

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they made less than 10,000 of
them.

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And mine's especially red
because it's got the removable

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glass roof, entrance roof, which
it wasn't, they weren't, it's a

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bit of a Unicorn because they
didn't actually build them

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officially that way from the
factory.

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You couldn't order it that way.
But there are about 30 of them

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that I think were built with it.
And that's one of those 30.

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And I bought it in I think 2008
out of a someone's backyard in

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Fresno.
And like, you know, the motor

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00:12:27,720 --> 00:12:30,960
was in a shed and the gearbox
was missing and all the front

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sheet metal was gone.
And you know, I paid like 300

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bucks for it.
I spent God knows how much money

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on it.
But now it's a yeah.

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Now it's a trophy winning show
car.

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So that's wild.
Yeah.

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It took me a long time.
Took me a long time, but

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something that I'm interested in
doing, you know, like I like

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fixing broken things or making
things so.

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00:12:50,440 --> 00:12:53,240
Yeah, well, I mean, there's a
lot of money in it now too.

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00:12:53,760 --> 00:12:58,480
If you can find the broken car,
there's certainly a lot of money

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in these.
And like, I like the resto mods

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where, you know, you get AA66
Corvette with a, you know, a new

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crate engine in it and, and air
conditioning and a good stereo

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and comfortable seats and all
that stuff, right?

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00:13:14,800 --> 00:13:16,680
Yeah, yeah.
I love that kind of stuff.

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00:13:16,680 --> 00:13:20,920
I don't like when they, I don't
like when they take like 2010

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Corvette and turn it into a 60
something Corvette, you know?

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00:13:24,920 --> 00:13:26,440
Yeah, that's kind of stupid.
Yeah.

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00:13:26,440 --> 00:13:30,200
It's a bit goofy but when they
update old cars I really love

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those.
I I Camaros are another one that

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I love the rest of my Camaros.
I mean, I love, I love old, you

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00:13:36,800 --> 00:13:40,600
know, old Corvettes and old, old
Aussie Falcons and all this sort

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00:13:40,600 --> 00:13:41,520
of stuff.
Yeah.

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00:13:41,520 --> 00:13:43,600
And you get in you get in one of
those these days.

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00:13:43,600 --> 00:13:45,840
And it's just like the, the
seating's terrible.

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The steering feels like this,
you know, like you're driving a

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boat.
Yeah.

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00:13:49,000 --> 00:13:53,480
And there's no air conditioning.
And, you know, I've, I've kind

226
00:13:53,480 --> 00:13:55,160
of reckon like a car is
something that you're supposed

227
00:13:55,160 --> 00:13:57,040
to enjoy.
So if you have to, yeah, you

228
00:13:57,040 --> 00:13:59,760
know, unless it's like a super
rare car or something like that,

229
00:13:59,800 --> 00:14:02,560
it should be in the museum.
You know, like modify it a bit

230
00:14:02,560 --> 00:14:04,960
and make it more comfortable,
like, you know, put the brakes

231
00:14:04,960 --> 00:14:07,160
on it, put good steering on it,
you know, that sort of stuff.

232
00:14:07,160 --> 00:14:10,240
Yeah, that's changed a lot or
and continues to change.

233
00:14:10,240 --> 00:14:13,840
It seems like, you know, in the
past, like if you had a 60s

234
00:14:13,840 --> 00:14:18,160
Corvette that you you modified
like that it was suddenly

235
00:14:18,160 --> 00:14:22,240
valueless and nobody wanted it.
But now The thing is, people

236
00:14:22,240 --> 00:14:24,720
like me and you, we actually
want to drive the car.

237
00:14:24,720 --> 00:14:27,360
We don't want to just have a
show car sitting in the garage

238
00:14:27,360 --> 00:14:29,040
somewhere.
I want to take it out on

239
00:14:29,040 --> 00:14:30,640
weekends and drive it.
Around and have.

240
00:14:30,640 --> 00:14:33,960
Fun, you know, and.
There's a certain, there's a

241
00:14:33,960 --> 00:14:36,640
certain segment of the market
that wants it to be like totally

242
00:14:36,640 --> 00:14:38,240
original.
And you know, of course, yeah,

243
00:14:38,480 --> 00:14:40,360
I've gotten into that.
There are certain cars where I

244
00:14:40,360 --> 00:14:42,680
would like I kind of know that
that bolt has to be that color

245
00:14:42,680 --> 00:14:45,480
in that bolt.
And like you know, restoring my

246
00:14:45,480 --> 00:14:47,840
car was originally going to
restore it to concourse

247
00:14:47,840 --> 00:14:49,240
condition.
So I.

248
00:14:49,240 --> 00:14:52,120
Go wow, I can tell you the part
numbers every every bolt in the

249
00:14:52,120 --> 00:14:54,200
car and what color they're
supposed to be and where they

250
00:14:54,280 --> 00:14:55,440
like.
It's real shit.

251
00:14:56,000 --> 00:15:00,080
Yeah, I just, I just spent a
weekend a friend of mine from

252
00:15:00,120 --> 00:15:04,040
who actually the guy who built
my house up in Canada, I became

253
00:15:04,040 --> 00:15:07,040
very friendly with him and he's
he's my best buddy up there most

254
00:15:07,040 --> 00:15:12,560
days, but he's a car guy.
Like, I've never even known like

255
00:15:12,560 --> 00:15:16,320
this guy, if you told him about
your car, he'd go, Oh yeah,

256
00:15:16,320 --> 00:15:19,520
there's only, there were only
10,000 of those and there was 30

257
00:15:19,520 --> 00:15:22,040
who had that roof.
You got one of those 30?

258
00:15:22,040 --> 00:15:25,640
Like he knows every stat, every
respect, every.

259
00:15:26,000 --> 00:15:28,680
Every.
Stock color, everything about

260
00:15:28,680 --> 00:15:34,240
every car in the 60s and, and
most of the 70s as well.

261
00:15:34,720 --> 00:15:37,760
And you know, I've never met
anybody like this guy.

262
00:15:37,760 --> 00:15:40,440
It's, he's a walking
encyclopedia for real.

263
00:15:40,920 --> 00:15:42,720
And so I just spent a weekend
with him.

264
00:15:42,720 --> 00:15:46,200
Him and his his wife are in
Naples, FL and, and my

265
00:15:46,200 --> 00:15:48,400
girlfriend and I went over and
hung out with them for a few

266
00:15:48,400 --> 00:15:51,000
days.
But you know, while the Meekum

267
00:15:51,000 --> 00:15:53,000
auctions on.
So we're sitting watching these

268
00:15:53,000 --> 00:15:56,040
cars and he's telling me the
history of every car and all

269
00:15:56,040 --> 00:15:57,440
this stuff.
It's just wild.

270
00:15:57,440 --> 00:15:58,680
Like I've always, it's fun
stuff.

271
00:15:59,000 --> 00:16:01,800
Been a fan, but not a not an
enthusiast.

272
00:16:01,800 --> 00:16:04,560
I I guess I would say of old
cars like that.

273
00:16:05,040 --> 00:16:07,720
It was interesting for me
because you know, with the, with

274
00:16:07,720 --> 00:16:10,760
my Mustang, it was at the time,
it was something that was

275
00:16:10,760 --> 00:16:15,640
affordable because, you know, I
mean, I had one before that

276
00:16:15,720 --> 00:16:18,080
which I bought fairly cheap and
then spent a lot of money on and

277
00:16:18,080 --> 00:16:20,360
then crashed.
And that's a whole other story.

278
00:16:21,160 --> 00:16:23,920
But, you know, they weren't
really expensive.

279
00:16:25,280 --> 00:16:28,920
And that was, you know, maybe 15
years ago there was there was

280
00:16:28,920 --> 00:16:32,880
one same car as mine, not
without the roof, but an SVO

281
00:16:33,200 --> 00:16:37,400
that sold at Macon last week for
37 grand, which was unheard of.

282
00:16:37,840 --> 00:16:39,640
Yeah.
So they're all starting to go

283
00:16:39,640 --> 00:16:42,080
up.
You know, it's that thing, you

284
00:16:42,080 --> 00:16:44,800
know, you reach a certain age in
the car that you we're in love

285
00:16:44,800 --> 00:16:46,680
with as a teenager is the thing
you want.

286
00:16:46,680 --> 00:16:49,240
And now you've got money, and so
you can buy it, you know, so

287
00:16:49,880 --> 00:16:52,520
people are willing to spend.
Cars, it's happened to cars.

288
00:16:52,520 --> 00:16:55,880
It, it'll happen to everything.
Like toys, you know, there's

289
00:16:55,880 --> 00:16:59,200
people paying huge money for
like original metal Tonka

290
00:16:59,200 --> 00:17:01,880
trucks, you know, because you
can't get them.

291
00:17:01,880 --> 00:17:04,560
They're all plastic made in
freaking Malaysia or something

292
00:17:04,560 --> 00:17:06,160
now, right?
Yeah, I mean, I've, I've got a

293
00:17:06,240 --> 00:17:09,359
I've got a 92 Gibson Explorer
that I used to play semi

294
00:17:09,359 --> 00:17:11,800
professionally.
Yeah, that's been sitting in the

295
00:17:11,800 --> 00:17:14,160
case for the last 10 years.
And I'd hate to think, you know,

296
00:17:14,160 --> 00:17:16,000
I bought a brand new I.
Hate to think that.

297
00:17:16,119 --> 00:17:19,440
He's worth these days, let
alone, you know, 70s les poles

298
00:17:19,440 --> 00:17:21,839
or, you know, late, you know,
late 60s les poles.

299
00:17:21,839 --> 00:17:25,640
It's it's, you know, all that
stuff's just it.

300
00:17:25,640 --> 00:17:28,240
Seems to have I don't know, I'm
not paying a huge amount of

301
00:17:28,240 --> 00:17:29,840
attention.
I, I'm paying attention only

302
00:17:29,840 --> 00:17:38,160
because in 2007, I think 6 I
bought, I don't know if you

303
00:17:38,160 --> 00:17:42,040
heard the story, but Guitar
Center bought the Eric Clapton

304
00:17:42,040 --> 00:17:45,560
Blackie Strat.
The, the Strat, the, the guitar

305
00:17:45,560 --> 00:17:50,520
that he played, they recorded
like cocaine and all his huge

306
00:17:50,520 --> 00:17:54,560
hits were recorded on Blackie.
And so they bought it for

307
00:17:54,560 --> 00:18:00,560
$1,000,000 at a, at an auction.
And so instead of just putting

308
00:18:00,560 --> 00:18:04,640
it back up for sale or whatever,
they made a deal with Fender and

309
00:18:04,640 --> 00:18:07,680
they put it into their custom
shop and had them just

310
00:18:07,680 --> 00:18:10,920
completely reverse engineer
every single part of that

311
00:18:10,920 --> 00:18:13,800
guitar.
The wiring, the, the content of

312
00:18:13,800 --> 00:18:16,800
the wiring, the shape of the
wiring, the condition of the

313
00:18:16,800 --> 00:18:22,520
wiring, the like every cigarette
burn, every worn piece.

314
00:18:22,520 --> 00:18:26,680
Like even the stickers on the
case have the same scratches

315
00:18:26,680 --> 00:18:29,720
that the stickers on Eric
Clapton's case had, right?

316
00:18:29,720 --> 00:18:32,920
Real NUD stuff.
So they only made, I think they

317
00:18:32,920 --> 00:18:38,400
made 200 of them or 225 of them
or something and they sold them

318
00:18:38,400 --> 00:18:42,440
for 20,000 bucks each.
And I had a friend in a pretty

319
00:18:42,440 --> 00:18:45,240
high play set at Guitar Center
because they were hard to get.

320
00:18:45,240 --> 00:18:47,360
Like there was only two. 150 of
them.

321
00:18:47,360 --> 00:18:53,280
And or 225 I think it was and so
I was able to get two of them.

322
00:18:53,440 --> 00:18:57,480
So I bought 2 and I sold the
first one almost immediately

323
00:18:57,480 --> 00:19:00,000
after the auction, within a few
months after the auction or

324
00:19:00,000 --> 00:19:04,440
after the the sale of the the
units for like 30 grand.

325
00:19:04,840 --> 00:19:07,600
And I decided to keep the other
one.

326
00:19:07,600 --> 00:19:10,080
And I've never played it.
It sits in the case.

327
00:19:10,080 --> 00:19:13,200
It hung on my wall at my my old
house before I got divorced.

328
00:19:14,000 --> 00:19:16,720
And now it sits in the case
literally under my bed.

329
00:19:17,640 --> 00:19:19,880
And I hope none of my neighbors
are listening and break into my

330
00:19:19,880 --> 00:19:25,920
house and take it.
But, and you know, I, I every

331
00:19:25,920 --> 00:19:28,560
once in a while I'll pop it up
on Reverb for a couple of months

332
00:19:28,560 --> 00:19:31,760
and just see if anything
happens, But it just seems to

333
00:19:31,760 --> 00:19:33,720
have stagnated.
And I don't know if people are

334
00:19:33,720 --> 00:19:37,160
literally waiting for Eric
Clapton to pass away or what it.

335
00:19:37,160 --> 00:19:38,640
Is, I mean, I don't know.
I mean, maybe.

336
00:19:38,640 --> 00:19:41,960
I mean, I would think, you know,
when he does pass the value and

337
00:19:41,960 --> 00:19:45,160
that's going to go up, it's the
same thing, you know, you would

338
00:19:45,160 --> 00:19:46,680
think, I mean, it's the same
sort of thing.

339
00:19:46,680 --> 00:19:50,360
They, you know, Kirk Hammett
from Metallica bought Peter

340
00:19:50,360 --> 00:19:54,560
Green's Les Paul.
Yeah, for some ungodly known

341
00:19:54,560 --> 00:19:56,720
amount of money.
I mean, you know, 59 Les Poles

342
00:19:56,720 --> 00:19:58,720
have always been, you know, the
pretty much the top of the

343
00:19:58,720 --> 00:20:02,440
market anywhere.
But yeah, he he bought it.

344
00:20:02,440 --> 00:20:06,480
And then, you know, within six
months, Gibson released an exact

345
00:20:06,480 --> 00:20:08,160
replica of it from the custom
shop.

346
00:20:08,160 --> 00:20:11,360
And I don't, you know, they were
2025 grand apiece, whatever they

347
00:20:11,360 --> 00:20:13,320
were.
And I was just like, yeah, I

348
00:20:13,320 --> 00:20:15,360
mean, I'm not spending that kind
of money, but, you know, it's

349
00:20:15,360 --> 00:20:16,720
cool.
Yeah.

350
00:20:16,720 --> 00:20:18,640
You know, so there's definitely
an interest in it.

351
00:20:18,880 --> 00:20:21,280
Well, here's the thing.
Like I said, I never played it.

352
00:20:21,280 --> 00:20:27,640
I played it once and but I
bought a guitar, a relic strap.

353
00:20:28,120 --> 00:20:33,440
So it's basically it's it's like
a 61 or 62 Strat made by a guy

354
00:20:33,440 --> 00:20:38,360
in Seattle called Nash Guitars
and it's what he specializes in.

355
00:20:38,360 --> 00:20:40,440
The guy makes a strap.
I know he makes a telly.

356
00:20:40,960 --> 00:20:42,280
And I know his work.
It's good stuff.

357
00:20:42,800 --> 00:20:47,000
That Strat, so at the time I
owned a part of a guitar store

358
00:20:47,000 --> 00:20:52,440
in Kelowna, BC, and so at dealer
cost, that Strat cost me like

359
00:20:52,440 --> 00:20:56,360
1200 bucks or something.
I'm telling you, it's the nicest

360
00:20:56,360 --> 00:20:59,640
early 60s Strat that I've ever
touched in my life.

361
00:21:00,280 --> 00:21:03,800
And for me, it smokes that
blackie.

362
00:21:03,800 --> 00:21:07,960
It's just such a nicer neck,
nicer guitar than the blackie.

363
00:21:09,320 --> 00:21:11,720
So whenever I do feel like
playing, I'm actually a bass

364
00:21:11,720 --> 00:21:12,960
player.
I'm not even a guitar player,

365
00:21:12,960 --> 00:21:16,360
but whenever I feel like playing
a guitar, I'll grab that that

366
00:21:16,520 --> 00:21:20,120
Nash guitar and I just love it.
It's it's like butter.

367
00:21:20,840 --> 00:21:22,440
It's it's.
Funny, I've got a nice guitar.

368
00:21:22,440 --> 00:21:28,120
I've always been a Gibson guy,
you know, I've had my Explorer

369
00:21:28,120 --> 00:21:30,240
forever.
I've had several Les Pauls,

370
00:21:30,240 --> 00:21:33,080
although I was always a fan of
like the mid 70s Ibanez.

371
00:21:33,920 --> 00:21:37,480
You know the Ibanez lawsuit.
Great guitars.

372
00:21:37,520 --> 00:21:39,480
Yeah, really good guitars.
Really good guitars.

373
00:21:40,000 --> 00:21:42,040
And I've only ever I.
Was an I've been a Steeler back

374
00:21:42,040 --> 00:21:43,480
then.
Yeah, right.

375
00:21:43,480 --> 00:21:44,840
No, they were just a nice
guitar.

376
00:21:44,840 --> 00:21:47,480
They sounded good.
I mean, you put better pickups

377
00:21:47,480 --> 00:21:51,160
in them, but whatever.
I've only ever owned 1 Fender

378
00:21:51,280 --> 00:21:56,960
and it was Dave Murray.
Had Dave Murray from Iron Maiden

379
00:21:57,520 --> 00:22:02,160
had a black strap that was
originally owned by Paul Kosov.

380
00:22:03,400 --> 00:22:08,400
And it's and it's, it's, it's
known in, you know, law as Dave

381
00:22:08,400 --> 00:22:12,320
Murray's Kosov strap.
And there was a guy in Canada

382
00:22:12,320 --> 00:22:17,240
that used to make guitars that
were played by Adrian Smith in

383
00:22:17,240 --> 00:22:19,200
the early 80s.
I can't remember the guy's name,

384
00:22:20,800 --> 00:22:25,280
but I found a black Fender strap
that was basically, it was made

385
00:22:25,280 --> 00:22:29,120
by that guy and it was an exact
replica of Dave Murray's Kosov

386
00:22:29,120 --> 00:22:31,240
strap.
And it was a really beautiful

387
00:22:31,240 --> 00:22:32,480
guitar.
Yeah, it was a beautiful guitar,

388
00:22:32,480 --> 00:22:37,040
played amazingly and it sounded
fantastic, but I could just

389
00:22:37,040 --> 00:22:39,920
never get around the Fender
thing.

390
00:22:39,920 --> 00:22:41,760
I'm, I'm just, you know, like
I'm, I'm.

391
00:22:41,880 --> 00:22:44,880
Here a Les Paul guy it just
doesn't feel right and see I've

392
00:22:44,880 --> 00:22:48,360
never liked Les Pauls like the
neck just feels chunky and gross

393
00:22:48,360 --> 00:22:51,520
to me I like smaller smoother I
don't know I.

394
00:22:51,520 --> 00:22:54,680
Was always AI was always a fan
of the smaller custom necks.

395
00:22:55,120 --> 00:22:57,320
Yeah, the standard necks tend to
be a bit thick, but the custom

396
00:22:57,320 --> 00:22:58,960
necks nice and thin.
Yeah.

397
00:22:59,680 --> 00:23:01,920
But yeah, that that coastal
Strat sounded amazing, but I

398
00:23:01,920 --> 00:23:03,840
just couldn't get my couldn't
get around it.

399
00:23:03,840 --> 00:23:06,000
So huh.
Weird.

400
00:23:06,000 --> 00:23:09,760
And I've always, you know, I've
always liked to play like, you

401
00:23:09,760 --> 00:23:14,320
know, Fender precision bases and
that style of a bass.

402
00:23:14,320 --> 00:23:17,720
Like I, I was obviously growing
up in Canada being a singer and

403
00:23:17,720 --> 00:23:20,280
a bass player.
I was a huge Geddy Lee fan.

404
00:23:20,640 --> 00:23:23,360
And so anytime he bought
something, I had to have it.

405
00:23:23,360 --> 00:23:25,000
So I had a bunch of
Rickenbackers.

406
00:23:25,280 --> 00:23:28,520
I tried the Steinberger when he
went that direction and I just

407
00:23:28,520 --> 00:23:32,160
couldn't groove on a little tiny
rectangular thing with no, no

408
00:23:32,160 --> 00:23:35,680
head on it.
It it just beautiful instrument

409
00:23:35,680 --> 00:23:38,000
but didn't work for me.
It's interesting.

410
00:23:38,880 --> 00:23:40,360
Tell me if you get the parallel
here.

411
00:23:40,360 --> 00:23:45,600
So you ever driven a Tesla?
I have.

412
00:23:46,240 --> 00:23:49,640
Felt like driving an iPhone.
I always.

413
00:23:49,760 --> 00:23:51,480
Yeah, yes, exactly.
That's the same thing.

414
00:23:51,480 --> 00:23:53,520
I say like, if, you know, it's
like everyone's like, you ever

415
00:23:53,520 --> 00:23:54,640
driven a Tesla?
I'm like, yeah, it's like

416
00:23:54,640 --> 00:23:56,560
driving a toaster oven.
Yeah.

417
00:23:56,640 --> 00:24:00,400
It's just got no spirit.
It it's fastest shit.

418
00:24:00,960 --> 00:24:02,640
Yeah, yeah.
But it's just.

419
00:24:02,720 --> 00:24:05,400
Got no clients?
Yeah, it feels, Yeah.

420
00:24:05,400 --> 00:24:08,200
To me it just felt like an
iPhone, Like it's perfect in

421
00:24:08,200 --> 00:24:11,160
every way, but it's boring.
And that's probably what the

422
00:24:11,160 --> 00:24:14,600
Steinberg felt like as well.
Pretty much, yeah.

423
00:24:14,640 --> 00:24:16,800
Yeah, Pretty much didn't even go
out of tune because it had that

424
00:24:16,800 --> 00:24:19,320
special tuning system and stuff,
you know, like it.

425
00:24:19,720 --> 00:24:22,280
It's like you could do anything
to it and it would just be like,

426
00:24:22,280 --> 00:24:25,040
thank you, Sir.
You know, it's like, I like

427
00:24:25,040 --> 00:24:25,200
that.
I.

428
00:24:25,200 --> 00:24:28,560
Was going to say you're, you're
originally from Canada, right?

429
00:24:28,920 --> 00:24:31,040
Yeah.
You're a fan of the tea?

430
00:24:31,040 --> 00:24:35,160
Party the Tea Party.
Yeah, Canadian trio.

431
00:24:37,000 --> 00:24:39,160
No, I don't.
They they might have.

432
00:24:39,240 --> 00:24:41,840
They might have been after I
left already.

433
00:24:41,840 --> 00:24:45,600
It's like Tragically Hip.
Tragically Hip was after I left

434
00:24:45,600 --> 00:24:49,880
in 1991 and Tragically kept
happened after that.

435
00:24:50,280 --> 00:24:54,080
And so I was, people always were
like, Oh my God, how much do you

436
00:24:54,080 --> 00:24:56,000
love Tragically Hip?
And I'm like, I've never even

437
00:24:56,000 --> 00:24:57,520
heard them.
Yeah, I haven't heard a single

438
00:24:57,520 --> 00:24:59,160
song.
And since then I have, of

439
00:24:59,160 --> 00:25:00,680
course.
But yeah, yeah, I'm still not a

440
00:25:00,680 --> 00:25:02,840
fan.
Yeah, the Tea Party is kind of

441
00:25:02,840 --> 00:25:05,400
like, I kind of like, call it
like a Moroccan roll.

442
00:25:05,560 --> 00:25:07,280
Oh.
Really, it's kind of like a.

443
00:25:07,520 --> 00:25:09,120
Bit like Led Zeppelin meets the
Doors.

444
00:25:10,120 --> 00:25:11,400
I would love it.
Really, really good.

445
00:25:11,480 --> 00:25:14,800
Yeah.
But the the league, the guitar

446
00:25:14,800 --> 00:25:18,200
player is one of those guys that
like, everything's open tunings

447
00:25:18,200 --> 00:25:20,080
and modal tunings and all this
sort of stuff.

448
00:25:20,080 --> 00:25:23,760
And it'll, it'll change guitars
every song when they're playing

449
00:25:23,760 --> 00:25:26,720
live because it's really cool.
Les Paul, which has got this

450
00:25:26,720 --> 00:25:28,720
thing called a trans performance
system in it.

451
00:25:29,000 --> 00:25:31,840
And basically it's this whole
series of electric motors and

452
00:25:32,200 --> 00:25:34,160
speciality stuff.
And basically you can record a

453
00:25:34,160 --> 00:25:37,520
bunch of tunings into the guitar
and you push a button and it

454
00:25:37,520 --> 00:25:39,920
will, it will instantly retune
the guitar to that tuning.

455
00:25:39,920 --> 00:25:43,080
So you want to go from, say you
want to go from open C to open

456
00:25:43,080 --> 00:25:44,800
G, you can just push a button
and it'll do it.

457
00:25:44,800 --> 00:25:46,360
And I guess Jimmy Page had one
as well.

458
00:25:46,720 --> 00:25:50,840
But the idea is like, OK, the
chorus is in open C, the verse

459
00:25:50,840 --> 00:25:53,040
is in open G, just like push the
button and you're in that

460
00:25:53,040 --> 00:25:55,400
tuning.
And then you just crazy tick.

461
00:25:55,720 --> 00:25:57,360
You don't have to do anything
with your left hand.

462
00:25:57,360 --> 00:25:59,240
You just sit there and go like
this, you know?

463
00:26:00,000 --> 00:26:01,520
Yeah, that's pretty funny.
Yeah.

464
00:26:01,520 --> 00:26:05,840
No, I, I'm probably, you know,
quite a bit older than you.

465
00:26:05,960 --> 00:26:11,640
And so I for me, it was triumph.
It was like in Canada, it was

466
00:26:11,640 --> 00:26:14,960
triumph.
It was April Wine Gato, which

467
00:26:14,960 --> 00:26:21,000
actually remarkably is our intro
song on on the podcast is a song

468
00:26:21,000 --> 00:26:24,080
by a Canadian trio called Gado
from the 70s and 80s.

469
00:26:24,320 --> 00:26:27,120
And actually he's still out
touring, doing shows right now.

470
00:26:27,120 --> 00:26:30,640
He's a good friend of mine now
and gave us the song for the

471
00:26:30,720 --> 00:26:34,240
intro.
But but yeah, I mean that that

472
00:26:34,240 --> 00:26:38,680
was more like for me it was
Rush, Triumph Saga.

473
00:26:38,880 --> 00:26:41,480
You can tell what direction I
was going with some of my music

474
00:26:41,480 --> 00:26:46,600
there was very progressive and
and that kind of stuff.

475
00:26:46,600 --> 00:26:49,960
And then eventually like
Loverboy and some of the other

476
00:26:49,960 --> 00:26:52,080
newer bands that came out of
Canada as well.

477
00:26:52,080 --> 00:26:56,680
But but yeah, I really was
brought up on Rush and Led

478
00:26:56,680 --> 00:27:00,320
Zeppelin and that kind of stuff.
So some of the newer Canadian

479
00:27:00,320 --> 00:27:04,680
bands I never got to hear cuz I
just wasn't around so.

480
00:27:04,680 --> 00:27:07,640
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
When I'm up in Canada for the

481
00:27:07,640 --> 00:27:10,480
summers now, I try to listen to
some Canadian programming.

482
00:27:10,480 --> 00:27:13,440
Like I'll force myself in the
car, even if I've got satellite

483
00:27:13,440 --> 00:27:16,520
radio and stuff, I'll listen to
local radio just to hear some

484
00:27:16,520 --> 00:27:18,400
new Canadian content.
Over.

485
00:27:18,400 --> 00:27:22,720
Show yeah, yeah, very cool.
So we we've already gone off the

486
00:27:22,720 --> 00:27:26,440
rails here and we've talked
about cars, we've talked about

487
00:27:26,440 --> 00:27:28,120
guitars, we've talked about
music.

488
00:27:28,400 --> 00:27:30,840
Not a word about lighting yet,
so no.

489
00:27:31,120 --> 00:27:33,320
Don't get there.
You've got an interesting

490
00:27:33,320 --> 00:27:38,080
history in that I'm, you know, I
believe you were born in, in

491
00:27:38,080 --> 00:27:39,560
Australia.
Yep.

492
00:27:40,200 --> 00:27:47,800
And grew up born in, Yeah, born
and grew up in Perth, WA, which,

493
00:27:47,880 --> 00:27:51,080
you know, it's the most isolated
capital city in the world.

494
00:27:51,680 --> 00:27:53,280
Yeah.
You know, a lot of people don't

495
00:27:53,280 --> 00:27:56,400
sort of understand the geography
of Australia and they're like,

496
00:27:56,400 --> 00:27:58,040
oh, you're from Sydney.
I'm like, now I'm from Perth on

497
00:27:58,040 --> 00:27:59,240
the West Coast.
Where's that?

498
00:27:59,680 --> 00:28:02,440
I'm like, OK, well, if you
imagine the US, Sydney's New

499
00:28:02,440 --> 00:28:07,000
York, Earth is LA and like, oh,
is it, is it like the same

500
00:28:07,000 --> 00:28:08,280
distance?
I'm like, you have to like

501
00:28:08,720 --> 00:28:11,280
Australia's really big.
I'm like, yeah, you know.

502
00:28:11,440 --> 00:28:13,360
Yeah, it's wild, isn't it?
Because you think of it as an

503
00:28:13,360 --> 00:28:15,120
island.
It's got to be tiny, of course,

504
00:28:15,120 --> 00:28:16,800
right?
But it's, it's really not.

505
00:28:17,040 --> 00:28:19,760
It's funny because a little less
diplomatic.

506
00:28:19,760 --> 00:28:22,240
I had a friend from, well, not
really a friend.

507
00:28:22,240 --> 00:28:26,400
He was in my circle in, in
Western Canada when I was in the

508
00:28:26,400 --> 00:28:29,480
music business there and playing
in bands and, and then

509
00:28:29,480 --> 00:28:33,560
ultimately I went to to work for
and own music stores for a

510
00:28:33,560 --> 00:28:37,080
little for a while.
And but he was a, he was a

511
00:28:37,080 --> 00:28:39,920
musician and a, and a drug
dealer.

512
00:28:40,280 --> 00:28:44,520
And I think the Government of
Canada were pursuing him and he

513
00:28:44,520 --> 00:28:47,280
moved to Australia and he ended
up in Perth for a number of

514
00:28:47,280 --> 00:28:50,000
years.
And he says, Marcel, it's the

515
00:28:50,000 --> 00:28:52,920
fucking shit hole of the planet,
this place.

516
00:28:53,000 --> 00:28:55,360
Really.
Yeah, he hated Perth.

517
00:28:55,360 --> 00:28:59,160
He just couldn't interesting it
and it had something to do with

518
00:28:59,240 --> 00:29:02,160
I, I believe the culture, like
he just didn't fit in, you know,

519
00:29:02,160 --> 00:29:06,280
long, long hair, freaky dude,
very Canadian.

520
00:29:06,400 --> 00:29:08,040
I don't know.
I don't know what it was, but

521
00:29:08,040 --> 00:29:11,200
that was always my only vision
of birth Was interesting because

522
00:29:11,200 --> 00:29:14,960
I've never been there so.
But it's a great place.

523
00:29:15,480 --> 00:29:17,360
Yeah, I'm, you know, like I grow
up here.

524
00:29:17,360 --> 00:29:18,960
It's pretty chill.
It's laid back, you know, the

525
00:29:19,000 --> 00:29:20,480
the beaches are beautiful.
You can.

526
00:29:20,880 --> 00:29:23,360
It's good surfing, you know, I
mean, yeah, it.

527
00:29:24,000 --> 00:29:26,200
When I was growing up here, it
felt like this really sort of

528
00:29:26,200 --> 00:29:29,080
isolated little country town.
Yeah.

529
00:29:29,080 --> 00:29:30,720
Which is probably one of the.
I like that.

530
00:29:30,840 --> 00:29:33,000
Yeah.
I mean, maybe they just didn't

531
00:29:33,000 --> 00:29:35,760
so much when I was 20.
Yeah.

532
00:29:35,760 --> 00:29:37,960
Maybe they just didn't like
runaway drug dealers from

533
00:29:37,960 --> 00:29:39,120
Canada.
Maybe.

534
00:29:39,240 --> 00:29:41,480
Maybe that's what it was.
I think maybe, maybe all the

535
00:29:41,480 --> 00:29:43,440
local drug dealers didn't make
him feel welcome.

536
00:29:43,840 --> 00:29:44,800
Right.
Exactly.

537
00:29:44,800 --> 00:29:46,600
He.
He was a hard guy to get along

538
00:29:46,600 --> 00:29:50,800
with as it was.
So I, I wasn't that shocked that

539
00:29:50,800 --> 00:29:55,080
that he had a hard time getting
on with that place, but yeah.

540
00:29:55,720 --> 00:29:58,720
So anyways, yeah.
So you grew up in Perth?

541
00:29:59,480 --> 00:30:03,080
Yeah, I grew up in Perth and,
you know, it was one of those

542
00:30:03,080 --> 00:30:07,480
things I was when, you know,
like in high school, I was like

543
00:30:07,480 --> 00:30:09,640
a lunchtime library nerd.
I was, you know, like I didn't

544
00:30:09,640 --> 00:30:11,000
really into sports all that
much.

545
00:30:11,000 --> 00:30:14,960
And I was more interested in
sort of, you know, art stuff and

546
00:30:14,960 --> 00:30:20,120
reading and, and then my school
built a new theater and I was

547
00:30:20,120 --> 00:30:21,880
like, oh, this is cool.
And then there was this big

548
00:30:21,880 --> 00:30:24,720
board with buttons on it that
made lights turn on them, like,

549
00:30:24,720 --> 00:30:25,960
oh, this is different.
What's this?

550
00:30:26,320 --> 00:30:28,120
How does this work?
And so I started playing around

551
00:30:28,120 --> 00:30:29,920
with it.
And, and that sort of became my

552
00:30:29,920 --> 00:30:31,760
lunchtime thing.
Instead of going to the library,

553
00:30:31,760 --> 00:30:35,440
I started playing with, with the
lights in the theatre.

554
00:30:36,040 --> 00:30:38,720
And my teacher was like, oh, you
seems like you're kind of into

555
00:30:38,720 --> 00:30:39,800
this.
I'm like, yeah, this is cool.

556
00:30:39,800 --> 00:30:42,960
You can do all this stuff.
And, and she was, she said.

557
00:30:43,160 --> 00:30:46,160
I've got a friend that's doing a
production at A at a theatre in

558
00:30:46,160 --> 00:30:48,360
the city and they're looking for
someone to give them a hand.

559
00:30:49,160 --> 00:30:54,480
And OK, so we had a little minor
post crash over here My my

560
00:30:54,480 --> 00:30:57,720
computer just kind of pulled one
of these to me and time for an

561
00:30:57,720 --> 00:31:01,520
upgrade, yeah, said
unfortunately, I can't even

562
00:31:01,520 --> 00:31:03,600
blame that I upgrade so often
so.

563
00:31:03,600 --> 00:31:04,200
How?
There you go.

564
00:31:04,840 --> 00:31:07,440
But anyways, you were talking
about, you know, basically being

565
00:31:07,440 --> 00:31:10,040
introduced to, to lighting when
you were, I believe, in high

566
00:31:10,040 --> 00:31:16,440
school in Perth, Yeah.
Yeah, So like I said, I started

567
00:31:16,440 --> 00:31:17,760
playing around in the theater at
lunchtime.

568
00:31:17,760 --> 00:31:18,920
It was kind of like, oh, this is
cool.

569
00:31:18,920 --> 00:31:20,800
And I can do these things.
I can make it look different.

570
00:31:21,240 --> 00:31:24,600
And my drama teacher was like, I
seem like you're into this.

571
00:31:24,600 --> 00:31:27,280
And she's like, I've got a
friend that's doing a show in

572
00:31:27,280 --> 00:31:29,760
the city and they're looking for
an extra person to help out.

573
00:31:29,840 --> 00:31:32,640
I was like, oh, cool.
And like 16 at the time or

574
00:31:32,640 --> 00:31:38,080
something.
And it was, it was like working

575
00:31:38,080 --> 00:31:40,240
as a stagehand.
So like moving props and moving

576
00:31:40,240 --> 00:31:41,600
furniture.
And I was like, oh, this, I

577
00:31:41,600 --> 00:31:44,800
haven't done this before.
I'll have a go at this and I

578
00:31:44,800 --> 00:31:49,080
walk in the first day and it's a
production of cabaret and there

579
00:31:49,080 --> 00:31:51,360
were 12 girls in corsets and
fishnets.

580
00:31:51,360 --> 00:31:52,800
And I went.
This is the job for me.

581
00:31:55,200 --> 00:31:56,120
Yeah.
No, it wasn't.

582
00:31:56,280 --> 00:31:58,920
It wasn't just that.
I mean, I, I just love, you

583
00:31:58,920 --> 00:32:02,440
know, like I was very lucky in
the fact that my, my mum was a

584
00:32:02,440 --> 00:32:06,280
teacher and she was always sort
of dragging me to the ballet or

585
00:32:06,280 --> 00:32:09,680
taking me to a play or taking me
to an art gallery and things

586
00:32:09,680 --> 00:32:11,040
like that.
So I'd already sort of been

587
00:32:11,040 --> 00:32:13,560
immersed in the arts and then
the opportunity to work in it

588
00:32:13,560 --> 00:32:17,400
was really cool.
And so I had planned, I did that

589
00:32:17,400 --> 00:32:21,280
show and then I'd finished high
school and I planned to go to

590
00:32:21,680 --> 00:32:24,240
the WA Academy of Performing
Arts, which is here in Perth.

591
00:32:25,160 --> 00:32:29,400
And I applied to go there and do
lighting design and they had a,

592
00:32:29,560 --> 00:32:31,680
they had a policy back then they
didn't take kids straight out of

593
00:32:31,680 --> 00:32:33,520
school.
So I went and got a day job and

594
00:32:33,520 --> 00:32:36,240
I said, I'll just take a gap
year and then I'll apply again.

595
00:32:36,240 --> 00:32:38,040
But then I went and got a job
and I'm like, oh, I'm making

596
00:32:38,040 --> 00:32:40,080
money.
I can afford that hot rod that

597
00:32:40,080 --> 00:32:42,240
I've always wanted.
And that's that thing and that

598
00:32:42,240 --> 00:32:44,320
thing.
And so it can be quite.

599
00:32:44,320 --> 00:32:47,800
Alluring when you're, you know,
when you're a starving lighting,

600
00:32:47,800 --> 00:32:50,680
Yeah, theatrical lighting guy or
musician.

601
00:32:51,200 --> 00:32:54,320
Yeah, and and so you know at.
First, you're a lighting person

602
00:32:54,320 --> 00:32:58,520
first.
I did of both.

603
00:32:58,720 --> 00:33:01,520
I started playing guitar in my
teens and then started playing

604
00:33:01,520 --> 00:33:03,120
with lighting in my teens.
Yeah.

605
00:33:03,680 --> 00:33:06,840
So I come to the time I'm 1718,
I'm I'm still playing around

606
00:33:06,840 --> 00:33:08,640
playing music and playing with
lighting.

607
00:33:08,640 --> 00:33:11,280
And then in my early 20s, I got
more serious with it and was

608
00:33:11,280 --> 00:33:14,320
playing semi professionally.
And, you know, I'd go to go to

609
00:33:14,320 --> 00:33:17,000
gigs and there'd be, you know,
like a sound engineer and then

610
00:33:17,000 --> 00:33:19,400
this lighting console and no one
there to do anything with it.

611
00:33:19,400 --> 00:33:22,240
And I was like, can I do that?
And they went yeah, So I just

612
00:33:22,240 --> 00:33:23,920
started playing around and
people were like, oh, you're

613
00:33:23,920 --> 00:33:26,280
pretty good at this.
And then people actually started

614
00:33:26,280 --> 00:33:28,120
paying me to do the lighting for
their bands.

615
00:33:28,120 --> 00:33:31,720
And I was like, oh, this is fun.
And so that kind of became the

616
00:33:31,720 --> 00:33:33,480
thing I did on the weekend when
I didn't have gigs.

617
00:33:33,480 --> 00:33:35,400
I would go out and do live shows
for people.

618
00:33:36,960 --> 00:33:39,920
And then after about six years
of doing my day job, I was kind

619
00:33:39,920 --> 00:33:42,120
of like, what, what did I look
at doing this lighting thing

620
00:33:42,120 --> 00:33:46,320
again?
So at 26 or 27, I applied for

621
00:33:47,000 --> 00:33:51,000
for Whopper again and got in one
of and it's, it's interesting.

622
00:33:51,000 --> 00:33:55,920
It's it's what was interesting
because it's run like a

623
00:33:55,920 --> 00:33:58,800
professional theater company.
So you know that it's a

624
00:33:58,800 --> 00:34:00,880
three-year well, when I did it
was a three-year course.

625
00:34:00,880 --> 00:34:04,040
I think it's for now, you know,
they'll take 10 people in

626
00:34:04,040 --> 00:34:07,360
lighting, 10 people in sound, 10
people in costume design, 10

627
00:34:07,360 --> 00:34:10,040
people in set design and you
know, all the departments.

628
00:34:10,880 --> 00:34:13,480
But I do, but I find it, I find
it interesting though, that

629
00:34:13,480 --> 00:34:16,560
you're in your mid 20s, you're
already working as a lighting

630
00:34:16,560 --> 00:34:20,120
person, right?
Yet it's important to you to go

631
00:34:20,120 --> 00:34:25,159
back and get this degree.
And So what, what was the, what

632
00:34:25,159 --> 00:34:28,920
was the thought process there?
Like, you know, was it because

633
00:34:28,920 --> 00:34:31,199
you didn't think you could get
certain jobs without that

634
00:34:31,199 --> 00:34:34,159
degree?
Or was it like, no, I'm just

635
00:34:34,159 --> 00:34:38,639
curious because most people who
are already working in the in

636
00:34:38,639 --> 00:34:42,239
that field wouldn't go back and
and get that degree after the

637
00:34:42,239 --> 00:34:42,920
fact.
Well, it wasn't.

638
00:34:43,000 --> 00:34:45,840
I wasn't working professionally
like I wasn't working for a

639
00:34:45,840 --> 00:34:48,159
rental house or or.
PC.

640
00:34:48,600 --> 00:34:50,639
I was, I mean, people were
paying me to do lights for their

641
00:34:50,639 --> 00:34:53,639
vans, but it wasn't like, you
know, I was working for a

642
00:34:53,639 --> 00:34:55,760
production company.
I was just, you know, someone

643
00:34:55,760 --> 00:34:57,760
had seen me do a gig at a pub
and be like, hey man, can you

644
00:34:57,760 --> 00:35:01,000
come and do a house?
So I didn't really, I wasn't

645
00:35:01,000 --> 00:35:04,400
aware of the pathway of like,
oh, hey, look all the time, you

646
00:35:04,400 --> 00:35:05,400
know.
Awareness production, yeah,

647
00:35:05,400 --> 00:35:08,040
that's a that's a good point.
Right there is is because

648
00:35:08,040 --> 00:35:10,600
nowadays, like for sure you
could just walk into a rental

649
00:35:10,600 --> 00:35:13,640
company and say hey, I've done
some gigs, can I clean your

650
00:35:13,640 --> 00:35:16,240
shop?
Yeah, and there might be a

651
00:35:16,280 --> 00:35:18,920
shorter path, may be more
painful, I don't know.

652
00:35:19,440 --> 00:35:22,640
Well, I mean, it's interesting
you think about the pathways

653
00:35:22,640 --> 00:35:26,480
that you could have taken And,
and in fact, me going to warfare

654
00:35:26,480 --> 00:35:30,240
has got, is part, huge part of
got me to where where I am.

655
00:35:30,880 --> 00:35:35,920
So, so yeah, I went, I went,
went to warfare, studied

656
00:35:35,920 --> 00:35:37,720
lighting design because I always
have a passion for learning

657
00:35:37,720 --> 00:35:41,400
things.
And you know, like I said, the

658
00:35:41,400 --> 00:35:44,200
it's, it's a university, but
they run it like a theater.

659
00:35:44,200 --> 00:35:47,840
So 6 * a year they do this two
week production slot and it's

660
00:35:47,840 --> 00:35:52,000
two weeks of 14 hour days.
Like week 1, you, you bump the

661
00:35:52,000 --> 00:35:54,560
show and you build the show, you
do tech, you do rehearsals, you

662
00:35:54,560 --> 00:35:55,960
do all that sort of stuff.
And the second week is

663
00:35:55,960 --> 00:35:58,600
performances and you do that 6 *
a year.

664
00:35:58,600 --> 00:36:01,640
And it's like, you know, you
might work on, you know, in one

665
00:36:01,640 --> 00:36:04,400
year you might work on, you
know, 2 theater pieces of

666
00:36:04,400 --> 00:36:07,920
musical, musical theater,
production and opera, a film

667
00:36:08,200 --> 00:36:13,280
and, and a, you know, like a
musical, all these different,

668
00:36:13,400 --> 00:36:16,240
these varied things.
In fact, my favorite, in fact

669
00:36:16,240 --> 00:36:18,480
one of my favorite ones to do
the whole time was, was, was

670
00:36:18,520 --> 00:36:19,720
opera.
Because those opera kids know

671
00:36:19,720 --> 00:36:21,160
how to party, man.
Crazy.

672
00:36:22,440 --> 00:36:25,960
You wouldn't think.
Yeah, no, but it was, it was, it

673
00:36:25,960 --> 00:36:28,000
was fun.
And so like, it was really like

674
00:36:28,000 --> 00:36:30,920
you really get immersed in, you
know, when you're, when you're

675
00:36:30,920 --> 00:36:33,920
first year, you start off just
as as an electrician and then

676
00:36:34,960 --> 00:36:37,920
you, you know, first year,
second year, you start to board

677
00:36:37,920 --> 00:36:41,120
up third, you know, second year
start to do some designing

678
00:36:41,120 --> 00:36:43,120
stuff.
And then in the meantime, you're

679
00:36:43,120 --> 00:36:46,920
doing, you know, design classes,
electronics classes, you know,

680
00:36:46,960 --> 00:36:49,400
history of history of theater,
history of art, you know, all

681
00:36:49,400 --> 00:36:52,080
this sort of stuff.
You know, there was, there was

682
00:36:52,080 --> 00:36:57,480
a, there was one class we did on
like script analysis, which you

683
00:36:57,480 --> 00:36:59,360
wouldn't think, Oh yeah, script
analysis, whatever.

684
00:36:59,360 --> 00:37:02,000
But as I got further in my
career, I'm like, oh, this is

685
00:37:02,000 --> 00:37:05,840
actually really helpful.
So and it's the same thing like

686
00:37:05,840 --> 00:37:08,520
the day job that I had, you
know, I started out, you know,

687
00:37:08,520 --> 00:37:11,720
sweeping the warehouse and then
got into inventory control and

688
00:37:11,720 --> 00:37:14,280
then into sales and then into
into management.

689
00:37:14,280 --> 00:37:18,040
And it was kind of like, oh, OK,
30 years later, I can look back

690
00:37:18,040 --> 00:37:19,960
and go hang on this skill that
I'm using today.

691
00:37:19,960 --> 00:37:22,480
I learned in that in that first
job.

692
00:37:22,480 --> 00:37:26,680
So it's interesting.
But yeah, so I did my three

693
00:37:26,680 --> 00:37:29,760
years at Whopper and then, you
know, and some great

694
00:37:29,760 --> 00:37:32,080
experiences, worked on some
amazing stuff, really got to

695
00:37:32,640 --> 00:37:39,560
push the boundaries of what
design is, how it works, learn

696
00:37:39,560 --> 00:37:41,840
the insurance and outs of it
and, and have a safe training

697
00:37:41,840 --> 00:37:44,000
ground and be like, I really
want to try this thing.

698
00:37:44,000 --> 00:37:47,160
And, and OK, that didn't work.
Why didn't that work?

699
00:37:47,160 --> 00:37:50,080
OK, here's why it didn't work.
Type that, move on.

700
00:37:50,080 --> 00:37:52,320
And then in the next design
thing, go, oh, what about this?

701
00:37:52,400 --> 00:37:54,880
OK, now it works.
You know, like it's joining all

702
00:37:54,880 --> 00:37:58,080
those links and you know, like I
do have a lighting design

703
00:37:58,080 --> 00:38:01,560
degree, but I haven't actually
done a huge amount of lighting

704
00:38:01,560 --> 00:38:05,200
design as a professional.
I certainly used it, used that

705
00:38:05,200 --> 00:38:07,360
skill set when I've since I've
been working in the film

706
00:38:07,360 --> 00:38:09,240
industry.
But, you know, like it.

707
00:38:10,280 --> 00:38:11,960
I I it's a discipline too,
right?

708
00:38:11,960 --> 00:38:14,800
It's a discipline.
It's like it's, you know,

709
00:38:14,800 --> 00:38:17,920
learning the right ways to do
things doesn't mean every time

710
00:38:17,920 --> 00:38:19,280
you do it, you're going to do it
that way.

711
00:38:19,280 --> 00:38:22,760
But, you know, right from wrong
and you are disciplined and you

712
00:38:22,760 --> 00:38:25,840
have been through that process
and and, you know, you've got

713
00:38:25,840 --> 00:38:27,520
the card to, to prove it.
Yeah.

714
00:38:27,680 --> 00:38:30,640
But yeah, they were very
specific to theater lighting,

715
00:38:30,640 --> 00:38:32,680
right?
It it was very much a theater.

716
00:38:33,360 --> 00:38:34,960
Yeah, yeah.
I mean, you know, like I said,

717
00:38:34,960 --> 00:38:38,000
you, you covered all the, all
the, you know, theatre, musical

718
00:38:38,000 --> 00:38:43,160
theatre, dance, you know, you
learned the difference between,

719
00:38:43,160 --> 00:38:45,800
you know, backlight, frontlight,
side light, the different places

720
00:38:45,800 --> 00:38:47,880
you use different kinds of
lighting and all this sort of

721
00:38:48,520 --> 00:38:51,360
stuff.
Yeah, they did do a couple of,

722
00:38:52,160 --> 00:38:54,600
you know, every year they would
do like a film project.

723
00:38:55,600 --> 00:38:58,440
And I worked on on a couple of
the film projects and I didn't

724
00:38:58,440 --> 00:39:01,280
really think it was something I
was very interested in.

725
00:39:01,280 --> 00:39:04,000
I mean, I wanted, I originally
wanted to be a verilite tech.

726
00:39:04,280 --> 00:39:06,280
That's what I wanted to realize
into the nerdy stuff.

727
00:39:06,280 --> 00:39:08,080
Yeah.
I wanted to be a verilite tech.

728
00:39:08,080 --> 00:39:09,840
Or until with Maiden or
something like that.

729
00:39:10,200 --> 00:39:12,560
Yeah.
And still could.

730
00:39:13,280 --> 00:39:15,320
Still could.
Yeah, Yeah, Yeah.

731
00:39:15,360 --> 00:39:16,840
I still.
Don't need as many verilite.

732
00:39:16,840 --> 00:39:19,560
I could get into that.
They don't need as many verilite

733
00:39:19,560 --> 00:39:21,320
techs as they used to.
But no.

734
00:39:22,120 --> 00:39:24,560
But you still but certainly
could Iron Maiden or still

735
00:39:24,560 --> 00:39:28,080
touring shockingly.
Yeah, when I was at Whopper, I

736
00:39:28,080 --> 00:39:31,640
started working on, on local
cruise, you know, a big, a big

737
00:39:31,640 --> 00:39:34,800
tour would come into town and
they'd need, you know, guys to,

738
00:39:35,000 --> 00:39:37,040
to load in and guys to run
follow spots.

739
00:39:37,040 --> 00:39:42,720
Like that's How I Met Cosmo.
You know, just all these

740
00:39:42,720 --> 00:39:45,960
interesting experiences working
on these big shows and, and

741
00:39:45,960 --> 00:39:48,520
seeing all this stuff and, and
it's like, oh, cool.

742
00:39:48,520 --> 00:39:52,880
And you know, like I said, I
met, I met Cosmo on an ACDC tour

743
00:39:53,440 --> 00:39:56,440
and I go from the house to do
something in, in Perth.

744
00:39:56,440 --> 00:39:57,560
Yeah, yeah.
Oh, wow.

745
00:39:58,240 --> 00:40:02,000
I actually, I actually saw him
at LDI this year, well, last

746
00:40:02,000 --> 00:40:03,480
year.
And I was like, hey man, I don't

747
00:40:03,480 --> 00:40:06,160
know if we've actually, we met
in person a very long time ago.

748
00:40:06,160 --> 00:40:09,480
I was spot #3 in Perth.
And he's like, Oh yeah, cool.

749
00:40:09,480 --> 00:40:11,120
And you know so.
And he's saying.

750
00:40:11,120 --> 00:40:12,680
He's going to be over here later
this year.

751
00:40:12,680 --> 00:40:15,360
But, you know, like I went in
front of house with him and I'd

752
00:40:15,360 --> 00:40:17,680
never seen, like, an icon
console before.

753
00:40:18,000 --> 00:40:20,360
This is going to die.
Yeah, like, oh, what's this

754
00:40:20,360 --> 00:40:21,440
thing?
He says, oh, it's an icon.

755
00:40:21,440 --> 00:40:22,680
And I was like, oh, why do you
use that?

756
00:40:22,680 --> 00:40:24,440
And he says, oh, it's the only
thing that will run icons.

757
00:40:24,440 --> 00:40:28,040
And I went, OK, fair enough.
And that makes.

758
00:40:28,040 --> 00:40:30,160
Sense, you know, I had some cool
experiences like that.

759
00:40:30,240 --> 00:40:33,840
And then part of the part of the
third year you had to go and do

760
00:40:33,840 --> 00:40:35,680
an internship with a
professional company.

761
00:40:36,640 --> 00:40:39,320
And you know, like I had a there
was a few guys that sort of went

762
00:40:39,320 --> 00:40:42,080
to the Sydney Opera House and
went to, you know, big

763
00:40:42,080 --> 00:40:44,160
production companies on the East
Coast.

764
00:40:44,160 --> 00:40:50,040
And, but my mom had a friend who
worked at the Oregon Shakespeare

765
00:40:50,040 --> 00:40:54,680
Festival in Ashland, Ashland in
Southern Oregon, it's this tiny

766
00:40:54,680 --> 00:40:58,520
little town that may not 25,000
people, but they have the third

767
00:40:58,520 --> 00:41:00,800
biggest repertory theatre
company in America there.

768
00:41:01,120 --> 00:41:03,040
You know, it's a, it's a
Shakespeare festival that runs

769
00:41:03,040 --> 00:41:07,080
for 10 months and does nearly
800 performances in a season in,

770
00:41:07,280 --> 00:41:08,880
in three theaters.
It's, it's a big thing.

771
00:41:10,720 --> 00:41:15,000
And it was one of those things.
This lady had come to visit mom

772
00:41:15,040 --> 00:41:17,480
in Australia and do some
workshops on Shakespeare.

773
00:41:18,000 --> 00:41:20,160
And we were having dinner one
night and I was telling you

774
00:41:20,160 --> 00:41:21,560
about this internship that I had
to do.

775
00:41:21,560 --> 00:41:24,080
And she's like, well, you
should, you should call up the

776
00:41:24,080 --> 00:41:25,680
master electrician, Come and do
it at the festival.

777
00:41:25,680 --> 00:41:26,680
I'm like, yeah, that's going to
happen.

778
00:41:28,160 --> 00:41:30,720
And sure enough, I called him.
I was like, hey, man, I got told

779
00:41:30,880 --> 00:41:32,360
you call.
He's like, yeah, when do you

780
00:41:32,360 --> 00:41:35,360
want to be here?
July.

781
00:41:36,080 --> 00:41:38,520
Yeah, Sure enough, I went to
Ashland for six weeks and did an

782
00:41:38,520 --> 00:41:40,440
internship there.
And it was amazing just to.

783
00:41:41,080 --> 00:41:43,200
I mean, it's, yeah.
I mean, it's just an amazing

784
00:41:43,200 --> 00:41:46,760
level of of professional theatre
like the likes of.

785
00:41:47,400 --> 00:41:49,040
Was that your first time over to
the US?

786
00:41:49,640 --> 00:41:52,080
That was, yeah, that was in July
2000.

787
00:41:52,080 --> 00:41:52,840
It was my first.
Wow.

788
00:41:52,960 --> 00:41:57,200
Yeah, Yeah, it was pretty cool.
And like I said, I had a blast.

789
00:41:57,200 --> 00:42:00,640
A beautiful place, great people,
good work, really good work.

790
00:42:00,640 --> 00:42:03,240
Yeah.
And at the end of it, they were

791
00:42:03,240 --> 00:42:05,520
like, hey, man, if you ever end
up back here, we've got a job

792
00:42:05,520 --> 00:42:10,360
for you.
OK, So I, I went back to Perth

793
00:42:11,000 --> 00:42:14,040
and you know, there was, I met a
girl while I was there.

794
00:42:14,040 --> 00:42:15,240
You know, this thing sometimes
happen.

795
00:42:16,240 --> 00:42:19,160
So I went back to Perth and I
was doing my thing and, you

796
00:42:19,160 --> 00:42:24,080
know, graduated actually was I
was supposed to at the end of

797
00:42:24,400 --> 00:42:28,520
every season or the end of every
year, they take the graduating

798
00:42:28,640 --> 00:42:30,720
performance class on the
showcase tour.

799
00:42:31,960 --> 00:42:36,120
And I'd actually, it was, it was
a real fight to be the LD on

800
00:42:36,120 --> 00:42:39,360
showcase and I'd actually been
chosen to do it that year.

801
00:42:40,680 --> 00:42:43,920
But but one of the previous
productions I'd done in our

802
00:42:43,920 --> 00:42:47,880
production slots was the one of
the film projects.

803
00:42:48,400 --> 00:42:51,040
And it turned out like, I hadn't
really thought I'd be interested

804
00:42:51,040 --> 00:42:53,840
in working on film, but I worked
on this film and it was really

805
00:42:53,840 --> 00:42:55,480
cool.
And the director of photography

806
00:42:55,480 --> 00:42:58,080
was really cool.
And he was in the motorcycles, I

807
00:42:58,080 --> 00:42:59,960
was in the motorcycles.
We got, we talked about

808
00:42:59,960 --> 00:43:03,280
motorcycles a lot and, and he
was really open and, and willing

809
00:43:03,280 --> 00:43:05,520
to talk to me about the process
and what we were doing and how

810
00:43:05,520 --> 00:43:09,960
things were happening.
And a lot of the production team

811
00:43:09,960 --> 00:43:12,120
that they would bring in for
those film things were

812
00:43:12,120 --> 00:43:14,960
professionals from the industry
in Perth.

813
00:43:15,000 --> 00:43:18,600
And apparently I made an
impression because it was about

814
00:43:18,600 --> 00:43:21,240
3 months before my course was
due to end and I got a phone

815
00:43:21,240 --> 00:43:24,880
call from one of the guys that
had been working as a producer

816
00:43:24,880 --> 00:43:27,400
on our student film.
And he's like, hey, there's,

817
00:43:28,000 --> 00:43:30,800
there's a big movie coming to
town and they need another

818
00:43:30,800 --> 00:43:32,800
electrician.
Would you be interested in

819
00:43:32,800 --> 00:43:35,320
working on it?
And I went, well, I'm still at,

820
00:43:35,440 --> 00:43:37,160
I'm still at uni.
I don't think I can.

821
00:43:37,600 --> 00:43:39,480
And he said, we'll go and ask
your lectures and see if they'll

822
00:43:39,480 --> 00:43:42,640
let you do it.
So I went and I said, hey, look,

823
00:43:42,640 --> 00:43:44,080
I've been offered this
opportunity.

824
00:43:44,280 --> 00:43:45,840
I know I'm supposed to be doing
showcase.

825
00:43:45,840 --> 00:43:48,840
And they were both like, listen
man, it's a it's a $10 million

826
00:43:48,840 --> 00:43:50,400
movie.
You, you go and do it.

827
00:43:50,600 --> 00:43:51,840
You have a blessing.
Go.

828
00:43:52,440 --> 00:43:54,240
That's amazing.
Yeah.

829
00:43:54,240 --> 00:43:56,680
So it was, it was cool because I
got to go and work on this

830
00:43:56,680 --> 00:44:00,040
professional, you know, like
multi $1,000,000 budget movie.

831
00:44:00,360 --> 00:44:02,000
I hadn't even graduated college
yet.

832
00:44:02,120 --> 00:44:06,800
And yeah, I found, wow, this is
really, this is a very different

833
00:44:06,800 --> 00:44:10,640
discipline from what I'm doing,
but it's also really cool.

834
00:44:10,640 --> 00:44:15,720
It's different, you know, and I
sort of started to learn that

835
00:44:15,720 --> 00:44:18,920
there's a philosophy that I
developed later on.

836
00:44:18,920 --> 00:44:21,640
One of the things I always liked
about touring was you were

837
00:44:21,640 --> 00:44:24,240
different places and different
challenges and new things every

838
00:44:24,240 --> 00:44:27,400
day.
And films are like that, a lot

839
00:44:27,400 --> 00:44:28,720
like that.
But generally you get to sleep

840
00:44:28,720 --> 00:44:31,400
in your own bed every night,
which is really nice.

841
00:44:32,000 --> 00:44:34,840
That's a nice benefit, yeah.
Yeah, and the catering is pretty

842
00:44:34,840 --> 00:44:36,240
good and the pay is not bad
either.

843
00:44:36,240 --> 00:44:39,680
So, you know, I went and did
this film before I'd even

844
00:44:39,680 --> 00:44:42,520
graduated.
And then I graduated and I went

845
00:44:42,520 --> 00:44:44,520
and worked at local production
companies.

846
00:44:44,960 --> 00:44:48,600
You know, I would take, you
know, I would take shows out and

847
00:44:48,600 --> 00:44:51,920
do small regional tours.
And I worked as a bench tech and

848
00:44:51,920 --> 00:44:55,680
a repair tech and programmer.
And that's I really got at a few

849
00:44:55,680 --> 00:44:58,640
people sort of take me under
their wing and teach me a lot

850
00:44:58,640 --> 00:45:00,840
about programming, which is
really cool because obviously

851
00:45:01,360 --> 00:45:03,960
programming for live events is
very, very different from, you

852
00:45:03,960 --> 00:45:05,680
know, doing theater.
Yeah.

853
00:45:06,360 --> 00:45:07,880
I mean, I remember I was working
on a show.

854
00:45:07,880 --> 00:45:11,400
I kind of remember what it was,
but I remember the the program.

855
00:45:11,400 --> 00:45:14,080
I don't remember his name, but
the thing I remember about him

856
00:45:14,080 --> 00:45:17,000
was he always had Vegemite
sandwiches and he always carried

857
00:45:17,000 --> 00:45:19,720
like a gallon jug of milk.
That was the only stuff I ever

858
00:45:19,720 --> 00:45:20,040
saw.
He.

859
00:45:20,040 --> 00:45:21,680
Made.
Yeah.

860
00:45:21,680 --> 00:45:25,360
Vegemite, this is this is a
thing that you guys.

861
00:45:26,960 --> 00:45:29,480
Very Australian thing.
I just don't start it.

862
00:45:29,480 --> 00:45:31,880
I've tried it and went yeah it's
not for me.

863
00:45:32,160 --> 00:45:35,800
It's isn't a quiet taste.
Yeah, but he was running this

864
00:45:35,800 --> 00:45:37,920
big show and he's running on a
whole hog too.

865
00:45:38,600 --> 00:45:41,360
And I was looking at his at his
group layout, and I'm like,

866
00:45:41,360 --> 00:45:43,560
what's that all about?
This is all all over the place.

867
00:45:43,560 --> 00:45:46,200
He says, oh, that's my map.
I went, what?

868
00:45:46,640 --> 00:45:50,040
He said, well, I lay my groups
out in a way that it looks like

869
00:45:50,040 --> 00:45:51,440
the plot.
So instead of looking at the

870
00:45:51,440 --> 00:45:54,000
plot, I just look at my groups
and go, I want those ones.

871
00:45:54,800 --> 00:45:57,280
And I went, wow, that's really
cool.

872
00:45:57,520 --> 00:45:59,720
Seems pretty logical.
Yeah.

873
00:45:59,720 --> 00:46:02,360
And that's a philosophy that I
then started using and started

874
00:46:02,360 --> 00:46:05,600
using until, you know, the
adventation of, you know, 2D

875
00:46:05,600 --> 00:46:07,960
plots or layout views or magic
sheets or whatever you want to

876
00:46:07,960 --> 00:46:09,160
call them.
Yeah, yeah.

877
00:46:09,160 --> 00:46:12,160
Lay your groups out like the
plot.

878
00:46:12,160 --> 00:46:15,200
And then you just go, oh, yeah,
moving on.

879
00:46:15,240 --> 00:46:18,080
You know, it was just like, and
there was a lot of instances

880
00:46:18,080 --> 00:46:23,160
like that where people gave me
tidbits of information that

881
00:46:23,160 --> 00:46:28,760
really formed, you know, how I
how I process stuff now and

882
00:46:28,760 --> 00:46:31,960
think about it.
And yeah, you know, it's a good.

883
00:46:31,960 --> 00:46:35,560
Point though, that that because
I think a lot of people think

884
00:46:35,560 --> 00:46:38,120
you should get out of school and
immediately go and design

885
00:46:38,200 --> 00:46:40,560
lighting for The Beatles reunion
or something, right.

886
00:46:40,560 --> 00:46:45,000
But The thing is, you have to
work for some great designers to

887
00:46:45,000 --> 00:46:49,080
to build your entire toolbox.
Like school isn't going to teach

888
00:46:49,080 --> 00:46:52,920
you exactly what it's like in
some sense.

889
00:46:52,920 --> 00:46:55,920
So, but no, honestly, like
again, I want to go back to

890
00:46:55,920 --> 00:46:58,920
this, this idea of school.
Yeah.

891
00:46:59,360 --> 00:47:02,800
You know, I, I was one that
jumped out of school because I

892
00:47:02,800 --> 00:47:06,720
just thought I was smart enough
and didn't need it and I wanted

893
00:47:06,720 --> 00:47:09,280
to do things my way.
And I'm not saying that's the

894
00:47:09,280 --> 00:47:12,040
right way for for young people
to do it these days.

895
00:47:12,040 --> 00:47:16,360
Maybe, maybe not.
But you were very committed to

896
00:47:16,360 --> 00:47:18,440
completing school.
Like you got this, this

897
00:47:18,440 --> 00:47:23,320
opportunity in Oregon, you did
the internship, they offered you

898
00:47:23,360 --> 00:47:26,240
a gig and you said, OK, maybe
once I'm done school.

899
00:47:26,440 --> 00:47:30,360
It was always school 1st and and
everything else 2nd.

900
00:47:30,760 --> 00:47:33,640
And it blows me away how
committed you were to it.

901
00:47:33,640 --> 00:47:35,760
Like was that, did that have
something to do with your

902
00:47:35,760 --> 00:47:37,120
parents?
Did your parents push you?

903
00:47:37,120 --> 00:47:39,240
Really, you better finish your
degree first.

904
00:47:39,360 --> 00:47:42,160
No, no, not really.
I mean, I mean, mom was a

905
00:47:42,160 --> 00:47:46,000
teacher and and you know, she,
she also, you know, she did a

906
00:47:46,000 --> 00:47:47,840
master's degree.
She had a doctorate in in

907
00:47:47,840 --> 00:47:50,160
philosophy.
My dad.

908
00:47:50,240 --> 00:47:52,360
My dad was actually a master
sheet metal worker.

909
00:47:52,920 --> 00:47:54,760
Yeah.
Like you give him a piece of

910
00:47:54,760 --> 00:47:56,800
steel and a drawing, he can make
anything.

911
00:47:57,200 --> 00:47:58,480
Yeah.
And you?

912
00:47:58,480 --> 00:48:01,520
Know two of them really shaped
who you've become, though, You

913
00:48:01,520 --> 00:48:03,000
know, when you think about it,
yeah.

914
00:48:03,200 --> 00:48:05,440
Well, and it's ironic, you know,
because my mom was always like,

915
00:48:05,480 --> 00:48:06,640
oh, you'd make a really good
teacher.

916
00:48:06,640 --> 00:48:08,080
And now that's a big part of
what I do.

917
00:48:08,600 --> 00:48:09,600
Yeah.
Yeah.

918
00:48:09,600 --> 00:48:13,720
You know, And no, I, I just
think I, I very much like to

919
00:48:13,720 --> 00:48:18,680
start things and finish them and
just take on board that you, you

920
00:48:18,680 --> 00:48:22,520
start on a pass and you're never
quite going to learn exactly

921
00:48:22,720 --> 00:48:24,280
where it takes you until you
finish it.

922
00:48:24,680 --> 00:48:25,920
You know what?
I mean and.

923
00:48:25,920 --> 00:48:28,400
So I, I think it's just
something that I was really

924
00:48:28,400 --> 00:48:30,640
enjoying doing.
I was enjoying the experience.

925
00:48:30,640 --> 00:48:33,440
I was working with cool people.
I mean, you know, my head

926
00:48:33,440 --> 00:48:37,000
lecturer at the time was one of
the best LDS in the country.

927
00:48:37,400 --> 00:48:40,560
Yeah.
And so, you know, it was like it

928
00:48:40,560 --> 00:48:43,560
was, it was astounding to me,
like the first six months I was

929
00:48:43,560 --> 00:48:45,360
there, he'd come up to me and be
like, we're not going too slow

930
00:48:45,360 --> 00:48:47,040
for you.
I'm like, Nah, man, you just,

931
00:48:47,040 --> 00:48:48,720
you just do you.
I'm just sitting here soaking it

932
00:48:48,720 --> 00:48:50,240
all in, you know?
That's great, yeah.

933
00:48:51,080 --> 00:48:53,640
And it no, it's just.
Again, I'm not, I'm not bagging

934
00:48:53,640 --> 00:48:57,560
on school at all because yeah,
again, I chose a different path

935
00:48:58,120 --> 00:49:04,520
and and it served me well.
But and, you know, in a lot of

936
00:49:04,840 --> 00:49:09,920
situations, I think that young
people become professional

937
00:49:09,920 --> 00:49:13,760
students because it, you know,
it seems to be the easier path

938
00:49:13,760 --> 00:49:18,200
in some, in some cases.
I look at a lot of students who

939
00:49:18,200 --> 00:49:21,800
are rotting away and could do
very well if they just jumped in

940
00:49:21,840 --> 00:49:24,800
head 1st and went and did that
thing instead of learning about

941
00:49:24,800 --> 00:49:27,720
that thing.
And so, but I think there's two

942
00:49:27,720 --> 00:49:30,160
sides to it.
And I'm Joe, I'm not putting

943
00:49:30,160 --> 00:49:33,040
down your commitment to school.
I'm actually very appreciative

944
00:49:33,040 --> 00:49:37,160
and in awe of your commitment to
finish it because you got

945
00:49:37,160 --> 00:49:40,160
offered some cool things.
But it was always back to, like

946
00:49:40,160 --> 00:49:43,760
you said, this movie.
Yeah, you had to go and ask your

947
00:49:43,760 --> 00:49:45,760
professors first if you could do
it.

948
00:49:46,440 --> 00:49:49,040
Yeah, I mean, yeah.
And, and, you know, luckily they

949
00:49:49,040 --> 00:49:51,320
were very supportive of it.
Yeah.

950
00:49:51,640 --> 00:49:55,080
I think they recognized a little
bit of talent there and, and

951
00:49:55,080 --> 00:49:57,000
just a commitment to to the
craft.

952
00:49:57,520 --> 00:50:01,320
Yeah.
And, you know, they, they just

953
00:50:01,320 --> 00:50:03,640
sort of opened doors for me.
I think they sort of like, well,

954
00:50:03,640 --> 00:50:04,880
there's not much else we can
teach you here.

955
00:50:04,880 --> 00:50:07,320
Go and learn this other thing
from yeah, from these other

956
00:50:07,320 --> 00:50:09,480
people.
And, you know, I met some people

957
00:50:09,480 --> 00:50:12,000
on there that I'm still in
contact with, which is amazing.

958
00:50:12,720 --> 00:50:15,320
Yeah.
But yeah, no, it was it.

959
00:50:16,840 --> 00:50:19,600
I always sort of looked at
school as a as a pathway and an

960
00:50:19,600 --> 00:50:23,040
opportunity to learn stuff and
grow and realizing that I, I

961
00:50:23,040 --> 00:50:25,680
think, you know, I already had a
bit of natural talent, you know,

962
00:50:25,680 --> 00:50:29,360
not to sound.
Yeah, you know, yeah, just my

963
00:50:29,360 --> 00:50:31,360
ability to do you.
Like it, it sounds like it.

964
00:50:31,360 --> 00:50:34,000
I mean, and, and you know, those
who get offered the best

965
00:50:34,000 --> 00:50:36,640
opportunities are usually the
ones who are recognized with

966
00:50:36,640 --> 00:50:39,440
that talent, whether you're, you
know, whether you're a lighting

967
00:50:39,440 --> 00:50:42,800
person or a racing driver or a
movie star or whatever it is

968
00:50:42,800 --> 00:50:44,080
like.
Yeah, if someone says.

969
00:50:44,200 --> 00:50:46,680
They're going to find you.
Yeah, someone says something in

970
00:50:46,680 --> 00:50:48,480
you and they want to, they
either want to foster that or

971
00:50:48,480 --> 00:50:50,720
they want to get into their
advantage, which is fine because

972
00:50:51,000 --> 00:50:53,000
you can do that and I'm still
going to learn something from

973
00:50:53,000 --> 00:50:55,680
it.
But yeah, no, I mean, school was

974
00:50:55,680 --> 00:50:58,000
cool and I opened some doors,
like it got me to America, for

975
00:50:58,000 --> 00:51:00,000
God's sake, so I don't regret
that at all.

976
00:51:01,480 --> 00:51:04,600
But yeah, so I sort of finished
school and then I did a couple

977
00:51:04,600 --> 00:51:07,600
of years in Perth and then, you
know, things with the girl in

978
00:51:07,600 --> 00:51:10,040
America got to be more serious.
So I ended up going back there

979
00:51:10,040 --> 00:51:13,040
for a bit and then she moved to
Australia and then we got

980
00:51:13,040 --> 00:51:15,160
married and it was like, she was
like, I really want to be back

981
00:51:15,160 --> 00:51:16,680
home.
And I went, OK, well, I know

982
00:51:16,680 --> 00:51:18,800
I've got a job there for what?
Because she lived in Ashland.

983
00:51:19,680 --> 00:51:23,360
So I we, we moved back to
Ashland and I worked at the

984
00:51:23,360 --> 00:51:27,400
Shakespeare Festival for three
years and it was really good.

985
00:51:28,840 --> 00:51:33,800
And like I said, amazing work.
But Rep theater is one of those

986
00:51:34,400 --> 00:51:37,400
things where you go in and you
do it and you do it and you do

987
00:51:37,400 --> 00:51:39,720
it and you do it every day and
you do it.

988
00:51:39,920 --> 00:51:41,400
And I was just.
Like I just got a little.

989
00:51:42,440 --> 00:51:45,800
I wanted to be like pushing the
envelope and learning new things

990
00:51:45,800 --> 00:51:50,680
and, and, and changing.
And as seems to have happened in

991
00:51:50,680 --> 00:51:53,280
a lot of my career, one day I
was in my apartment and I went

992
00:51:53,280 --> 00:51:57,800
out the back and I see a line of
trucks parked across the street.

993
00:51:57,880 --> 00:52:01,120
And I went, that looks like a
film crew.

994
00:52:01,400 --> 00:52:04,400
So I walked across the street
and they were shooting at a

995
00:52:04,400 --> 00:52:05,960
restaurant there.
And I've sort of stood there on

996
00:52:05,960 --> 00:52:08,120
the curb and I went, OK, that's
the best boy.

997
00:52:08,800 --> 00:52:11,720
That's the group, that's the DP,
that's the gaffer who's everyone

998
00:52:11,720 --> 00:52:13,600
else.
And, and I waited.

999
00:52:13,760 --> 00:52:16,200
I looked around all the trucks.
I went, OK, this is the lighting

1000
00:52:16,200 --> 00:52:17,240
truck.
So I just stood there at the

1001
00:52:17,240 --> 00:52:20,400
gate and I waited for this guy
to walk, walk out of the gate or

1002
00:52:20,400 --> 00:52:22,320
walk out of the set and walk up
onto the truck.

1003
00:52:22,320 --> 00:52:24,600
And I just walked up on the
tailgate and I went get a, I'm

1004
00:52:24,640 --> 00:52:25,800
chalky.
How you going, mate?

1005
00:52:26,120 --> 00:52:27,400
And he's like, oh, you're
Australian.

1006
00:52:27,400 --> 00:52:33,280
I went, yeah, sometimes being
Australian will work to your

1007
00:52:33,280 --> 00:52:36,400
advantage.
So yeah, get their attention.

1008
00:52:36,600 --> 00:52:38,640
Yeah, exactly.
So I got talking to us like, hey

1009
00:52:38,640 --> 00:52:40,800
man, you know, like I work at
the Shakespeare Festival in the

1010
00:52:40,800 --> 00:52:43,760
lighting tech.
I'm a programmer and, you know,

1011
00:52:43,760 --> 00:52:45,440
I did a bit of film work in
Australia.

1012
00:52:45,440 --> 00:52:48,080
If you guys ever need a hand,
give me a call.

1013
00:52:48,520 --> 00:52:50,960
So I gave him my number and
thought, oh, he's probably not

1014
00:52:50,960 --> 00:52:54,000
going to call, but OK, couple of
months later I got a phone call.

1015
00:52:54,000 --> 00:52:56,160
It's like, hey man, we're doing
this little movie in town and we

1016
00:52:56,160 --> 00:52:58,040
need another guy.
Yeah, cool.

1017
00:52:58,040 --> 00:53:00,840
Well, it's just happens to fall
right into the offseason of the

1018
00:53:01,000 --> 00:53:02,720
of the Shakespeare Festival.
Yeah.

1019
00:53:02,720 --> 00:53:05,080
So, you know, perfect.
I would say I've had like a 10

1020
00:53:05,080 --> 00:53:08,160
week, 10 week hiatus.
This was an 8 week movie that

1021
00:53:08,160 --> 00:53:09,520
happened slot right in the
middle.

1022
00:53:10,200 --> 00:53:11,680
Yeah, wow.
Sometimes you get lucky.

1023
00:53:11,920 --> 00:53:15,320
So I'm like, OK, cool.
So I rock up and I haven't ever

1024
00:53:15,320 --> 00:53:17,520
worked on a movie in America.
All of the power stuffs

1025
00:53:17,520 --> 00:53:18,960
different.
All of the connection types are

1026
00:53:18,960 --> 00:53:22,000
different.
I'm just like, OK, I'm like

1027
00:53:22,120 --> 00:53:23,800
trying to learn it all in the
first week.

1028
00:53:24,360 --> 00:53:25,840
Yeah.
And at the end of the first

1029
00:53:25,840 --> 00:53:27,880
week, the gaffer gets into a
fight with the production

1030
00:53:27,880 --> 00:53:29,160
manager.
He gets fired.

1031
00:53:29,520 --> 00:53:33,400
The best boy quits.
And the third electrician says,

1032
00:53:33,400 --> 00:53:35,400
I don't want to do this anymore.
I'm going to go and be a group.

1033
00:53:35,400 --> 00:53:38,640
So I'm the last guy standing.
And I'm like, this is my first,

1034
00:53:38,720 --> 00:53:41,640
first time.
Holy shit.

1035
00:53:41,920 --> 00:53:43,160
So they're bringing this crew
of.

1036
00:53:43,320 --> 00:53:45,560
So they're bringing this crew of
guys from Portland.

1037
00:53:45,880 --> 00:53:48,240
None of them I'd ever met.
And they're like, who are you?

1038
00:53:48,240 --> 00:53:51,040
And I'm like the new guy, I
don't really know.

1039
00:53:51,160 --> 00:53:53,480
And they, I thought, oh, I'm
going to get fired.

1040
00:53:53,480 --> 00:53:58,440
I'm going to get fired.
And I thought I was still on

1041
00:53:58,440 --> 00:54:00,720
thin ice.
And then, you know, second or

1042
00:54:00,720 --> 00:54:02,560
third day I get AI get it to the
truck.

1043
00:54:02,560 --> 00:54:05,680
I put my radio on and I'm
getting and it's pandemonium.

1044
00:54:05,680 --> 00:54:07,200
There's like pandemonium
happening.

1045
00:54:07,560 --> 00:54:09,120
And I'm like, hey, what's going
on, fellas?

1046
00:54:09,120 --> 00:54:10,360
They're like.
Oh, where does Santa?

1047
00:54:10,360 --> 00:54:13,560
There's a 2.
Board and I'm like right here we

1048
00:54:13,560 --> 00:54:16,640
go, where is it?
And they're like, it's up there.

1049
00:54:16,880 --> 00:54:18,720
Panic stations.
I woke up.

1050
00:54:18,720 --> 00:54:20,360
It's like an old ATC express or
something.

1051
00:54:20,360 --> 00:54:21,480
I'm like, what do you want to
see, fellas?

1052
00:54:21,480 --> 00:54:25,640
And they're like, and I'm like,
OK, how's that?

1053
00:54:29,080 --> 00:54:31,640
I'm suddenly the IT guy.
Wow, wow.

1054
00:54:31,640 --> 00:54:32,960
And.
That's amazing.

1055
00:54:33,600 --> 00:54:36,240
And within three months I was
living in Portland, OR working

1056
00:54:36,240 --> 00:54:39,360
on a Morgan Freeman movie.
Jesus.

1057
00:54:39,520 --> 00:54:41,920
That's incredible.
It was it was one of those

1058
00:54:41,920 --> 00:54:44,480
things I worked with those guys
for, for actually it was more

1059
00:54:44,480 --> 00:54:46,720
than three months I worked with
those guys for that the rest of

1060
00:54:46,720 --> 00:54:48,640
that show and it went really
well.

1061
00:54:48,640 --> 00:54:51,680
They were good guys.
They taught me a lot and then.

1062
00:54:51,680 --> 00:54:53,160
Was it Hollywood lights or
something?

1063
00:54:53,160 --> 00:54:55,360
Who was it?
No, it was a bunch of freelance

1064
00:54:55,360 --> 00:54:58,320
film guys out of Portland.
OK, but Hollywood Lights does

1065
00:54:58,320 --> 00:55:03,720
come into the story later.
So yeah, I I did that show with

1066
00:55:03,720 --> 00:55:04,720
them.
And then they called me up for

1067
00:55:04,720 --> 00:55:06,800
this other little thing that
happened in Southern Oregon.

1068
00:55:07,240 --> 00:55:09,040
And then they called me for
something in Poland.

1069
00:55:09,040 --> 00:55:10,400
And I was like, I was like 4
weeks.

1070
00:55:10,400 --> 00:55:13,160
I'm like, Then they called me
another one that was like 6

1071
00:55:13,160 --> 00:55:15,440
weeks.
I'm like, because, you know, I

1072
00:55:15,440 --> 00:55:19,240
was running two shows at OSF, so
which is a fairly good deal.

1073
00:55:21,200 --> 00:55:23,560
And then they called me a third
time and they said, hey, look,

1074
00:55:23,560 --> 00:55:25,080
we've got this movie, it's
coming to Portland.

1075
00:55:25,080 --> 00:55:27,240
It's 12 weeks, Morgan Freeman's
in it.

1076
00:55:27,240 --> 00:55:28,800
It's a big budget.
We need a guy.

1077
00:55:29,520 --> 00:55:32,680
And so at that point of the
season, I was actually working

1078
00:55:32,680 --> 00:55:36,320
for the stage operations crew,
working backstage running shows.

1079
00:55:37,120 --> 00:55:39,880
And I called, I got the phone
call on a Thursday afternoon.

1080
00:55:40,320 --> 00:55:43,120
They wanted me to start the
following Monday, so I called

1081
00:55:43,120 --> 00:55:46,080
the head of stage OPS.
This guy called Tommy, who was

1082
00:55:46,920 --> 00:55:49,320
formerly the master welder at
OSF.

1083
00:55:49,400 --> 00:55:54,440
He was also Local 1.
Serious guy called him up.

1084
00:55:54,440 --> 00:55:56,200
He was at a conference in
Chicago.

1085
00:55:56,880 --> 00:55:58,200
Called him up.
I said, hey man, I just got a

1086
00:55:58,200 --> 00:56:02,280
call to go and join IRC in
Portland and work on a film for

1087
00:56:02,280 --> 00:56:04,640
12 weeks.
He says you're running two

1088
00:56:04,640 --> 00:56:05,560
shows.
I said Yep.

1089
00:56:06,040 --> 00:56:07,720
He says if you've got shadows in
both shows.

1090
00:56:07,720 --> 00:56:09,520
I said Yep.
Are they trained up?

1091
00:56:09,640 --> 00:56:11,520
Yep.
When do you need to leave?

1092
00:56:11,520 --> 00:56:12,720
I said they want me there
Monday.

1093
00:56:13,440 --> 00:56:15,320
He says, when's your last show?
I said Sunday.

1094
00:56:15,920 --> 00:56:19,400
He said, OK, I'll do both the
shows this weekend, make sure

1095
00:56:19,400 --> 00:56:21,320
everyone's up to speed and fuck
off.

1096
00:56:22,000 --> 00:56:23,400
I'm like, you sure you're cool
with this?

1097
00:56:23,480 --> 00:56:27,120
He's like, Yep.
So I literally did my I did my

1098
00:56:27,120 --> 00:56:30,520
two shows.
I did the shows actually.

1099
00:56:30,520 --> 00:56:33,440
I had a show Friday, Saturday,
Sunday night, I finished my

1100
00:56:33,440 --> 00:56:34,200
show.
Sunday night.

1101
00:56:34,200 --> 00:56:37,760
I had my stuff already packed in
my car, finished my show, got in

1102
00:56:37,760 --> 00:56:42,000
my car, drove to Portland.
I went to Portland about 3:30 in

1103
00:56:42,000 --> 00:56:44,960
the morning, drove straight to
crew parking, slept in my car

1104
00:56:44,960 --> 00:56:48,680
for 2 1/2 hours and then went
and then went and did my first

1105
00:56:48,680 --> 00:56:50,400
day on a movie called The Feast
of Love.

1106
00:56:51,080 --> 00:56:53,880
Wow.
Which was my sort of

1107
00:56:54,000 --> 00:56:57,160
introduction into being
professional film lighting

1108
00:56:57,160 --> 00:56:59,200
technician.
Jeez.

1109
00:56:59,320 --> 00:57:02,200
That's incredible.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1110
00:57:02,360 --> 00:57:08,520
And then four, that was in 2006.
And then I worked in sort of

1111
00:57:08,520 --> 00:57:12,560
Pacific Northwest, mostly
Portland, Seattle until sort of

1112
00:57:12,560 --> 00:57:15,760
20/20/15 when I started working
in LA.

1113
00:57:17,560 --> 00:57:19,120
And, you know, it was, it was
cool because when I first

1114
00:57:19,120 --> 00:57:23,120
started in port, working in
Portland, it was really sort of

1115
00:57:23,120 --> 00:57:24,880
a, you know, they did a few big
features there.

1116
00:57:26,040 --> 00:57:29,760
I mean, not, you know, not
Marvel big, but you know, drama

1117
00:57:29,760 --> 00:57:31,560
stuff.
We did a couple of movies there.

1118
00:57:31,920 --> 00:57:34,240
I got to work with some big out
of town gaffers, which is really

1119
00:57:34,240 --> 00:57:36,520
cool.
You know, like a program for

1120
00:57:36,520 --> 00:57:42,480
Bill O'Leary who, who's Roger
Deakins Kaffir worked with with

1121
00:57:42,480 --> 00:57:43,760
him.
I worked with another big guy

1122
00:57:43,760 --> 00:57:46,680
called Geoff Morrell, who's most
famous for doing a lot of Marvel

1123
00:57:46,680 --> 00:57:50,080
stuff over the last 10-15 years.
Cool.

1124
00:57:50,920 --> 00:57:53,880
And yeah, it was a really, it
was a really cool place to sort

1125
00:57:53,880 --> 00:57:57,440
of cut my teeth and, and learn
the chops and, and you know,

1126
00:57:58,000 --> 00:58:00,440
because you know, programming
for film and TV is very

1127
00:58:00,440 --> 00:58:02,000
different for doing live event
stuff.

1128
00:58:03,560 --> 00:58:06,120
People ask me what's it like
programming for film and TV?

1129
00:58:06,120 --> 00:58:09,520
I'm like, you know, tech, yeah,
that's the job.

1130
00:58:09,520 --> 00:58:11,800
Five days a week for however
long you're on the show.

1131
00:58:12,240 --> 00:58:15,840
There's no, there's no process
of where, you know, unless

1132
00:58:15,840 --> 00:58:18,120
you're doing like a concert
sequence or something like that.

1133
00:58:18,120 --> 00:58:21,360
It's literally every shot is a
different lighting setup, which

1134
00:58:21,360 --> 00:58:25,000
is reprogrammed.
And then you flip the world 180°

1135
00:58:25,000 --> 00:58:28,240
and it's totally different.
Look, so you know, unless you're

1136
00:58:28,240 --> 00:58:31,560
doing a sequence where you have
specific things that have to

1137
00:58:31,560 --> 00:58:35,320
happen over a certain time
frame, it's go, go, go, man.

1138
00:58:35,320 --> 00:58:39,400
Like there's no arrest.
Yeah, you know, So what is it?

1139
00:58:39,400 --> 00:58:42,400
Someone once described it to me
as as of she sheer boredom

1140
00:58:42,400 --> 00:58:44,320
interspersed with minutes of
sheer panic.

1141
00:58:44,400 --> 00:58:46,880
That's a film set.
Hilarious.

1142
00:58:46,880 --> 00:58:51,040
That's quite often how it feels.
So you by now, have you left the

1143
00:58:51,040 --> 00:58:53,240
Shakespeare?
Yeah.

1144
00:58:53,320 --> 00:58:56,320
Yeah, basically, yeah.
Basically in 2006 when I got the

1145
00:58:56,320 --> 00:58:59,560
offer to go up to Portland and
join IRT and work in the film

1146
00:58:59,560 --> 00:59:02,760
business, I basically designed
from the festival and then just

1147
00:59:02,760 --> 00:59:09,880
got into film full time.
And yeah, as I was working on on

1148
00:59:09,880 --> 00:59:12,040
movies and TV shows and
commercials out there.

1149
00:59:12,400 --> 00:59:14,920
And for the first couple of
years it was a bit thin on the

1150
00:59:14,920 --> 00:59:18,440
ground, so I would sort of die
play it, you know, Hollywood

1151
00:59:18,440 --> 00:59:20,600
lights as one of their texts.
And there's a repair tech there

1152
00:59:20,600 --> 00:59:24,720
as well.
And and then more and more, it

1153
00:59:24,720 --> 00:59:28,400
became, you know, the film work
became more and more consistent

1154
00:59:28,400 --> 00:59:29,960
for a period of time.
Yeah.

1155
00:59:30,240 --> 00:59:32,440
There are a couple of big TV
shows that shot up there for a

1156
00:59:32,440 --> 00:59:34,920
number of years, so the work was
pretty consistent.

1157
00:59:37,480 --> 00:59:41,520
But LA is the way.
Like is the, you know, it's the.

1158
00:59:41,720 --> 00:59:43,360
Well, I mean, it's you want to
be right.

1159
00:59:44,520 --> 00:59:46,640
Yeah.
I mean the thing that I found,

1160
00:59:48,640 --> 00:59:52,040
you know, I came from, you know,
when I was back in Perth, I was

1161
00:59:52,040 --> 00:59:54,320
doing a lot of corporate gigs
and we do moving light stuff and

1162
00:59:54,320 --> 00:59:57,680
it was really fun.
And then you know, up until sort

1163
00:59:57,680 --> 01:00:02,400
of LEDs really started to come
in, you know, mid twenty 10s, it

1164
01:00:02,400 --> 01:00:04,520
was, you know, if you in most
theater.

1165
01:00:05,160 --> 01:00:07,680
Most sort of, sorry, most film
sets, you know, sort of in

1166
01:00:07,680 --> 01:00:10,560
Portland at least, you know,
looking two or three universes

1167
01:00:10,560 --> 01:00:13,120
of tungsten stuff at the most,
you know, some keynote stuff.

1168
01:00:13,120 --> 01:00:16,000
But it wasn't, there wasn't
really any LED at that stage.

1169
01:00:17,360 --> 01:00:19,760
And I would find, you know, I'm
doing these cool shows in

1170
01:00:19,760 --> 01:00:22,520
Portland and I'm making good
money and it's fun and I'm

1171
01:00:22,520 --> 01:00:24,720
working with good people.
Because there was quite a few

1172
01:00:24,720 --> 01:00:27,440
guys in Portland and Seattle
that have moved out from LA.

1173
01:00:27,480 --> 01:00:30,600
They were, they were all 728
guys that I was working with.

1174
01:00:31,200 --> 01:00:35,560
So I learned a lot while I was
there, but I got to a point

1175
01:00:35,560 --> 01:00:37,720
where I'm like this.
I think I've learned as much as

1176
01:00:37,720 --> 01:00:41,480
I can here.
And I would go and watch a big

1177
01:00:41,480 --> 01:00:44,080
movie and it was always, you
would always see the same names.

1178
01:00:44,080 --> 01:00:47,680
It was always, you know, Scott
Barnes, Benoit, Richard Elton

1179
01:00:47,680 --> 01:00:50,400
James, Josh Thatcher.
Like you could, you could, I

1180
01:00:50,400 --> 01:00:52,880
could pretty much watch a movie
and go, I think Scotty did this.

1181
01:00:52,880 --> 01:00:55,960
And sure enough, that was the
way I would see on the screen

1182
01:00:55,960 --> 01:00:59,000
and I would see the stuff and be
like, hey, man, those guys are

1183
01:00:59,000 --> 01:01:02,320
doing what I wanted to, but
they're all working out of LA.

1184
01:01:04,360 --> 01:01:09,920
So again, being in the right
place at the right time.

1185
01:01:09,920 --> 01:01:11,840
Like I said, I have a few
friends that were living in

1186
01:01:11,840 --> 01:01:13,560
Portland at the time.
That was 728.

1187
01:01:13,960 --> 01:01:16,680
And one day I'm between sort of
shows and I got a phone call

1188
01:01:16,680 --> 01:01:20,520
from a friend of mine who's an
Oregon resident, but he'd moved

1189
01:01:20,520 --> 01:01:24,920
to LA 20 years ago, got into
728, was doing stuff there and

1190
01:01:24,920 --> 01:01:26,840
then moved back to Portland to
be with his family.

1191
01:01:27,360 --> 01:01:29,240
And he calls me was like, oh
man, he doing anything.

1192
01:01:29,240 --> 01:01:31,560
Can you come and give us a hand?
I'm, I'm working with this young

1193
01:01:31,560 --> 01:01:34,600
guy from, from LA and it's this
non union show and it's me and

1194
01:01:34,600 --> 01:01:36,840
him and an intern and like,
we're just getting buried.

1195
01:01:36,840 --> 01:01:38,320
I'm like, yeah, cool man, I'll
come give you a hand.

1196
01:01:38,880 --> 01:01:41,160
So I'd go and give him a hand
and get on there for a couple of

1197
01:01:41,160 --> 01:01:43,440
weeks helping him out.
And then, you know, this gaffer

1198
01:01:43,440 --> 01:01:45,920
from LA was really, really cool
and we got along quite well.

1199
01:01:47,680 --> 01:01:49,760
And then, you know, over the
course of the next couple of

1200
01:01:49,760 --> 01:01:51,960
years, he'd call me up.
He'd be like, hey man, can you

1201
01:01:51,960 --> 01:01:53,320
come to LA for a couple of
weeks?

1202
01:01:53,320 --> 01:01:56,120
You know, like, oh, listen, man,
I'm on a, I'm on a snowboarding

1203
01:01:56,120 --> 01:01:58,720
vacation in Canada.
Can I, can you call me on the

1204
01:01:58,720 --> 01:02:00,080
next one?
Sorry, man.

1205
01:02:00,080 --> 01:02:02,760
Yeah, yeah.
Because the big thing is, you

1206
01:02:02,760 --> 01:02:05,320
know, to get into 7 to, or to
get into any of the Hollywood

1207
01:02:05,320 --> 01:02:08,760
unions, you've got to do a
number of qualifying days to, to

1208
01:02:08,760 --> 01:02:12,040
be able to apply for membership.
And like, trying to get those

1209
01:02:12,040 --> 01:02:15,880
days is, is a big thing.
So to, to knock it back, I was

1210
01:02:15,880 --> 01:02:20,600
like, yeah, yeah, OK.
You know, So he actually asked

1211
01:02:20,600 --> 01:02:26,400
me a couple of times.
And then in 2015, they were

1212
01:02:26,400 --> 01:02:31,960
doing a new Twin Peaks and a
friend of mine was the best boy

1213
01:02:32,360 --> 01:02:33,920
on that.
And so he asked me, invited me

1214
01:02:33,920 --> 01:02:37,080
to come up to Washington, I have
to Seattle for six or eight

1215
01:02:37,080 --> 01:02:39,880
weeks and work on that.
And again, the gaffer was from

1216
01:02:39,880 --> 01:02:41,760
LA and I got along with him
really, really well.

1217
01:02:41,760 --> 01:02:44,400
And he's like, listen, man, I'd
love to, I'd love to bring you

1218
01:02:44,400 --> 01:02:48,160
to LA, but you're not 728.
And I'm like, so I finished

1219
01:02:48,160 --> 01:02:50,960
that.
And I was actually, at the time

1220
01:02:50,960 --> 01:02:53,600
I was playing Australian
football for the Portland

1221
01:02:53,600 --> 01:02:55,680
Steelheads, which is an
Australian rules football club

1222
01:02:55,680 --> 01:02:58,640
based in Portland.
And we were, I was sitting at

1223
01:02:58,640 --> 01:03:02,160
the airport we were flying to.
You were playing for them?

1224
01:03:02,880 --> 01:03:04,040
Yeah, I was playing Australian
rules.

1225
01:03:04,440 --> 01:03:05,920
Yeah, playing Australian rules
football.

1226
01:03:06,080 --> 01:03:10,080
Oh my God.
Yeah, at 36 or something Anyway,

1227
01:03:10,080 --> 01:03:11,800
wow.
I was sitting at, I was sitting

1228
01:03:11,800 --> 01:03:15,440
at the airport waiting to fly to
Austin to go to the national,

1229
01:03:15,480 --> 01:03:20,680
national titles because there's
43, there's 43 American, Aussie

1230
01:03:20,680 --> 01:03:24,120
roof clubs in the US There's 43
of them, I think, and just a

1231
01:03:24,120 --> 01:03:26,320
national tournament every year.
And so it's a lot of fun.

1232
01:03:26,320 --> 01:03:28,200
I mean, it's, you know, it's fun
to hang.

1233
01:03:28,280 --> 01:03:28,840
It's.
Brutal.

1234
01:03:29,880 --> 01:03:33,240
You know, I'm a hockey fan and
even I call it brutal.

1235
01:03:33,480 --> 01:03:34,120
Yeah.
Yeah.

1236
01:03:34,840 --> 01:03:37,480
So, yeah, I was still doing that
in my late 30s, so it was fun.

1237
01:03:38,280 --> 01:03:40,120
But I'm flying, you know, I'm
sitting at the airport waiting

1238
01:03:40,120 --> 01:03:42,640
to fly to Austin to play footy.
And I get a phone call from that

1239
01:03:42,640 --> 01:03:45,440
young guy from from LA and he's
like, hey, man, what are you

1240
01:03:45,440 --> 01:03:46,760
doing right now?
Well, I'm, I'm like, well, I'm

1241
01:03:46,760 --> 01:03:48,960
sitting at the airport.
He's like, hey, I need a

1242
01:03:48,960 --> 01:03:52,800
programmer for a show in LA.
There's not a lot of money, but

1243
01:03:52,800 --> 01:03:54,800
it's a union show and there's 35
days.

1244
01:03:54,800 --> 01:03:56,400
I can get you 30 days in one
hit.

1245
01:03:56,400 --> 01:03:58,440
I said when you name me there,
it's like Tuesday, I'm like I'll

1246
01:03:58,440 --> 01:04:01,200
be there.
So literally I he's lighter.

1247
01:04:01,200 --> 01:04:03,760
I fly to Austin for the weekend
to play my footy tournament.

1248
01:04:03,760 --> 01:04:06,280
I fly back.
I chucked my console in the back

1249
01:04:06,280 --> 01:04:08,640
of the Mustang and a pack of
bags and I go.

1250
01:04:09,520 --> 01:04:12,680
And so I went down to LA and I
got my 35 days, which got me

1251
01:04:12,680 --> 01:04:15,760
into 728.
And it was funny and it was, it

1252
01:04:16,040 --> 01:04:19,080
was, it was the show for it was
like a YouTube original piece or

1253
01:04:19,080 --> 01:04:21,960
something.
And I hadn't really asked a lot

1254
01:04:21,960 --> 01:04:24,560
of information when I just said,
yeah, 35 days.

1255
01:04:24,560 --> 01:04:25,200
Cool.
I'm there.

1256
01:04:25,640 --> 01:04:28,320
And so I walk in and on the
first day they're like, So what

1257
01:04:28,320 --> 01:04:29,400
kind of lights do you want to
use?

1258
01:04:29,400 --> 01:04:33,080
And I'm like, what?
Well, like we need to, we need

1259
01:04:33,080 --> 01:04:34,680
to order lights for the show.
What do you want to use?

1260
01:04:34,680 --> 01:04:37,040
I'm like, well, what are we,
What are we doing?

1261
01:04:37,720 --> 01:04:40,080
And it ended up it was a show
basically they were taking the

1262
01:04:40,080 --> 01:04:41,640
piss out of shows like American
Idol.

1263
01:04:41,640 --> 01:04:44,240
They were, they were satire and
singing competition shows.

1264
01:04:45,040 --> 01:04:48,560
And I'm like, oh, you want me to
design the rig?

1265
01:04:48,800 --> 01:04:52,800
And they went, yeah.
And they went, OK, so I just got

1266
01:04:52,800 --> 01:04:55,040
out of my vector works and I
just sort of started drawing a

1267
01:04:55,040 --> 01:04:56,360
plot and I said, what do you
guys think of this?

1268
01:04:56,360 --> 01:04:59,400
And like, yeah, that's cool.
And I think the first rig that I

1269
01:04:59,400 --> 01:05:03,200
designed was going to cost them
70 grand a week or something.

1270
01:05:03,200 --> 01:05:05,200
And they're like, well, we've
we've only got 50.

1271
01:05:05,840 --> 01:05:08,400
So it went from being, you know,
like the latest LED moving

1272
01:05:08,400 --> 01:05:12,320
lights to, you know, VL 25
hundreds in MAC2 case, which was

1273
01:05:12,320 --> 01:05:14,240
fine.
You know, it ended up working

1274
01:05:14,240 --> 01:05:17,680
out really, really well, but it
was one of those shows where,

1275
01:05:18,000 --> 01:05:21,720
you know, every day we would
shoot for 12 hours a day with

1276
01:05:21,720 --> 01:05:26,320
the company and then made the DP
and the, and the gaffer would

1277
01:05:26,320 --> 01:05:29,360
sit there from six until
midnight programming the looks

1278
01:05:29,360 --> 01:05:31,600
for the next day.
And then we would come in and we

1279
01:05:31,600 --> 01:05:33,680
would do that.
And we did that for three weeks.

1280
01:05:34,400 --> 01:05:36,440
And it was like, get your chops
down kid.

1281
01:05:36,440 --> 01:05:39,960
And it got to the point where I
was like, OK, here's 4 basic

1282
01:05:39,960 --> 01:05:42,160
looks.
Pick a color, pick a gobo,

1283
01:05:42,320 --> 01:05:44,200
right?
Moving on next, next.

1284
01:05:44,280 --> 01:05:46,440
And we just we just had to go
through because we were

1285
01:05:46,440 --> 01:05:48,160
programming.
We were programming 3 songs a

1286
01:05:48,160 --> 01:05:49,240
night.
Yeah.

1287
01:05:50,120 --> 01:05:53,680
So it was pretty, it was pretty
full on, but it was a really fun

1288
01:05:53,680 --> 01:05:57,480
experience and it got me into
728.

1289
01:05:57,880 --> 01:06:03,280
And so I got my qualifying days
for 7/28 and literally I was

1290
01:06:03,280 --> 01:06:04,800
still living in Portland at the
time.

1291
01:06:06,040 --> 01:06:09,680
And the day I got my, the day I
actually flew down to get sworn

1292
01:06:09,680 --> 01:06:13,120
into, into the union, I get a
phone call and it was the gaffer

1293
01:06:13,120 --> 01:06:16,160
from Twin Peaks.
He's like, hey, man, he just got

1294
01:06:16,160 --> 01:06:18,200
sworn into 728.
And I'm like, yeah.

1295
01:06:18,880 --> 01:06:21,280
He's like, we've got eight weeks
of stage work in LA.

1296
01:06:21,280 --> 01:06:25,200
Do you want to do it?
I'm like, yeah, that's wild.

1297
01:06:25,200 --> 01:06:26,800
Yeah.
It just, it just cascaded.

1298
01:06:27,440 --> 01:06:29,320
Yeah.
And, and so, you know,

1299
01:06:29,320 --> 01:06:32,440
originally my plan had been to
move to the back and forth, back

1300
01:06:32,440 --> 01:06:35,960
and forth between Portland, LA,
you know, pick up shows in both

1301
01:06:35,960 --> 01:06:37,560
places so I could be at home
more.

1302
01:06:38,680 --> 01:06:40,960
But over a period of time it
just got busier and busier and

1303
01:06:40,960 --> 01:06:47,480
busier in LA to the point, you
know, like I, I did two seasons

1304
01:06:47,480 --> 01:06:50,840
of Hell's Kitchen in Vegas.
That was in Vegas for like 3 or

1305
01:06:50,840 --> 01:06:54,680
4 months.
I did Lady and the Tramp in

1306
01:06:54,680 --> 01:06:56,760
Savannah, GA.
I was there for four months.

1307
01:06:57,920 --> 01:07:01,960
It was actually interesting.
We'll probably talk a bit more

1308
01:07:01,960 --> 01:07:04,520
about than a while later, but
there was a period I'm gonna.

1309
01:07:04,520 --> 01:07:06,640
Ask because you mentioned that
somewhere in the notes that I

1310
01:07:06,640 --> 01:07:12,720
got that that meeting, meeting
Ben Richard was, yeah, it was a

1311
01:07:12,720 --> 01:07:14,280
big deal.
Oh, yeah.

1312
01:07:14,280 --> 01:07:18,840
Well, that was a huge deal for
me because I remember, you know,

1313
01:07:18,840 --> 01:07:20,800
back in the day, like I'd like I
said, I've always, you know,

1314
01:07:20,800 --> 01:07:22,680
when once I got into film, but
I've always had a love of

1315
01:07:22,680 --> 01:07:25,160
concert lighting.
Like one of the things that

1316
01:07:25,160 --> 01:07:28,560
first got me into lighting, I
remember this is really, you

1317
01:07:28,560 --> 01:07:31,120
know, for this is before I got
into it, you know, the nerd high

1318
01:07:31,120 --> 01:07:33,400
school here.
I remember saying, I remember

1319
01:07:33,400 --> 01:07:37,080
going to a concert and as a kid
I was crazy about like fast cars

1320
01:07:37,080 --> 01:07:39,880
and jet planes and steam trains
and, you know, like mechanical

1321
01:07:39,880 --> 01:07:41,960
shit, things that did things.
Yeah.

1322
01:07:41,960 --> 01:07:44,000
And I went to a concert and I
look up and I see all these

1323
01:07:44,000 --> 01:07:45,440
lights and they look like jet
engines.

1324
01:07:45,440 --> 01:07:47,840
And I'm like, oh, jet lights.
I want to work on jet lights.

1325
01:07:48,440 --> 01:07:49,800
Yeah.
That was, you know, that's why I

1326
01:07:49,800 --> 01:07:51,720
wanted to be at VL Tech.
I wanted to work on jet lights.

1327
01:07:51,840 --> 01:07:54,160
Yeah.
And I remember watching a bunch

1328
01:07:54,160 --> 01:07:56,360
of concert videos and then I
remember watching, you know,

1329
01:07:56,360 --> 01:07:58,040
like it was Metallica or S&M or
something.

1330
01:07:58,040 --> 01:07:59,680
And I was like, wow, that looks
amazing.

1331
01:08:00,240 --> 01:08:03,000
Who was the guy that did that?
Ben Richards.

1332
01:08:03,040 --> 01:08:05,120
OK, who's that guy?
I got to find out who he is.

1333
01:08:05,760 --> 01:08:08,400
And then I remember going and
seeing Metallica on some tour

1334
01:08:08,400 --> 01:08:11,200
and versus they were playing at
the entertainment center and,

1335
01:08:11,200 --> 01:08:13,040
you know, I'm like standing
there and, you know, like you're

1336
01:08:13,040 --> 01:08:17,160
waiting for the house lights to
go down and, and you know, and

1337
01:08:17,160 --> 01:08:19,640
suddenly the dudes, some dudes
start walking out on stage and

1338
01:08:19,640 --> 01:08:21,319
start playing.
And I'm like, what the what?

1339
01:08:22,319 --> 01:08:24,160
Some must be wrong.
Why are the half lights still on

1340
01:08:24,279 --> 01:08:26,000
like Metallica's playing in the
half lights?

1341
01:08:26,240 --> 01:08:28,080
I remember that tour.
Yeah, I remember that.

1342
01:08:28,080 --> 01:08:30,560
Tour and and then, you know,
like they play the first song

1343
01:08:30,560 --> 01:08:33,000
and then it's like, you know,
they, they cut into fuel and

1344
01:08:33,000 --> 01:08:35,399
then the everything blacks out
and then the flame pots go off

1345
01:08:35,399 --> 01:08:37,840
and I'm like, that's the most
incredible thing I've ever.

1346
01:08:37,840 --> 01:08:38,479
Seen.
Yeah.

1347
01:08:38,560 --> 01:08:40,240
Yeah.
I'm hooked, Yeah.

1348
01:08:40,359 --> 01:08:44,160
And I think one of the first
time that I sat down with with

1349
01:08:44,160 --> 01:08:46,520
Benoit, we were talking about
stuff and I said, OK, I have to

1350
01:08:46,520 --> 01:08:48,680
ask a question.
And I and I explained that

1351
01:08:48,680 --> 01:08:50,080
scenario and he was like, yeah,
that was me.

1352
01:08:50,080 --> 01:08:54,680
I'm like, man, that was awesome.
Yeah, but I, I'd been working

1353
01:08:54,680 --> 01:08:59,840
on, I've been working on Perry
Mason season 1 in LA and, and

1354
01:08:59,840 --> 01:09:02,080
Ben had posted that he was
looking for a rigging programmer

1355
01:09:02,080 --> 01:09:04,760
to go and do Ghostbusters up in
Calgary.

1356
01:09:04,960 --> 01:09:07,120
Yeah, yeah, I remember when he
did that, Yeah.

1357
01:09:07,200 --> 01:09:09,399
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
And, you know, he's, he's a, you

1358
01:09:10,520 --> 01:09:12,920
know, renowned hog guy.
And I'd been an Onyx guy from

1359
01:09:12,920 --> 01:09:16,040
that since about 2010.
I mean, like, I cut my teeth

1360
01:09:16,040 --> 01:09:19,479
back on, you know, hog hog twos
and and hog one case back in the

1361
01:09:19,479 --> 01:09:21,040
day.
But I'd started really diving

1362
01:09:21,040 --> 01:09:23,560
into Onyx in about 2010, and
that'd become my console of

1363
01:09:23,560 --> 01:09:27,439
choice.
It's weird that Onyx has even

1364
01:09:27,439 --> 01:09:32,359
been around that long.
Like I it's when did Onyx start?

1365
01:09:34,720 --> 01:09:36,479
It couldn't.
Have been Onyx before that.

1366
01:09:37,000 --> 01:09:39,399
Well, I mean, Onyx was
originally M series by Martin.

1367
01:09:39,399 --> 01:09:42,080
Yeah, yeah, of course.
And you know, that was a carry

1368
01:09:42,080 --> 01:09:44,080
on from the Maxis series.
Yeah.

1369
01:09:44,080 --> 01:09:46,200
And I'd use, you know, like I'd
use the Maxis a bit like

1370
01:09:46,200 --> 01:09:49,240
Hollywood.
So let me give you a weird, let

1371
01:09:49,279 --> 01:09:50,800
me give you a weird bit of
history.

1372
01:09:50,800 --> 01:09:55,360
So I worked, I worked at Martin
in the 90s and was part of, you

1373
01:09:55,360 --> 01:09:58,520
know, really getting that
company from being a tiny

1374
01:09:58,520 --> 01:10:01,840
obscure disco lighting
manufacturer to being a

1375
01:10:02,040 --> 01:10:05,040
professional.
I got them on their first tours

1376
01:10:05,040 --> 01:10:08,880
and, and that kind of stuff.
And so I was at a trade show in

1377
01:10:08,880 --> 01:10:14,000
Europe and I ran into these
weird Belgian dudes at a booth

1378
01:10:14,520 --> 01:10:18,240
called Case.
And what caught my eye was they

1379
01:10:18,240 --> 01:10:20,840
had this.
And we had been in talks with

1380
01:10:20,840 --> 01:10:23,560
Compulite.
We were in talks with multiple

1381
01:10:23,560 --> 01:10:27,120
other companies because it was
becoming apparent that we were

1382
01:10:27,120 --> 01:10:30,880
getting screwed by lighting
console manufacturers at Martin.

1383
01:10:30,880 --> 01:10:33,960
They were, it felt like they
were making our fixtures look

1384
01:10:33,960 --> 01:10:36,120
bad.
In hindsight, we were making our

1385
01:10:36,120 --> 01:10:40,280
fixtures look bad, not them.
But we thought that we needed to

1386
01:10:40,280 --> 01:10:44,920
be partnered with a lighting
console manufacturer and the

1387
01:10:44,920 --> 01:10:49,000
Compulite were difficult.
You know, a lot of the other

1388
01:10:49,000 --> 01:10:52,400
ones were already sort of
captured by other manufacturers.

1389
01:10:52,400 --> 01:10:55,880
And so I see these two Belgian
guys and the thing that caught

1390
01:10:55,880 --> 01:11:00,880
my eye was they had these these
moving faders and, and I'm

1391
01:11:00,880 --> 01:11:03,200
looking at this console and the
faders are all moving and I'm

1392
01:11:03,200 --> 01:11:07,120
like, whoa, that's cool.
And so I just started talking to

1393
01:11:07,120 --> 01:11:09,040
the one guy and I can't even
remember his name.

1394
01:11:09,960 --> 01:11:13,920
And Eric Loader is gonna be
texting me as soon as he listens

1395
01:11:13,920 --> 01:11:16,680
to this podcast and he's gonna
tell me all of their names again

1396
01:11:16,680 --> 01:11:21,280
cuz his memory is incredible.
But so anyways, I started

1397
01:11:21,280 --> 01:11:24,720
talking to these guys and Long
story short, we ended up not

1398
01:11:24,720 --> 01:11:27,840
only partnering with them, but
then eventually acquired their

1399
01:11:27,840 --> 01:11:30,320
company as well.
And that's what became

1400
01:11:30,320 --> 01:11:31,960
eventually Max's.
The case.

1401
01:11:32,280 --> 01:11:34,480
So yeah, it was my fault.
No, I'm start.

1402
01:11:34,840 --> 01:11:36,520
I've never, I've never actually
operated case.

1403
01:11:36,520 --> 01:11:39,080
I've seen one, never actually
operated it, but I mean you

1404
01:11:39,080 --> 01:11:41,680
know, like and the equivalent of
the time back then was like scan

1405
01:11:41,680 --> 01:11:44,560
commander or whatever it was.
Yeah, yeah, exactly.

1406
01:11:44,760 --> 01:11:47,040
Or the navigator.
The navigator.

1407
01:11:47,040 --> 01:11:50,200
Yeah, yeah.
The what was what was there was

1408
01:11:50,200 --> 01:11:52,640
the little high end panel that
they manned in the wall and you.

1409
01:11:52,640 --> 01:11:55,320
Yeah, yeah, yellow belts, LCD
controllers.

1410
01:11:55,960 --> 01:11:58,040
Those ones, yeah.
Wall was a master of those

1411
01:11:58,360 --> 01:12:01,360
Hamilton grievous that at high
end there was a few of them.

1412
01:12:01,520 --> 01:12:03,880
There was a few of them back in
Perth back in the day and I used

1413
01:12:03,880 --> 01:12:05,640
to few of them in this pack.
Yeah, yeah.

1414
01:12:05,640 --> 01:12:08,600
No, I'd, I'd originally, like I
said, I cut my teeth in Oz on,

1415
01:12:08,600 --> 01:12:12,360
you know, hog one case hog, hog
twos, you know, the echelons,

1416
01:12:13,920 --> 01:12:15,920
Jans event series, a whole bunch
of stuff.

1417
01:12:15,960 --> 01:12:20,880
Yeah.
And I was on the rigging crew on

1418
01:12:20,880 --> 01:12:25,520
a movie in Hawaii and up until
that point, like working in

1419
01:12:25,520 --> 01:12:29,120
Portland before I moved to LA,
it's 2010 ish in in LA.

1420
01:12:29,120 --> 01:12:31,360
Someone would be like, oh, you
know, here's a, here's a naval

1421
01:12:31,360 --> 01:12:32,680
roller queue.
Use that for your show.

1422
01:12:32,680 --> 01:12:35,560
Or hey, the the rigging gaffer
owns a whole, you know, like a

1423
01:12:35,560 --> 01:12:37,360
hog hog.
Use that.

1424
01:12:37,360 --> 01:12:38,840
OK.
So I just used whatever console

1425
01:12:38,840 --> 01:12:41,080
was throwing them away, which
was good because you had to stay

1426
01:12:41,080 --> 01:12:42,880
on top of things and you had to
learn different things.

1427
01:12:42,880 --> 01:12:43,960
Yeah.
That's wild.

1428
01:12:44,400 --> 01:12:45,800
You know, I kind of missed the
Grand MI train.

1429
01:12:45,800 --> 01:12:47,760
No one ever brought one of those
in, so I never really got to

1430
01:12:47,760 --> 01:12:48,840
fight with one of those.
Yeah.

1431
01:12:49,480 --> 01:12:51,440
You know, like the rental
company that I worked for in

1432
01:12:51,440 --> 01:12:54,480
Perth when I left in 2003, a
week before I left, I got a

1433
01:12:54,480 --> 01:12:56,440
Grand MI one full size.
And I'm just like, really?

1434
01:12:56,800 --> 01:12:58,120
It happens now.
Thanks, fellas.

1435
01:12:58,560 --> 01:13:00,040
Yeah.
Yeah.

1436
01:13:00,040 --> 01:13:04,840
So I was doing this movie in
Hawaii in 2010, and Jeff comes

1437
01:13:04,840 --> 01:13:06,840
up and he's like, hey, man, what
kind of console are you on?

1438
01:13:06,840 --> 01:13:10,520
I went, why?
And he's like, oh, we're doing a

1439
01:13:10,520 --> 01:13:13,200
whole bunch of stage stuff on
this thing in North Carolina.

1440
01:13:13,200 --> 01:13:15,400
When we finish in Hawaii, I want
you to come and program.

1441
01:13:15,840 --> 01:13:18,000
Can can you know if you've got a
console, you can bring a win?

1442
01:13:19,520 --> 01:13:22,880
Yep, I can make that happen.
So basically, I called 1/4.

1443
01:13:22,880 --> 01:13:24,800
I did a bunch of research and I
called a friend of mine, Joe

1444
01:13:24,800 --> 01:13:27,960
McGinley, who I'd worked with at
Hollywood Lights in Portland,

1445
01:13:28,520 --> 01:13:29,760
and said, dude, I've got to buy
a console.

1446
01:13:29,760 --> 01:13:31,800
I'm thinking about this.
He's like, dude, you got to call

1447
01:13:31,800 --> 01:13:34,160
Matthias at at Martin.
He's got this new thing called

1448
01:13:34,160 --> 01:13:35,720
the M1 coming out.
You're going to have to check it

1449
01:13:35,720 --> 01:13:38,400
out, OK?
So I called Matthias.

1450
01:13:38,400 --> 01:13:40,520
I'm like, hey, man, Joe told me
to call you and talk to you

1451
01:13:40,520 --> 01:13:41,800
about this thing.
I need something that'll do

1452
01:13:41,800 --> 01:13:44,000
this, this, this and this.
He's like, Oh yeah, this will do

1453
01:13:44,000 --> 01:13:45,520
that.
I said, OK, I'm in Hawaii.

1454
01:13:45,520 --> 01:13:48,520
Can you get me a demo?
We've got one in Seattle.

1455
01:13:49,000 --> 01:13:51,240
Can you give it to me in Hawaii?
No.

1456
01:13:51,840 --> 01:13:52,960
OK.
I need it the first week.

1457
01:13:52,960 --> 01:13:54,680
I need it the week before
Christmas.

1458
01:13:55,200 --> 01:13:56,640
We can air fright you on from
Denmark.

1459
01:13:56,960 --> 01:13:57,840
Cool.
Here's a check.

1460
01:13:57,840 --> 01:13:58,800
Thanks.
Never seen it.

1461
01:13:58,800 --> 01:14:00,600
Never touched it.
I'd.

1462
01:14:00,720 --> 01:14:02,800
I'd seen some photos of it and I
read the specs went, yeah,

1463
01:14:02,800 --> 01:14:06,280
that's cool.
So I bought it and we took it to

1464
01:14:06,280 --> 01:14:08,960
we took it to North Carolina.
My first show on it was on a

1465
01:14:08,960 --> 01:14:13,760
$200 million Hollywood feature.
And it was so new, there wasn't

1466
01:14:13,760 --> 01:14:15,440
a manual.
I'd be like I'd be standing at

1467
01:14:15,440 --> 01:14:16,160
the desk on.
Yep.

1468
01:14:16,160 --> 01:14:17,040
Cool.
You need this to happen.

1469
01:14:17,360 --> 01:14:18,680
Matthias, tell me how to make
this happen.

1470
01:14:18,680 --> 01:14:19,320
Now.
Now.

1471
01:14:19,320 --> 01:14:21,160
I need to know now.
OK, Thanks.

1472
01:14:21,720 --> 01:14:24,440
And so, you know, that started
my relationship with Matthias

1473
01:14:24,440 --> 01:14:25,480
and.
Why Martin?

1474
01:14:26,280 --> 01:14:29,400
Yeah.
And so anyway, that's how I sort

1475
01:14:29,400 --> 01:14:30,920
of got into Onyx.
It was friends.

1476
01:14:30,920 --> 01:14:32,920
Yeah, it was.
I was, like I said, I was living

1477
01:14:32,920 --> 01:14:34,040
in Portland.
Martin.

1478
01:14:34,280 --> 01:14:36,520
Portland was a Martin town.
Yeah.

1479
01:14:36,520 --> 01:14:39,120
There's one guy that had an MI
and another guy that had a Hog

1480
01:14:39,120 --> 01:14:41,840
and another guy that, you know,
the theaters had ATC consoles.

1481
01:14:41,840 --> 01:14:43,560
But for live and stuff, it was
all Martin.

1482
01:14:44,080 --> 01:14:46,520
Yeah.
It just, it felt, I felt

1483
01:14:46,520 --> 01:14:49,360
comfortable and instantly.
I I actually have a funny story

1484
01:14:49,360 --> 01:14:52,160
about Martin in Portland too.
So when I first started at

1485
01:14:52,160 --> 01:14:58,680
Martin in 2000 or in 1991, I'm
Canadian, I don't know shit

1486
01:14:58,680 --> 01:15:01,760
about the United States.
And suddenly I'm the West Coast

1487
01:15:01,760 --> 01:15:03,680
regional sales manager for
Martin.

1488
01:15:04,320 --> 01:15:08,720
And so I've been to California
to the NAMM show a whole bunch

1489
01:15:08,720 --> 01:15:11,400
of times because I used to own a
music store and I always went to

1490
01:15:11,400 --> 01:15:15,680
NAMM, but outside and I've been
to Vegas, but outside of that, I

1491
01:15:15,680 --> 01:15:18,280
haven't been anywhere in the
West Coast really at Seattle

1492
01:15:18,280 --> 01:15:23,920
when I was a musician and stuff.
But so I'm, I'm just ringing up

1493
01:15:24,120 --> 01:15:26,680
all of these different dealers
that were on our books.

1494
01:15:26,720 --> 01:15:29,880
And so I called Rich Fuller, who
at the time of the Hollywood

1495
01:15:29,880 --> 01:15:35,040
lights and, and I said, hi, I'm
Martin, I'm Marcel with Martin

1496
01:15:35,040 --> 01:15:37,680
and I'm coming to Portland and
I'd like to come in and see you.

1497
01:15:37,680 --> 01:15:42,520
And he goes, fuck off, click.
And I, I call him back and I'm

1498
01:15:42,520 --> 01:15:46,360
like, Rich.
And he's like, yeah, didn't I

1499
01:15:46,360 --> 01:15:49,120
tell you to fuck off?
And I said, yeah, but what's

1500
01:15:49,280 --> 01:15:50,960
going on here?
Like, I'm coming up there.

1501
01:15:50,960 --> 01:15:52,080
I just want to come in and meet
you.

1502
01:15:52,360 --> 01:15:55,360
And he says, have you not like,
do you guys not keep notes on

1503
01:15:55,360 --> 01:15:56,840
accounts or anything?
And I said, why?

1504
01:15:56,840 --> 01:15:59,360
What happened?
And he said, well, you, you sold

1505
01:15:59,360 --> 01:16:03,000
me fog machines that caught fire
and nobody ever solved the

1506
01:16:03,000 --> 01:16:05,560
problem.
And I don't ever want to see

1507
01:16:05,560 --> 01:16:07,040
another piece of Martin
equipment.

1508
01:16:07,720 --> 01:16:10,200
And so please don't ever call me
again.

1509
01:16:10,760 --> 01:16:15,600
So I fly up to Portland like the
next week or whatever and, you

1510
01:16:15,600 --> 01:16:19,960
know, go knock on Rich Fuller's
door and he goes, what the hell

1511
01:16:19,960 --> 01:16:24,600
are you doing here?
And and I said, well, I told you

1512
01:16:24,600 --> 01:16:25,640
I was going to come in and see
you.

1513
01:16:25,640 --> 01:16:28,280
And he said I told you not to.
And I said it doesn't matter.

1514
01:16:28,280 --> 01:16:30,680
You know, you seem like a nice
enough guy.

1515
01:16:30,680 --> 01:16:33,000
And, and you know, I want to fix
the problem.

1516
01:16:33,040 --> 01:16:34,920
Tell me what the problem is.
How can I fix it?

1517
01:16:35,880 --> 01:16:39,240
So I worked my ass off and next
thing you know, I sold them, you

1518
01:16:39,240 --> 01:16:44,520
know, 24 of at the time our
biggest lights and and tons of

1519
01:16:44,520 --> 01:16:46,640
other stuff.
And they became a huge customer

1520
01:16:46,640 --> 01:16:50,000
for Martin over the years.
But just because I refused to to

1521
01:16:50,000 --> 01:16:52,040
go down in literal flames, you
know?

1522
01:16:52,200 --> 01:16:53,920
Yeah, because of a burning fog
machine.

1523
01:16:54,400 --> 01:16:57,120
Absolutely.
But anyways, my stories aside,

1524
01:16:57,440 --> 01:16:58,520
gone no.
No, of course.

1525
01:16:59,600 --> 01:17:01,000
Yeah.
So that's kind of how I end up

1526
01:17:01,000 --> 01:17:03,200
on on M series, which eventually
became Onyx.

1527
01:17:03,800 --> 01:17:06,760
And like I said, I've, I've
known Matthias for yeah, to be

1528
01:17:06,760 --> 01:17:09,680
going on 15 years.
Yeah, he's a good guy, super

1529
01:17:09,680 --> 01:17:11,200
fun.
I was, I always like catching up

1530
01:17:11,200 --> 01:17:12,200
with him.
Yeah.

1531
01:17:13,400 --> 01:17:16,600
And yeah.
So I was in, I was in Lai was

1532
01:17:16,600 --> 01:17:20,960
doing season 1 of Perry Mason.
And there's a, there's a

1533
01:17:21,520 --> 01:17:24,280
Facebook forum, which is all,
you know, Hollywood programmers.

1534
01:17:26,320 --> 01:17:29,840
And Bennett posted saying he was
going up to Calgary to do

1535
01:17:31,800 --> 01:17:33,680
Ghostbusters and he did a
rigging program.

1536
01:17:33,680 --> 01:17:36,440
And I was like, oh, that'd be
cool because I kind of wanted to

1537
01:17:36,440 --> 01:17:38,760
dip my toes back into the hog
world again because it's very,

1538
01:17:38,760 --> 01:17:41,720
very widely used in Hollywood.
And I set off, you know, if you

1539
01:17:41,720 --> 01:17:44,160
get a little hog from anyone,
Ben's the guy to learn it from.

1540
01:17:44,160 --> 01:17:46,120
And so him and I were.
Interesting.

1541
01:17:46,320 --> 01:17:51,520
I think Ben was on the podcast.
No, no, he was on the podcast,

1542
01:17:51,520 --> 01:17:54,640
but he was telling me.
I just seemed to recall him, him

1543
01:17:54,640 --> 01:18:02,840
doing this thing, this
Ghostbusters when and he was on

1544
01:18:02,840 --> 01:18:05,440
the podcast and it was secret,
but we didn't start the podcast

1545
01:18:05,440 --> 01:18:07,400
until 2019.
So.

1546
01:18:07,440 --> 01:18:09,160
Yeah, yeah, it was way before
that.

1547
01:18:09,600 --> 01:18:11,200
Yeah.
I don't remember something about

1548
01:18:11,200 --> 01:18:13,520
him going to Calgary because he
said I got to go to Calgary

1549
01:18:13,680 --> 01:18:15,160
something and I can't talk about
it.

1550
01:18:15,640 --> 01:18:18,160
Maybe there was.
There was another Ghostbusters

1551
01:18:18,160 --> 01:18:19,520
filmed in Calgary.
Or something.

1552
01:18:19,600 --> 01:18:21,080
It's just the one.
It was just the one.

1553
01:18:21,080 --> 01:18:24,600
I mean, it was a few years ago.
My old sounds about rock on me

1554
01:18:24,600 --> 01:18:27,080
right now.
We were, we were in discussions

1555
01:18:27,080 --> 01:18:29,240
19.
It was 2019 because we were in

1556
01:18:29,240 --> 01:18:31,440
discussions, you know, we were
talking about me going and doing

1557
01:18:31,440 --> 01:18:35,200
it that with him.
And then I got a phone call

1558
01:18:36,040 --> 01:18:39,720
about going to do Marvel's one
division.

1559
01:18:41,880 --> 01:18:44,160
And, you know, like, if you
work, if you're, if you're a

1560
01:18:44,160 --> 01:18:46,480
film lighting programmer, like
Marvel's, like the peak of the

1561
01:18:46,480 --> 01:18:48,280
mountain, that's really bad, No.
Kidding.

1562
01:18:48,360 --> 01:18:51,520
Yeah.
And so, yeah, I was asked to

1563
01:18:51,520 --> 01:18:53,400
come and do you know, because
that's when they were starting

1564
01:18:53,400 --> 01:18:57,840
to really get into streaming
television and I got a phone

1565
01:18:57,840 --> 01:18:58,800
call.
Hey, man, can you come to

1566
01:18:58,800 --> 01:19:00,640
Atlanta and do one division?
I was like, Yep.

1567
01:19:01,640 --> 01:19:04,920
Wow.
So off I went and it was one of

1568
01:19:04,920 --> 01:19:06,520
those things, it was a really
cool experience.

1569
01:19:06,520 --> 01:19:11,200
Go to go to Atlanta for 5-5
months, work at Trellis, work on

1570
01:19:11,200 --> 01:19:15,960
this big Marvel production.
And you know, it was, it was a

1571
01:19:15,960 --> 01:19:19,920
really, really cool thing.
And it was one of those moments

1572
01:19:19,920 --> 01:19:21,800
where you know, like you're
like, oh, my career is doing

1573
01:19:21,800 --> 01:19:22,880
this.
I'm finally getting to this

1574
01:19:22,880 --> 01:19:25,320
point that I want to be at and
then COVID happens.

1575
01:19:25,960 --> 01:19:29,120
Yeah.
And you know, it was

1576
01:19:29,120 --> 01:19:31,440
interesting.
We finished, we finished filming

1577
01:19:31,640 --> 01:19:37,040
in Atlanta in end of, I think it
was the last week of February

1578
01:19:37,840 --> 01:19:40,920
and we were supposed to take
three weeks off and then we were

1579
01:19:40,920 --> 01:19:43,880
going to go back to LA and film
a few more weeks in LA.

1580
01:19:43,880 --> 01:19:46,480
You were taken 3 weeks off to to
slow the curve.

1581
01:19:47,200 --> 01:19:50,120
But no, no, well, there was,
there wasn't a curve at that, so

1582
01:19:50,120 --> 01:19:52,160
I didn't even start that stage.
Yeah.

1583
01:19:52,680 --> 01:19:55,520
So I fly by.
That we just didn't know, right?

1584
01:19:55,760 --> 01:19:56,120
Right.
Yeah.

1585
01:19:56,880 --> 01:20:01,680
I fly back to Portland, fly back
to, yeah, fly back to LA, get my

1586
01:20:01,680 --> 01:20:03,160
car.
I just got in a new apartment

1587
01:20:03,160 --> 01:20:05,280
because I knew I was going to be
in LA for a couple of months,

1588
01:20:07,240 --> 01:20:09,600
Went back to my house in
Portland and then sat there for

1589
01:20:09,600 --> 01:20:12,360
the next 3 1/2 months waiting
for things to come back up

1590
01:20:12,360 --> 01:20:15,320
again.
And then you know what it was

1591
01:20:15,320 --> 01:20:19,640
supposed to have been, you know,
three weeks of shooting at the

1592
01:20:19,640 --> 01:20:22,800
end of one division ended up
being, I think, 6 or 8 weeks.

1593
01:20:23,720 --> 01:20:26,200
Because they decided to rewrite
a whole bunch of the story and

1594
01:20:26,200 --> 01:20:27,920
recast one of the kids.
There was a whole bunch of

1595
01:20:27,920 --> 01:20:29,920
stuff.
So it turned into this big, you

1596
01:20:29,920 --> 01:20:32,000
know, we were one of the first
shows to come back out of the

1597
01:20:32,000 --> 01:20:37,400
gate post COVID.
And you know, it was, it was

1598
01:20:40,160 --> 01:20:43,360
this sort of a bit of a lifeline
after that big, you know, after

1599
01:20:43,360 --> 01:20:46,160
that big break, because my gear,
it's been shipping back from

1600
01:20:46,160 --> 01:20:48,800
Atlanta and landed at the rental
house in Los Angeles.

1601
01:20:49,480 --> 01:20:52,080
And basically the the week it
landed, everything got shut

1602
01:20:52,080 --> 01:20:54,560
down.
So all of my gear was locked up

1603
01:20:54,560 --> 01:20:56,000
in the rental house.
I hadn't touched the lighting

1604
01:20:56,000 --> 01:20:57,720
console in, you know, four
months.

1605
01:20:58,280 --> 01:20:59,800
And then I'm like, I'm back on
the movie.

1606
01:20:59,800 --> 01:21:02,960
So I'm like, what is this?
How does this go again?

1607
01:21:03,520 --> 01:21:04,480
OK.
And then you're back into it.

1608
01:21:04,880 --> 01:21:08,480
Yeah.
So yeah, did that and then.

1609
01:21:09,240 --> 01:21:11,440
So you were only off for a few
months because of COVID?

1610
01:21:12,320 --> 01:21:14,840
There's about four months, yeah,
four, 4 1/2 months.

1611
01:21:14,840 --> 01:21:17,880
Yeah, I know television and and
movies and stuff were a lot

1612
01:21:17,880 --> 01:21:21,240
quicker to come back.
And then obviously live events.

1613
01:21:21,680 --> 01:21:24,800
Yeah, totally.
But yeah, three or four months,

1614
01:21:24,800 --> 01:21:28,920
that's like a nice break.
That's not, not necessarily you

1615
01:21:28,920 --> 01:21:31,840
know, life changing like it was
for so many people in our

1616
01:21:31,840 --> 01:21:33,640
industry or companies in our
industry.

1617
01:21:34,080 --> 01:21:37,200
I, I remember talking with Ben a
bunch of times during that as

1618
01:21:37,200 --> 01:21:40,760
well and what he was going
through and, and those kinds of

1619
01:21:40,760 --> 01:21:41,280
things.
So.

1620
01:21:41,560 --> 01:21:44,360
Well, and one of the, one of the
things that happened during a

1621
01:21:44,360 --> 01:21:46,760
lot of that period is a lot of
people got together and they

1622
01:21:46,760 --> 01:21:49,640
were doing podcasts and talking
to each other and, and, and

1623
01:21:49,640 --> 01:21:53,120
doing things.
And this is kind of what ties

1624
01:21:53,120 --> 01:21:58,120
into the Ben thing again, in a
minute, You know, I'd been doing

1625
01:21:58,120 --> 01:22:01,720
some stuff for Obsidian and I
did some, some training stuff

1626
01:22:01,720 --> 01:22:06,440
for them during COVID and worked
on a few shows.

1627
01:22:06,480 --> 01:22:10,720
And then I was still really
heavily into the into the sort

1628
01:22:10,720 --> 01:22:15,160
of M series Onyx stuff because I
was, you know, Hell's Kitchen is

1629
01:22:15,160 --> 01:22:18,640
all done on Onyx.
Love is Blind is down on Onyx.

1630
01:22:18,640 --> 01:22:21,440
There's a whole bunch of that
sort of reality TV stuff that

1631
01:22:21,840 --> 01:22:24,160
that if you know, Ed Molson, if
you guys do, it's all on its

1632
01:22:24,160 --> 01:22:25,720
base.
So it's kind of I float in with

1633
01:22:25,720 --> 01:22:30,800
those guys every now and again.
And I was sort of trying to get

1634
01:22:30,800 --> 01:22:34,000
into the like I said, dipping my
toes in the hog thing.

1635
01:22:34,000 --> 01:22:36,280
And I was sort of had some
questions about some networking

1636
01:22:36,280 --> 01:22:38,760
stuff.
So I called my friend Elton

1637
01:22:38,760 --> 01:22:44,600
James is a big 728 Hulk program
which to like both Suicide Squad

1638
01:22:44,600 --> 01:22:46,480
movies.
He's working on a new Superman

1639
01:22:46,480 --> 01:22:50,880
movie like he's he's he's in the
top five somewhere.

1640
01:22:50,880 --> 01:22:52,520
I don't know which one, but he's
in the top five.

1641
01:22:53,040 --> 01:22:55,200
And I called him up and we, you
know, I had to ask him this

1642
01:22:55,200 --> 01:22:57,240
question about something and it
turned into this three hour

1643
01:22:57,240 --> 01:23:00,840
discussion about, you know, our
programming philosophy and how

1644
01:23:00,840 --> 01:23:05,920
we work and how we like to work
and the things, you know, And I

1645
01:23:05,920 --> 01:23:07,840
was just talking about things
and I said, you know, I felt

1646
01:23:07,840 --> 01:23:10,200
like, you know, one division had
done some really good stuff in

1647
01:23:10,200 --> 01:23:12,520
my career because he's like, I
really like what you did on one

1648
01:23:12,520 --> 01:23:13,600
division.
That was really cool.

1649
01:23:13,600 --> 01:23:17,080
And like to hear that from him
was like, like, this guy's one

1650
01:23:17,080 --> 01:23:19,040
of the guys and he's
complimenting me.

1651
01:23:19,880 --> 01:23:22,080
And I said, I think, I think, I
think it did pretty well for my

1652
01:23:22,080 --> 01:23:23,240
stock.
He's like, dude, if you're a hug

1653
01:23:23,240 --> 01:23:24,560
guy, you'd be in the top 10
already.

1654
01:23:26,240 --> 01:23:28,280
Yeah, Really.
Wow.

1655
01:23:28,280 --> 01:23:30,360
OK, time to think.
Time to think.

1656
01:23:30,360 --> 01:23:32,920
So literally the next day I
called a mate of mine.

1657
01:23:32,920 --> 01:23:34,520
I'm like, have you heard a spare
Rd.

1658
01:23:34,520 --> 01:23:36,760
Hog?
And he went, yeah, I said can I

1659
01:23:36,760 --> 01:23:38,120
borrow it?
He went, Yep.

1660
01:23:38,960 --> 01:23:41,760
So I went over and I picked it
up and you know, I was key

1661
01:23:41,760 --> 01:23:44,960
programming on a, on a fairly
big TV show working 70 hours a

1662
01:23:44,960 --> 01:23:47,200
week.
I would go to work for my

1663
01:23:47,680 --> 01:23:49,680
10/12/14 now day, whatever it
was.

1664
01:23:49,680 --> 01:23:52,800
I would come home and basically
I sat down at the road hog for a

1665
01:23:52,800 --> 01:23:56,040
couple of hours a night and
started pressing buttons, going

1666
01:23:56,040 --> 01:23:58,280
through and making notes, making
Cheat Sheets to all this sort of

1667
01:23:58,280 --> 01:24:00,240
stuff.
And I was like, OK, so this is

1668
01:24:00,240 --> 01:24:02,560
basically the same.
I kind of remember most of this,

1669
01:24:03,280 --> 01:24:04,760
but the carryovers are very
similar.

1670
01:24:05,120 --> 01:24:06,440
You know, there's a lot of
similarities.

1671
01:24:06,440 --> 01:24:09,200
I mean, you know, it's like all
consoles basically do the same

1672
01:24:09,200 --> 01:24:10,800
thing.
It's just the keystrokes and.

1673
01:24:11,160 --> 01:24:12,920
You know my.
Shit and text.

1674
01:24:13,360 --> 01:24:15,120
Yeah, exactly.
I mean, I just have to remember

1675
01:24:15,120 --> 01:24:18,040
when I'm on a hog, I have to
speak Yoda as opposed to like,

1676
01:24:18,160 --> 01:24:20,320
you know, Onyx base regular
English.

1677
01:24:20,760 --> 01:24:23,040
Yeah, as soon as I speak, Yoda,
I'm fine.

1678
01:24:23,600 --> 01:24:27,600
That's funny.
So I was doing all that, and

1679
01:24:29,760 --> 01:24:32,280
Elton calls me up one day and
he's like, hey, you go, man.

1680
01:24:32,280 --> 01:24:34,120
I'm like, yeah, good.
He's like, how you going with

1681
01:24:34,120 --> 01:24:35,520
the hog thing?
I said, oh dude, it's going

1682
01:24:35,520 --> 01:24:36,840
really good.
Like the work that had to do

1683
01:24:36,840 --> 01:24:39,440
this and this and this and this.
He said, do you reckon you could

1684
01:24:39,440 --> 01:24:41,120
do a show with her?
I said, but give it a go.

1685
01:24:41,120 --> 01:24:44,200
And he's like, oh, I've got a
friend that's looking for a

1686
01:24:44,200 --> 01:24:46,840
program where I said, Oh yeah,
what's the what's the gig?

1687
01:24:46,840 --> 01:24:49,200
He said oh, it's second unit on
Black Panther 2.

1688
01:24:50,320 --> 01:24:51,680
Damn.
I would know.

1689
01:24:52,040 --> 01:24:55,000
I said, oh, who's who's the guy
who's like, he's like, oh, it's

1690
01:24:55,000 --> 01:24:59,680
the guy that did Avatar, right?
So who's that?

1691
01:25:01,680 --> 01:25:03,600
His name's Dan Riffle.
OK.

1692
01:25:04,320 --> 01:25:06,720
Yeah, he did, He did.
He did the second Avatar movie.

1693
01:25:06,720 --> 01:25:09,440
And I think he just that that
thing that just came out about

1694
01:25:09,440 --> 01:25:10,840
Saturday Night Live, he did that
as well.

1695
01:25:10,840 --> 01:25:12,720
He's done some big stuff, big
stuff.

1696
01:25:13,760 --> 01:25:17,280
And I said, what you did, you
think this is a little, a little

1697
01:25:17,280 --> 01:25:19,600
much for me at this stage?
He said, he said, do you reckon

1698
01:25:19,600 --> 01:25:21,640
you can do it?
I said, I said, I reckon I can

1699
01:25:21,640 --> 01:25:23,120
give it a go.
And I said don't find me in the

1700
01:25:23,120 --> 01:25:25,360
first week, I should be fine.
He said, all right, cool, I'll

1701
01:25:25,360 --> 01:25:32,040
give you a number then.
So he he gave Dan my number.

1702
01:25:32,040 --> 01:25:33,760
Dan called me up.
We had a conversation.

1703
01:25:34,360 --> 01:25:38,080
I said, I said, listen, man, you
know, I know how to do the job.

1704
01:25:38,760 --> 01:25:41,560
And I always have this
conversation when a gaffer calls

1705
01:25:41,560 --> 01:25:43,720
me up.
I'm like, OK, this is who I am.

1706
01:25:43,760 --> 01:25:46,040
This is kind of how I work.
I'm going to bring this, this

1707
01:25:46,040 --> 01:25:48,840
and this.
I would hope that you would

1708
01:25:48,840 --> 01:25:51,400
bring this, this and this.
And if they if they say yes, I

1709
01:25:51,400 --> 01:25:53,160
usually take the job.
Yeah.

1710
01:25:53,840 --> 01:25:57,520
You know, and so, yeah, we had a
really cool conversation.

1711
01:25:57,520 --> 01:25:59,880
And then, then the thing that
sealed the deal was he said, oh,

1712
01:25:59,920 --> 01:26:04,520
Scott Barnes is the lead
programmer and Scotty's the guy.

1713
01:26:04,960 --> 01:26:07,000
Yeah.
Scotty is the guy in Hollywood.

1714
01:26:07,000 --> 01:26:11,360
So I was like, so I'm going to
be on stage 1 and Scotty's going

1715
01:26:11,360 --> 01:26:15,600
to be working over on stage 2.
He went, Yep, if I've got any

1716
01:26:15,600 --> 01:26:17,520
problems, I'm just Nick walked
next door and asked Scotty.

1717
01:26:17,720 --> 01:26:20,760
So it seemed like the perfect,
the perfect thing.

1718
01:26:21,320 --> 01:26:24,920
So I go and I do that.
And my philosophy was if I don't

1719
01:26:24,920 --> 01:26:26,800
get fired in the first week, I
can do this.

1720
01:26:27,240 --> 01:26:28,440
Yeah.
Because, you know, I've done

1721
01:26:28,440 --> 01:26:30,080
shows similar to that level.
It wasn't.

1722
01:26:30,080 --> 01:26:32,680
It wasn't anything totally
different from what you're.

1723
01:26:32,680 --> 01:26:36,640
On a big console.
Yeah, but like I said, I'd

1724
01:26:36,720 --> 01:26:39,640
literally spent, you know, it
was like cramming for an exam.

1725
01:26:39,960 --> 01:26:41,920
Yeah.
And literally had a notebook

1726
01:26:41,920 --> 01:26:43,080
where I'd written down and
haven't.

1727
01:26:43,080 --> 01:26:47,000
Been on a movie set and you
know, Yeah.

1728
01:26:47,000 --> 01:26:49,400
Under fire, as it were.
Yeah, I'm used.

1729
01:26:49,400 --> 01:26:53,320
I'm used to your, your idol next
to you, you know, Right.

1730
01:26:53,360 --> 01:26:54,800
Yeah, it was.
It was tough.

1731
01:26:56,400 --> 01:26:58,120
But it was all again, you know,
like.

1732
01:26:58,440 --> 01:27:00,840
I've I've had.
Been very lucky, I think, in my

1733
01:27:00,840 --> 01:27:02,760
career that I made the right
people at the right time.

1734
01:27:03,160 --> 01:27:05,040
Yeah.
And, and Dan was great.

1735
01:27:05,080 --> 01:27:09,200
And he really knows, really
knows what he wants.

1736
01:27:09,200 --> 01:27:11,360
He knows how to ask for it.
He knows how to communicate with

1737
01:27:11,360 --> 01:27:15,200
a programmer, which not a lot of
gaffers necessarily do.

1738
01:27:15,200 --> 01:27:16,880
The really, really good ones
too.

1739
01:27:17,800 --> 01:27:23,000
Dan's probably one of the best.
And it was funny because, you

1740
01:27:23,000 --> 01:27:25,040
know, we did the first couple
days and I was kind of like,

1741
01:27:25,040 --> 01:27:26,800
Yep, cool, come and Yep, here it
is.

1742
01:27:26,800 --> 01:27:28,360
Got it.
OK, next, next.

1743
01:27:28,360 --> 01:27:30,920
We get through everything.
And I got him at the end of the

1744
01:27:30,920 --> 01:27:32,880
second day and I was like, hey,
man, I just want to check in

1745
01:27:32,880 --> 01:27:35,240
and, and see how you're feeling
about everything.

1746
01:27:35,240 --> 01:27:36,560
I think the communication is
good.

1747
01:27:36,560 --> 01:27:37,800
How you feeling about the
workflow?

1748
01:27:37,800 --> 01:27:40,120
He's like, yeah, no, I said I
think it's really good.

1749
01:27:40,120 --> 01:27:42,400
I'm like, oh, that's cool, man,
because I haven't really

1750
01:27:42,400 --> 01:27:44,080
programmed on a hog in like a
decade.

1751
01:27:44,520 --> 01:27:47,120
And his fights just dropped.
And he went, really?

1752
01:27:47,520 --> 01:27:49,960
I said, yeah, I thought I told
you that.

1753
01:27:50,360 --> 01:27:54,120
And he's like, oh, well, you're
doing really good, just keep it

1754
01:27:54,120 --> 01:27:56,600
up.
I went cool, That's awesome.

1755
01:27:57,200 --> 01:28:00,760
So I went and did that.
And at the time I'd been doing

1756
01:28:00,760 --> 01:28:05,760
ATV show called The Offer, and I
had to leave The Offer to go and

1757
01:28:05,760 --> 01:28:07,720
do Black Panther.
But it was one of those things,

1758
01:28:08,080 --> 01:28:09,680
you know, I was never really
wanted.

1759
01:28:09,680 --> 01:28:14,560
Like if I start a show, I want
to finish the show, but when you

1760
01:28:14,560 --> 01:28:16,800
get a phone call to do something
like Black Panther, you go and

1761
01:28:16,800 --> 01:28:19,240
do it.
So I did that and then I came

1762
01:28:19,240 --> 01:28:24,200
back and I finished the offer.
And during the course of that,

1763
01:28:26,240 --> 01:28:29,800
well, like I said, while I was
studying the hog thing, a lot of

1764
01:28:29,800 --> 01:28:35,440
the guys had done a series of
videos during COVID.

1765
01:28:35,440 --> 01:28:39,080
And one of the videos, it was,
again, it was Scott Barnes,

1766
01:28:39,080 --> 01:28:42,080
Elton James Benoit, Dave Slot
Key, Josh Satch, they're all

1767
01:28:42,080 --> 01:28:44,240
sitting there talking about hog
and how they use it and their

1768
01:28:44,240 --> 01:28:45,400
process and all this sort of
stuff.

1769
01:28:46,000 --> 01:28:48,000
And I watched it and there was a
there was a thing that Benoit

1770
01:28:48,080 --> 01:28:51,600
said, I'm like, I think he means
this, but I'm not 100%.

1771
01:28:51,600 --> 01:28:53,960
Oh, OK, so I just got onto
Facebook and I was like, hi,

1772
01:28:53,960 --> 01:28:56,040
Ben, it's jokey.
I was watching this video and

1773
01:28:56,360 --> 01:28:58,080
you said this.
I just wanted to clarify what

1774
01:28:58,080 --> 01:29:00,200
you meant.
So he messaged me back and it

1775
01:29:00,200 --> 01:29:02,240
started this dialogue and he's
like, oh, what are you doing

1776
01:29:02,240 --> 01:29:04,560
right now?
I said, oh, I'm doing.

1777
01:29:05,520 --> 01:29:07,040
I'm doing Black Panther 2 in
Atlanta.

1778
01:29:07,040 --> 01:29:09,000
I'm doing doing.
This little movie.

1779
01:29:09,600 --> 01:29:12,720
Yeah, well, we did.
We did one, we did one section

1780
01:29:12,720 --> 01:29:14,800
of second unit and then I went
back to the offer and then that

1781
01:29:14,800 --> 01:29:18,200
finished and then we did we,
they called me back for the

1782
01:29:18,200 --> 01:29:20,360
second part, which was like,
wow, I did a good job.

1783
01:29:20,960 --> 01:29:22,760
I guess I won.
Yeah.

1784
01:29:22,760 --> 01:29:24,800
And so I was, I was on that and
I was talking to Ben.

1785
01:29:24,800 --> 01:29:27,560
I'm like, well, I'm doing this
thing in Atlanta.

1786
01:29:27,560 --> 01:29:28,760
He's like, oh, what are you
doing after that?

1787
01:29:28,760 --> 01:29:31,440
I said, never really have any
lined up after that.

1788
01:29:31,440 --> 01:29:33,360
And he's like I said, I've got
this little movie I need a

1789
01:29:33,360 --> 01:29:35,600
programmer for, can you come and
do you want to come and help?

1790
01:29:35,600 --> 01:29:38,800
And I was like, oh, yeah, cool
was was this little movie called

1791
01:29:38,800 --> 01:29:40,720
80 for Brady.
And it was like, you know, Sally

1792
01:29:40,720 --> 01:29:43,600
Field and Jane Fonda.
It was it was it was a fun

1793
01:29:43,600 --> 01:29:46,360
little thing to work.
And it wasn't big, but it was a

1794
01:29:46,360 --> 01:29:49,480
chance to work with Benoit.
And, you know, if you're going

1795
01:29:49,480 --> 01:29:51,360
to learn hog, you learn from a
master.

1796
01:29:52,120 --> 01:29:53,600
So I thought, oh, this would be
really good.

1797
01:29:54,680 --> 01:29:56,840
And, you know, I knew who he was
and I'd always been interested

1798
01:29:56,840 --> 01:29:59,960
to meet him and work with him.
And so I walked in on the first

1799
01:29:59,960 --> 01:30:02,440
day and he was super cool.
We get along.

1800
01:30:02,440 --> 01:30:04,640
You know, he's he's Canadian, so
I don't have to explain the

1801
01:30:04,640 --> 01:30:07,480
jokes.
Yeah, it's just helpful.

1802
01:30:10,880 --> 01:30:15,400
And so we sat down the first day
and I said, OK, I said, you

1803
01:30:15,400 --> 01:30:17,080
know, I'm going to be setting up
your console for you.

1804
01:30:17,080 --> 01:30:18,600
What do you want?
He's like, oh, well, this, this

1805
01:30:18,600 --> 01:30:21,440
and this.
I went OK, So I went through and

1806
01:30:21,440 --> 01:30:24,480
I did all that.
And I was like, well, you know,

1807
01:30:24,480 --> 01:30:27,440
in my experience, you've got
this, but I would also want

1808
01:30:27,440 --> 01:30:29,800
these things.
So I built in that as well.

1809
01:30:32,120 --> 01:30:34,560
He walks in the next day.
I'm like, OK, so I did that.

1810
01:30:34,560 --> 01:30:36,960
And then I did this and that.
Could have gone either way,

1811
01:30:36,960 --> 01:30:39,680
right?
Like that could have been bad or

1812
01:30:39,680 --> 01:30:42,160
that could have been good, yeah.
But he's like, Oh my God, this

1813
01:30:42,160 --> 01:30:45,120
is amazing.
And so we just kind of, we just

1814
01:30:45,120 --> 01:30:47,880
kind of hit the ground running
and, and we found, you know, we

1815
01:30:49,200 --> 01:30:51,800
just a very similar philosophy
in the way we work and post

1816
01:30:51,800 --> 01:30:56,320
relaxed and, and just cool.
And so I worked with him on that

1817
01:30:56,320 --> 01:31:00,720
for about 3 weeks.
Oh, sorry, I think the show went

1818
01:31:00,720 --> 01:31:02,600
for six or eight weeks, but
about 3 weeks into that, he's

1819
01:31:02,600 --> 01:31:03,680
like, what are you doing after
this?

1820
01:31:04,440 --> 01:31:06,520
I said, I don't know, I'm not
sure I'm going to see what's

1821
01:31:07,160 --> 01:31:08,480
what's going on.
He said, well, I haven't locked

1822
01:31:08,480 --> 01:31:10,360
it in yet, but I may, I may have
a job.

1823
01:31:10,360 --> 01:31:11,800
You might be interested.
I said, Oh yeah, what's that?

1824
01:31:11,800 --> 01:31:16,080
He says, well, happens in a
Galaxy far, far away.

1825
01:31:17,480 --> 01:31:20,680
Oh, wow.
Do tell.

1826
01:31:22,080 --> 01:31:25,320
And he asked me to be his
rigging programmer on Skeleton

1827
01:31:25,320 --> 01:31:28,440
Crew, which has just come out on
Disney Plus recently.

1828
01:31:28,520 --> 01:31:31,240
Yeah.
And it was one of those things

1829
01:31:31,240 --> 01:31:34,360
I, I I am denied about it
because at the time, I was

1830
01:31:34,360 --> 01:31:38,920
living up in Valencia, you know,
Valencia, Santa Clarita, and

1831
01:31:38,960 --> 01:31:41,160
Star Wars was shooting down in
Manhattan Beach.

1832
01:31:42,560 --> 01:31:45,400
And that would have meant, you
know, two, 2 1/2 hours of

1833
01:31:45,400 --> 01:31:50,160
driving every day.
Yeah, and again, it was one of

1834
01:31:50,160 --> 01:31:53,640
those things like I, you know, I
wasn't concerned about having

1835
01:31:53,640 --> 01:31:57,480
the chops to do the job or
anything, but I was a bit and I

1836
01:31:57,480 --> 01:31:59,760
called Elton and I was like,
hey, man, I just got to run this

1837
01:31:59,760 --> 01:32:02,360
by you.
You know, Ben Wyers just asked

1838
01:32:02,360 --> 01:32:04,000
me to do Star Wars with him.
And he's like, why are you

1839
01:32:04,000 --> 01:32:05,760
calling me?
I'm like, what?

1840
01:32:05,920 --> 01:32:07,840
What do you mean?
He's like, dude, it's Ben Wire

1841
01:32:07,840 --> 01:32:09,880
and it's and it's Star Wars.
Just say yes.

1842
01:32:10,280 --> 01:32:12,480
Yeah, OK, He's got a.
Point.

1843
01:32:12,520 --> 01:32:14,680
Yeah, he's got a point.
He absolutely did.

1844
01:32:15,040 --> 01:32:18,800
And what was cool about it, what
was cool about it is I've

1845
01:32:18,800 --> 01:32:20,880
worked, you know, like I said,
I've worked in the film industry

1846
01:32:20,880 --> 01:32:26,760
since 2006 and films very
different to, you know, theater

1847
01:32:26,760 --> 01:32:29,960
or rock'n'roll or whatever.
You know, you have, you have the

1848
01:32:29,960 --> 01:32:32,720
first unit crew that's on set
making the movie and you have

1849
01:32:32,720 --> 01:32:35,400
the ringing crew that, that
prepares everything.

1850
01:32:35,800 --> 01:32:39,000
You know, like in, in, in
concert lighting, the, the, the

1851
01:32:39,000 --> 01:32:41,560
touring crew comes in, they set
everything up and then they run

1852
01:32:41,560 --> 01:32:43,760
it.
Whereas in film, you, you have a

1853
01:32:43,760 --> 01:32:45,680
rig crew and you have a shooting
crew.

1854
01:32:45,680 --> 01:32:50,480
And yeah, you know, how those
two departments interact is

1855
01:32:50,480 --> 01:32:53,240
critical to the way things work
and how efficient, how

1856
01:32:53,240 --> 01:32:54,960
efficiently they work.
Yeah.

1857
01:32:55,000 --> 01:33:00,880
Now, you know, like I said,
until the advent of LEDs, you

1858
01:33:00,880 --> 01:33:04,800
know, in mid twenty 10s, it was
all tungsten lights and, you

1859
01:33:04,800 --> 01:33:07,720
know, SUDI 80 dimmer packs or
sensor acts and it was just lots

1860
01:33:07,720 --> 01:33:10,200
of cable and lots of power and
all this sort of stuff.

1861
01:33:10,240 --> 01:33:12,400
The technology's really changed.
Yeah.

1862
01:33:12,720 --> 01:33:15,440
You know, it used to be if you
had two universes on a show,

1863
01:33:15,440 --> 01:33:17,880
that was a lot.
You know, one of our one of our

1864
01:33:17,880 --> 01:33:21,560
seven stages on skeleton crew at
128 universes.

1865
01:33:22,040 --> 01:33:24,720
Jesus, wow.
So.

1866
01:33:25,160 --> 01:33:28,160
Lights are more reliable now
too, like there's not as much

1867
01:33:28,240 --> 01:33:30,440
repair being done because the
heat is.

1868
01:33:31,080 --> 01:33:33,680
The heat isn't as extensive as
it used to be with all the

1869
01:33:33,680 --> 01:33:35,840
discharge lamps and tungsten
lamps and stuff.

1870
01:33:36,320 --> 01:33:38,440
But now you've got all these
multi parameter fixtures like,

1871
01:33:38,440 --> 01:33:41,680
you know, like Skype channels,
20 channels, the vortex is 20

1872
01:33:41,680 --> 01:33:43,760
channels.
You know you can you can get a

1873
01:33:44,400 --> 01:33:48,120
like a Skype panel S 360 to 196
channels per fixture.

1874
01:33:48,440 --> 01:33:51,760
Yeah.
So how we now go about data

1875
01:33:51,760 --> 01:33:54,600
infrastructure and and
networking is hugely different.

1876
01:33:55,840 --> 01:34:01,080
And so, you know, I hadn't, I
hadn't actually really used any

1877
01:34:01,080 --> 01:34:05,600
artnet until 20/15/2016.
It wasn't something that I did.

1878
01:34:05,600 --> 01:34:06,920
You didn't need it?
Yeah.

1879
01:34:07,080 --> 01:34:09,640
DMX was then it.
Became a thing and and then that

1880
01:34:09,640 --> 01:34:12,080
was the thing that I became
super interested in.

1881
01:34:12,560 --> 01:34:14,520
So you know, Ben calls me and
he's like, hey, do you want to

1882
01:34:14,520 --> 01:34:17,800
come and do skeleton crew?
I said, OK, here's here's how

1883
01:34:17,800 --> 01:34:21,440
I'd like to approach this.
Instead of us working for the

1884
01:34:21,440 --> 01:34:26,360
rigging crew as DMX techs, why
don't we do lighting control as

1885
01:34:26,360 --> 01:34:29,080
our own department?
And he's like, what do you mean?

1886
01:34:29,080 --> 01:34:33,480
I said, look, you draw the plots
that in conjunction with the

1887
01:34:33,480 --> 01:34:37,520
gaffe and the DP, we work out
the numbering, we work out where

1888
01:34:37,520 --> 01:34:41,240
all the data cablings are on.
Basically we deliver lights to

1889
01:34:41,240 --> 01:34:43,000
the crew that are set up ready
to rig.

1890
01:34:43,440 --> 01:34:45,120
They rig them, plug in the
power.

1891
01:34:45,600 --> 01:34:47,360
We give them access to the data
stuff.

1892
01:34:47,760 --> 01:34:50,920
We do the networking, we do the
DMX work, we do all that stuff.

1893
01:34:52,640 --> 01:34:55,000
They just have to worry about
making sure that there's power

1894
01:34:55,000 --> 01:34:57,120
there and the lights are we're
going to make sure that they

1895
01:34:57,120 --> 01:34:58,400
work.
You know, that was, that was the

1896
01:34:58,400 --> 01:35:02,320
basic overview, like let the
data nerds do data nerds shit,

1897
01:35:02,440 --> 01:35:04,480
Let the rigging crew do
electrical stuff.

1898
01:35:05,240 --> 01:35:06,880
And they went, you know, there's
only one it was.

1899
01:35:06,880 --> 01:35:08,800
Carved up like that though.
Anyways, is it?

1900
01:35:08,800 --> 01:35:12,520
Is it due to different unions
or?

1901
01:35:12,760 --> 01:35:14,880
No, I mean, we're all, we're all
in the same union.

1902
01:35:14,880 --> 01:35:22,800
But the reality is laying at
four and setting up managed

1903
01:35:22,800 --> 01:35:27,240
networks, which is the two very,
very different skill sets, and

1904
01:35:28,840 --> 01:35:30,920
some guys just aren't interested
in learning that.

1905
01:35:31,400 --> 01:35:34,440
Yeah, It just seems like in the
live event space, it's all done

1906
01:35:34,440 --> 01:35:39,120
by the same cruise, you know,
whereas it's very specialized

1907
01:35:39,120 --> 01:35:44,160
and very departmentalized in,
in, it is compartmentalized in,

1908
01:35:44,160 --> 01:35:45,680
in.
What TV and movie?

1909
01:35:45,680 --> 01:35:47,880
That's just the nature of the
way a film set works.

1910
01:35:48,040 --> 01:35:50,840
Yeah, Yeah.
It was the most confusing thing

1911
01:35:50,840 --> 01:35:52,600
to me when I got onto a film
set.

1912
01:35:52,600 --> 01:35:56,360
And, you know, Hayes machines
were done by special effects.

1913
01:35:56,360 --> 01:35:59,360
I'm like, isn't that a lighting
job because there's a lighting

1914
01:35:59,360 --> 01:36:02,120
guy and concert filled lighting.
I always did smoke machines.

1915
01:36:02,160 --> 01:36:04,720
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
But, you know, that's the way

1916
01:36:04,720 --> 01:36:08,360
it's partitioned up, you know,
like, you know, hair

1917
01:36:08,360 --> 01:36:11,040
departments, one thing, makeup
departments, another thing,

1918
01:36:11,040 --> 01:36:12,560
costume departments another
thing.

1919
01:36:12,560 --> 01:36:15,120
Why does it not makes, you know,
and that's all stuff that's on

1920
01:36:15,120 --> 01:36:16,360
an actor.
Yeah.

1921
01:36:16,360 --> 01:36:20,120
Why does it not make sense that,
you know, lighting control would

1922
01:36:20,120 --> 01:36:22,440
be one thing, Man's power would
be another thing.

1923
01:36:22,840 --> 01:36:24,880
Yeah.
It's, I think it's just got to

1924
01:36:24,880 --> 01:36:27,440
the point where some of this
stuff is so specialized.

1925
01:36:27,840 --> 01:36:29,920
Yeah.
Well, the the other thing I'm

1926
01:36:29,920 --> 01:36:33,040
kind of curious about is that
relationship between the because

1927
01:36:33,040 --> 01:36:36,680
I don't, I really don't know
Jack shit about television or or

1928
01:36:36,680 --> 01:36:39,640
movie, film lighting.
I've supplied a lot of it over

1929
01:36:39,640 --> 01:36:41,920
the years, but I don't know
anything about it.

1930
01:36:42,280 --> 01:36:46,520
But when, when we're looking for
that relationship between

1931
01:36:46,600 --> 01:36:50,960
between you and who's the person
that you answer to as the

1932
01:36:50,960 --> 01:36:54,680
programmer?
Is that the as the as the key

1933
01:36:54,680 --> 01:36:58,280
programming you answer to the
the chief lighting technician or

1934
01:36:58,280 --> 01:37:00,320
the gaffer?
Yeah, the gaffer.

1935
01:37:00,320 --> 01:37:03,520
You know he he is the.
Gaffer is the gaffer lighting

1936
01:37:03,520 --> 01:37:07,160
programmer relationship similar
to the LD lighting programmer

1937
01:37:07,160 --> 01:37:09,800
relationship in a, in a concert
tour or a concert.

1938
01:37:09,800 --> 01:37:12,160
Yeah, yeah.
So basically LD would stand

1939
01:37:12,160 --> 01:37:15,680
there and say what I'm thinking
is maybe a red look around the

1940
01:37:15,680 --> 01:37:19,560
the the blah blah blah, and
focus on, you know, her dress

1941
01:37:19,640 --> 01:37:22,480
it, it's or whatever.
It's, it's more it's sort of

1942
01:37:22,480 --> 01:37:25,400
broken down again, because
effectively in on a film set,

1943
01:37:25,400 --> 01:37:27,400
the director of photography is a
lighting designer.

1944
01:37:28,720 --> 01:37:30,600
He's the guy that says, OK,
we're going to put the camera

1945
01:37:30,600 --> 01:37:31,800
here.
There's going to be a backlight

1946
01:37:31,800 --> 01:37:34,880
on chalky that that back wall's
too bright, dim that down the

1947
01:37:34,880 --> 01:37:37,120
light and the alcove there take
that down 20%.

1948
01:37:37,520 --> 01:37:40,040
And depending on the
relationship between the the

1949
01:37:40,040 --> 01:37:43,320
director of photography, the
gaffer and the programmer,

1950
01:37:44,480 --> 01:37:47,960
either either the the DP is
going to filter everything

1951
01:37:47,960 --> 01:37:50,680
through the gaffer, who then
gives the commands to me or how

1952
01:37:50,680 --> 01:37:53,280
I like to do it.
I like to be because the DP will

1953
01:37:53,280 --> 01:37:55,480
have a big car with big screens,
so we can see what all the

1954
01:37:55,480 --> 01:37:57,920
cameras are doing.
I actually really like to park

1955
01:37:57,920 --> 01:38:00,840
myself right next to the DP.
So it's literally me, the gaffer

1956
01:38:00,840 --> 01:38:02,480
and the DP.
And I'm understanding that I'm

1957
01:38:02,480 --> 01:38:03,920
just listening to their
conversation.

1958
01:38:03,920 --> 01:38:05,960
I'm just doing things.
Yeah.

1959
01:38:05,960 --> 01:38:07,440
And then they look at me and
they're like, oh, you did it

1960
01:38:07,440 --> 01:38:09,320
all.
I went, Yep, yeah.

1961
01:38:09,360 --> 01:38:11,960
And then, and if you have a
really good relationship with

1962
01:38:11,960 --> 01:38:15,360
your gaffer, while your gaffer's
out on set, moving something

1963
01:38:15,360 --> 01:38:17,720
around, the DP will turn you and
say, hey, man, can you do this?

1964
01:38:17,720 --> 01:38:20,720
And I'm like, hey, boss, the
boss just asked me to do this.

1965
01:38:20,880 --> 01:38:23,240
Go ahead, you know?
Yeah.

1966
01:38:23,600 --> 01:38:25,920
And then it then then it
becomes.

1967
01:38:26,080 --> 01:38:29,360
Dynamic.
So the the LD or the the DP is

1968
01:38:29,360 --> 01:38:34,320
kind of split or, or that role,
that LD role is split between

1969
01:38:34,320 --> 01:38:38,960
the DP and the gaffer basically,
yeah, the DP is the is sort of

1970
01:38:38,960 --> 01:38:41,520
the director of it all and the
gaffer is the doer.

1971
01:38:41,520 --> 01:38:42,440
He makes it happen.
Yeah.

1972
01:38:42,440 --> 01:38:44,760
Yeah, exactly.
And, you know, again, there are

1973
01:38:44,760 --> 01:38:49,000
some gaffers that have very
technically, very clever

1974
01:38:49,000 --> 01:38:50,760
technically.
And now they can just sit there

1975
01:38:50,760 --> 01:38:53,920
and say, you know, like, like
Dan Riffle will say, oh, can you

1976
01:38:53,920 --> 01:38:59,160
take that some, take that high
beam and pan it less 15° and

1977
01:38:59,160 --> 01:39:04,240
then narrow the beam by by 10%
and just spot on every time.

1978
01:39:04,480 --> 01:39:06,520
Whereas you'll have other guys
to be like, yeah, yeah, just pan

1979
01:39:06,520 --> 01:39:08,480
it, pan it, pan it, pan it.
Now it's too, it's too big.

1980
01:39:08,480 --> 01:39:11,280
Make it smaller and you know,
sometimes they really know the

1981
01:39:11,280 --> 01:39:13,200
language, sometimes they don't,
and it just depends on the

1982
01:39:13,200 --> 01:39:14,640
person.
And I think.

1983
01:39:15,080 --> 01:39:18,480
Part of an important part of my
job because you know, I'm like

1984
01:39:18,480 --> 01:39:22,120
I'm the interface between the
lights and the creatives, which

1985
01:39:22,120 --> 01:39:26,680
is the DP and the gap.
So it's my job to like, I

1986
01:39:26,680 --> 01:39:30,240
actually think as good as I am
at punching the buttons, I

1987
01:39:30,240 --> 01:39:32,800
actually think that my
communication skills is the most

1988
01:39:32,800 --> 01:39:36,280
important part.
And are you ever asked to offer

1989
01:39:36,280 --> 01:39:38,000
feedback?
Like does he ever say, what do

1990
01:39:38,000 --> 01:39:40,440
you think of this?
Look, would you change this or

1991
01:39:40,440 --> 01:39:42,680
that or whatever?
Sometimes, yeah, depends on it,

1992
01:39:42,680 --> 01:39:44,960
depends on the gaffer.
They're like, oh, wouldn't you

1993
01:39:45,040 --> 01:39:47,440
know, Or they'll be like, oh,
just give us a color and you're

1994
01:39:47,440 --> 01:39:49,560
like, OK, what do you think of
that?

1995
01:39:49,640 --> 01:39:51,480
Yeah, it's close.
Have a little bit more red look.

1996
01:39:51,480 --> 01:39:52,560
Yeah, that's good.
OK, cool.

1997
01:39:52,560 --> 01:39:53,680
Lock it in.
Yeah.

1998
01:39:53,800 --> 01:39:55,880
Yeah.
Or you have someone like, you

1999
01:39:55,880 --> 01:39:59,600
know, Jess Hall, who was the the
DP on one division, sends you a

2000
01:39:59,600 --> 01:40:01,920
spreadsheet.
It's like here's my 24 custom

2001
01:40:01,920 --> 01:40:05,240
colors.
And punch them into the console

2002
01:40:05,240 --> 01:40:08,400
and we also need to sit down.
These were created on this

2003
01:40:08,400 --> 01:40:10,200
light.
We then need to Spectra analyze

2004
01:40:10,200 --> 01:40:13,320
these and create matching colors
for these other four lights.

2005
01:40:14,920 --> 01:40:17,520
Fun.
You know, and, but but

2006
01:40:18,000 --> 01:40:20,640
brilliance in the fact that
you've got five different types

2007
01:40:20,640 --> 01:40:22,560
of light and you can just pull
them out and they're going to

2008
01:40:22,560 --> 01:40:25,440
look exactly the same.
It's funny because I remember

2009
01:40:25,440 --> 01:40:29,400
when Benoit was was making that
shift, the transition from

2010
01:40:29,400 --> 01:40:33,360
rock'n'roll to to television
and, and movies and stuff, and

2011
01:40:33,360 --> 01:40:36,120
he was, it was scary, you know,
at the time it was like, hey,

2012
01:40:36,440 --> 01:40:38,680
you know, I, I really think this
could work.

2013
01:40:38,680 --> 01:40:40,200
I'm trying to get closer to
home.

2014
01:40:40,200 --> 01:40:42,400
I think it was when his first
kid was born or something.

2015
01:40:42,400 --> 01:40:44,720
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
And he just really wanted to

2016
01:40:44,720 --> 01:40:48,600
spend more time at home.
And so it was for the best, most

2017
01:40:48,600 --> 01:40:53,680
organic reasons.
And it's obviously worked out,

2018
01:40:53,760 --> 01:40:55,520
you know well.
Yeah, I mean, he practiced some

2019
01:40:55,560 --> 01:41:00,200
amazing stuff like, you know,
Captain Marvel bullet train.

2020
01:41:00,200 --> 01:41:01,840
Yeah.
Just tons of stuff.

2021
01:41:02,200 --> 01:41:05,960
Like he's done some big things.
Didn't he do the he did the

2022
01:41:05,960 --> 01:41:08,760
previous Star Wars one?
What was that one called?

2023
01:41:08,760 --> 01:41:11,480
The Obi Wan Mandalorian or
something didn't he do?

2024
01:41:11,480 --> 01:41:14,360
That you know, Obi Wan Kenobi.
Oh, Obi Wan, right?

2025
01:41:14,360 --> 01:41:15,400
Yeah, that's it.
Yeah.

2026
01:41:15,920 --> 01:41:17,280
That was I.
Don't watch any of those.

2027
01:41:17,280 --> 01:41:19,960
I was AI, was a Star Wars fan,
but then it just got too

2028
01:41:19,960 --> 01:41:21,800
complicated for me and I gave
up.

2029
01:41:22,440 --> 01:41:24,200
I gave up.
I go for simpler movies.

2030
01:41:24,200 --> 01:41:25,000
So much.
A lot.

2031
01:41:25,040 --> 01:41:28,640
But yeah, you know, like, and it
was funny when he asked me to do

2032
01:41:28,640 --> 01:41:31,000
it, I was like, OK.
And we sort of worked out a plan

2033
01:41:31,000 --> 01:41:32,880
and.
And luckily everyone was pretty

2034
01:41:32,880 --> 01:41:34,520
on board with trying it this
way.

2035
01:41:34,880 --> 01:41:37,160
Yeah.
You know, we, we had a, you

2036
01:41:37,160 --> 01:41:40,040
know, a younger rigging gaffer
that was interested in trying a

2037
01:41:40,040 --> 01:41:42,360
different.
And I think maybe not, you know,

2038
01:41:42,360 --> 01:41:44,120
like this will take some of this
pressure off me.

2039
01:41:44,120 --> 01:41:45,320
These guys know what they're
doing.

2040
01:41:45,800 --> 01:41:47,480
Yeah.
Because you know, we ended up,

2041
01:41:47,800 --> 01:41:53,560
we ended up running seven or I
think at most we had eight

2042
01:41:53,560 --> 01:41:56,120
stages running at one.
No, it's 7 stages running at one

2043
01:41:56,120 --> 01:41:58,880
stage.
We had a, we had a server on

2044
01:41:58,880 --> 01:42:00,840
each stage.
They were all networked.

2045
01:42:01,160 --> 01:42:04,480
We were jumping between
buildings using VLAN's.

2046
01:42:05,720 --> 01:42:08,280
You know, you've kind of.
Become an expert in that world,

2047
01:42:08,280 --> 01:42:12,400
right?
And, and the data and, and like,

2048
01:42:12,400 --> 01:42:15,800
I mean you, you certainly, I've
checked out your socials and

2049
01:42:15,800 --> 01:42:17,320
stuff.
And by the way, Congrats.

2050
01:42:17,320 --> 01:42:21,520
I mean your, your content, your
content creation and delivery,

2051
01:42:21,920 --> 01:42:27,480
like even just the, the, you
know, the unbox stuff that

2052
01:42:27,480 --> 01:42:29,440
you're doing.
I love that kind of stuff.

2053
01:42:29,440 --> 01:42:32,600
And you're doing a really,
really good job on content

2054
01:42:32,600 --> 01:42:35,800
creation.
And, and I don't know what I

2055
01:42:35,800 --> 01:42:38,240
didn't look at what your views
are or anything.

2056
01:42:38,240 --> 01:42:39,800
And I don't really care,
honestly.

2057
01:42:39,800 --> 01:42:42,160
It's either good or it's bad.
I don't care how many people

2058
01:42:42,160 --> 01:42:44,880
look at it, and it's one of
those things, numbers are always

2059
01:42:44,880 --> 01:42:46,400
going to be small anyways.
They're always going to be

2060
01:42:46,400 --> 01:42:47,840
small.
I mean, it's just the nerds that

2061
01:42:47,840 --> 01:42:49,480
TuneIn and I love you guys.
Thanks for joining.

2062
01:42:50,640 --> 01:42:52,160
Look where I can subscribe.
I'm nerds.

2063
01:42:52,280 --> 01:42:53,280
Kidding.
Yeah.

2064
01:42:54,360 --> 01:42:56,120
Because, I mean, that's that's
where I started at.

2065
01:42:56,120 --> 01:42:58,200
It's like when I was a young guy
getting into lighting.

2066
01:42:58,200 --> 01:43:00,360
I could tell you everything
about every light and what was

2067
01:43:00,360 --> 01:43:00,720
in it.
Yeah.

2068
01:43:00,720 --> 01:43:02,720
How many Cobos it had and how
many channels even.

2069
01:43:02,720 --> 01:43:05,120
Like these days, I just don't.
Does it look pretty cool?

2070
01:43:05,120 --> 01:43:07,240
That works for me.
Does it do the job I name?

2071
01:43:07,240 --> 01:43:09,960
Does it do cry?
Because it's a whole other job

2072
01:43:09,960 --> 01:43:12,760
staying on top of that stuff,
you know, and I used to pride

2073
01:43:12,760 --> 01:43:14,680
myself.
But like, you know, I used to

2074
01:43:14,680 --> 01:43:15,880
sell.
I still do.

2075
01:43:15,880 --> 01:43:18,360
I own a company that sells a lot
of sound systems.

2076
01:43:18,360 --> 01:43:23,360
But I can't like I have no, I
used to know how to walk up to

2077
01:43:23,360 --> 01:43:27,160
like an old sound craft 24
channel on soul and be able to

2078
01:43:27,200 --> 01:43:29,160
control sound for somebody,
right?

2079
01:43:29,440 --> 01:43:32,080
Or a band, you know, there could
be a four or five piece band on

2080
01:43:32,080 --> 01:43:33,680
stage and I could make it sound
decent.

2081
01:43:34,160 --> 01:43:35,560
Yeah.
These digital consoles with

2082
01:43:35,560 --> 01:43:38,480
Dante and all this stuff and
plug insurance and everything

2083
01:43:38,480 --> 01:43:40,200
together.
I have to get no clue.

2084
01:43:40,240 --> 01:43:41,560
I couldn't even turn the thing
on.

2085
01:43:41,880 --> 01:43:44,080
No.
Idea he's a he's he's a let me

2086
01:43:44,080 --> 01:43:49,120
let me give you a story that
ties in the DP, the DP gaffer

2087
01:43:49,120 --> 01:43:50,880
programmer relationship yeah
yeah.

2088
01:43:51,640 --> 01:43:56,760
Star Wars and, and how
relationships can affect things

2089
01:43:56,760 --> 01:44:00,320
so yeah, we were doing skeleton
crew and like I said part of my

2090
01:44:00,320 --> 01:44:04,560
job as the rigging so basically
my job is the rigging program is

2091
01:44:04,560 --> 01:44:07,160
to set everything up so that Ben
I can walk in on the day and

2092
01:44:07,160 --> 01:44:10,520
just do his shit right.
Like my job is to make sure that

2093
01:44:10,560 --> 01:44:13,880
you know, like the the systems
up the network works all the

2094
01:44:13,880 --> 01:44:16,640
lights work he can get the
vision that he needs.

2095
01:44:16,640 --> 01:44:19,920
Basically it's my job to make
sure everything works the minute

2096
01:44:19,920 --> 01:44:21,200
he walks in the door that's the
job.

2097
01:44:21,600 --> 01:44:25,440
Yeah, part of that job is, is
sometimes selecting what kind of

2098
01:44:25,440 --> 01:44:27,960
lights are going to get used
because like, you know, like

2099
01:44:27,960 --> 01:44:30,760
he'll be like, hey, man, the
gaffer wants to do this kind of

2100
01:44:30,760 --> 01:44:32,080
gag.
Can you find a lot that'll do

2101
01:44:32,080 --> 01:44:33,120
it?
Because like, he's on the, he's

2102
01:44:33,120 --> 01:44:35,520
under the pump all the time.
You know, when they're filming,

2103
01:44:35,520 --> 01:44:37,680
it's go, go, go, go, go.
Especially on a show where

2104
01:44:37,680 --> 01:44:41,240
you've got, I don't know, you
know, 700 LEDs on a set and

2105
01:44:41,240 --> 01:44:43,720
you've got to make certain ones
flash and do magic and this

2106
01:44:43,720 --> 01:44:46,240
pixel mapping happen and, you
know, yeah.

2107
01:44:46,400 --> 01:44:48,720
So sometimes it's like, hey,
man, we're doing this gag and we

2108
01:44:48,720 --> 01:44:52,840
need a lot that'll do the thing.
And, you know, one instance of

2109
01:44:52,840 --> 01:44:55,760
that was I got a phone call.
Hey, man, can you go and see the

2110
01:44:55,760 --> 01:44:57,560
DP and he wants to ask you a
question.

2111
01:44:57,560 --> 01:45:01,680
I said, OK, he said, he said,
oh, we're doing this thing and

2112
01:45:01,680 --> 01:45:04,640
and you know, we went, someone
was saying we should move A use

2113
01:45:04,640 --> 01:45:06,240
a moving light, but I want to
use a projector.

2114
01:45:06,240 --> 01:45:08,160
And I'm like, OK, what do you
want to do?

2115
01:45:08,400 --> 01:45:10,480
And he says, well, there's a
scene and the kids are going

2116
01:45:10,480 --> 01:45:13,520
through the forest on speeder
bikers and we need to do kind of

2117
01:45:13,520 --> 01:45:17,520
the dappling thing.
And I went, you got a can you

2118
01:45:17,520 --> 01:45:22,440
open up your laptop?
Go to YouTube, look up Journey

2119
01:45:22,440 --> 01:45:27,000
to mysterious Island flying base
and it brings up this video from

2120
01:45:27,000 --> 01:45:29,680
a movie called Journey to the
Mysterious Island where the

2121
01:45:29,680 --> 01:45:33,840
characters are flying through a
forest on these giant base.

2122
01:45:34,520 --> 01:45:36,760
And that was that was again that
was the show I did with Jeff in

2123
01:45:36,760 --> 01:45:39,000
2010.
And again you've got you know,

2124
01:45:39,000 --> 01:45:41,120
you're on a green screen stage
and you've got these people and

2125
01:45:41,120 --> 01:45:44,000
this green thing which in CG
they're going to turn into base.

2126
01:45:44,400 --> 01:45:47,960
How do you get the dapplege of
the the forest?

2127
01:45:49,000 --> 01:45:51,360
You know, give me 8 Vipers and
let me put in the animation

2128
01:45:51,360 --> 01:45:57,040
wheel if you get that breakup.
And so I show him that video in

2129
01:45:57,040 --> 01:46:00,320
2024 three or whatever it was
2022.

2130
01:46:00,680 --> 01:46:02,680
It's like, yeah, that's cool
that that's what we want to do.

2131
01:46:04,080 --> 01:46:07,240
OK, I call the rigging gaffer.
Can you get me to Maximus?

2132
01:46:07,240 --> 01:46:09,440
Thanks.
And I said, so how do you, how

2133
01:46:09,440 --> 01:46:10,840
do you want to do this?
He said, well, we're going to

2134
01:46:10,840 --> 01:46:14,080
put a projector on a camera
crane and then we can lift it up

2135
01:46:14,080 --> 01:46:16,480
and down and, and move it around
and make it do all that stuff.

2136
01:46:17,240 --> 01:46:18,840
I said, well, you know that
thing I just showed you?

2137
01:46:18,840 --> 01:46:19,960
We just did that with moving
lights.

2138
01:46:19,960 --> 01:46:21,680
He said tomorrow, let's just try
the moving lighter then.

2139
01:46:21,680 --> 01:46:24,320
OK, so you know, day of the
test, we come in, they've got

2140
01:46:24,320 --> 01:46:26,600
this big projector, they've got
a point at a wall.

2141
01:46:26,960 --> 01:46:28,600
I'm like, OK, what are you going
to play on that?

2142
01:46:28,600 --> 01:46:30,560
He's like, I'm going to play.
He plays me something and I

2143
01:46:30,560 --> 01:46:32,280
said, how bright is that?
He says, oh, it's as bright as

2144
01:46:32,280 --> 01:46:35,160
it gets.
OK, so I grab one of the Maximus

2145
01:46:35,160 --> 01:46:39,080
as I crank it up and I put in an
animation well wheel with with I

2146
01:46:39,080 --> 01:46:41,360
think put a prism in it or
something as well, just to give

2147
01:46:41,360 --> 01:46:45,280
it some movement, right?
And then I start dialing it up

2148
01:46:45,280 --> 01:46:47,120
on the intensity and I'm like,
OK.

2149
01:46:48,480 --> 01:46:51,200
And I'm like, is that as, is
that as bright as that projector

2150
01:46:51,200 --> 01:46:52,640
gets?
And he went, yeah, yeah, that's

2151
01:46:52,640 --> 01:46:54,960
at 100%.
He's like, what's the light at?

2152
01:46:54,960 --> 01:46:58,920
And I went 12.
Yeah, that's hilarious.

2153
01:46:58,920 --> 01:47:01,120
He went, really 12?
And I went, yeah, and then I

2154
01:47:01,120 --> 01:47:03,480
just cranked it up to full.
I said, how many of these do you

2155
01:47:03,480 --> 01:47:05,120
want me to get?
And he said, yeah, give me 10 of

2156
01:47:05,120 --> 01:47:06,880
them.
That's hilarious.

2157
01:47:07,600 --> 01:47:09,720
And again, you know, like,
again, like this, this comes

2158
01:47:09,720 --> 01:47:12,640
down to part of my job, which is
to, to, to take.

2159
01:47:13,680 --> 01:47:17,640
I think this is what I like
about film is it's not, you

2160
01:47:17,640 --> 01:47:19,920
know, I mean, I do.
There are days I miss you just

2161
01:47:19,920 --> 01:47:23,120
get to do that cool eye candy
through the smoke shit that you

2162
01:47:23,120 --> 01:47:24,320
do.
Yeah, yeah.

2163
01:47:24,320 --> 01:47:26,600
Rock'n'roll.
You know, like that's there are

2164
01:47:26,600 --> 01:47:28,520
days that I missed that.
But but, you know, at the

2165
01:47:28,520 --> 01:47:33,720
pinnacle of film, you're having
to sort of interpret creative

2166
01:47:33,720 --> 01:47:38,640
visions from multiple different
angles and then create something

2167
01:47:38,640 --> 01:47:41,400
that reflects that.
And sometimes it's like, get me

2168
01:47:41,400 --> 01:47:45,800
this light or use this color or
get this angle or let's see that

2169
01:47:45,800 --> 01:47:49,080
gobo and that let me jump into.
A controversial topic though.

2170
01:47:49,520 --> 01:47:54,200
So isn't AI going to get rid of
most of that stuff at some point

2171
01:47:54,200 --> 01:47:56,960
like it?
Like won't AI be able to look at

2172
01:47:56,960 --> 01:48:00,400
that forest thing and make it
look exactly like you want it,

2173
01:48:00,400 --> 01:48:05,360
flying bees and all?
And aren't we pretty damn close

2174
01:48:05,360 --> 01:48:07,800
to that right now?
Here's here's.

2175
01:48:08,680 --> 01:48:10,680
Maybe I don't know.
I do know.

2176
01:48:10,720 --> 01:48:14,120
I know that the first time, you
know, cuz I'm, I'd watched the

2177
01:48:14,120 --> 01:48:16,440
Mandalorian.
I'd watched some of the Star

2178
01:48:16,440 --> 01:48:17,880
Wars stuff.
Yeah.

2179
01:48:17,880 --> 01:48:21,560
And the first time that I walked
onto the volume stage, there

2180
01:48:21,560 --> 01:48:23,040
wasn't anything on it.
There wasn't a set.

2181
01:48:23,040 --> 01:48:25,080
It was just this black box.
And I went, Oh yeah, cool,

2182
01:48:25,080 --> 01:48:27,720
whatever.
What's cool That.

2183
01:48:28,280 --> 01:48:30,400
Yeah.
And then a couple of days later,

2184
01:48:30,400 --> 01:48:33,720
I walked on and there was a set
built on it and there was

2185
01:48:33,720 --> 01:48:36,800
background content and there's
people walking around on the on,

2186
01:48:37,000 --> 01:48:39,880
you know, and I went, holy shit,
this is a Star Wars show.

2187
01:48:39,880 --> 01:48:42,040
This is oh, you know.
Yeah, yeah.

2188
01:48:42,960 --> 01:48:47,640
But I do know that if you watch
it enough and if you know what

2189
01:48:47,640 --> 01:48:49,200
you're looking for, you go, oh,
that's the volume.

2190
01:48:49,280 --> 01:48:50,840
Oh, that's the volume.
Oh, that's the volume.

2191
01:48:51,520 --> 01:48:53,960
It's like, you know, the early
days of CGI, you could really

2192
01:48:53,960 --> 01:48:59,200
tell it was CGI, you know, like
you, like I recently, I recently

2193
01:48:59,200 --> 01:49:01,680
had that throwback thing.
Like I went and watched, I think

2194
01:49:01,680 --> 01:49:05,040
it was like The Last Starfight,
which was one of the 1st movies

2195
01:49:05,040 --> 01:49:07,120
that ever used digital animation
as a thing.

2196
01:49:07,760 --> 01:49:10,200
And, and like, it's still really
cool.

2197
01:49:10,200 --> 01:49:12,400
Be like, man, that I don't know
if that's aged well.

2198
01:49:12,840 --> 01:49:15,760
Like it it, it looks great
because it looks really cheesy.

2199
01:49:15,880 --> 01:49:17,560
Yeah, doesn't look great because
it looks great.

2200
01:49:17,600 --> 01:49:19,720
Well, go back and watch the
original Star Wars.

2201
01:49:19,720 --> 01:49:21,800
I mean, it's ridiculous, you
know?

2202
01:49:22,000 --> 01:49:23,440
But here's the here's the
difference.

2203
01:49:23,440 --> 01:49:26,280
Like the the very first, you
know, like Episode 4, the first

2204
01:49:26,280 --> 01:49:29,320
Star Wars movie that first.
And I remember seeing it at the

2205
01:49:29,320 --> 01:49:30,920
drive in in 77.
I was 3.

2206
01:49:30,920 --> 01:49:33,160
But I remember this that first
thing where like the big

2207
01:49:33,160 --> 01:49:37,080
Starship comes on.
Yeah, you're like, holy shit.

2208
01:49:37,600 --> 01:49:41,840
Yeah, it looks real.
And the reason that it looks

2209
01:49:41,840 --> 01:49:45,840
real is it was a model that
someone shined a light on.

2210
01:49:46,440 --> 01:49:49,560
Yeah, it was actually a real
object in space and in.

2211
01:49:49,600 --> 01:49:53,640
And even particularly something
like Blade Runner, right.

2212
01:49:53,920 --> 01:49:57,520
Blade Runner, to me, one of the
most visually stunning movies

2213
01:49:57,520 --> 01:50:01,000
ever made.
Yeah, all of the miniatures of

2214
01:50:01,000 --> 01:50:05,360
that in that, you know, real
models, real lighting, real

2215
01:50:05,360 --> 01:50:11,400
smoke, like you can't CG, I
don't know.

2216
01:50:11,960 --> 01:50:15,840
CGI and AI are so different
though, like AICG.

2217
01:50:15,840 --> 01:50:18,240
I I agree with you.
I don't like a lot of the

2218
01:50:18,240 --> 01:50:22,920
Netflix big budget movies bore
the hell out of me.

2219
01:50:22,920 --> 01:50:27,440
You know, like I just watched
the Jamie Foxx and and Cameron

2220
01:50:27,440 --> 01:50:28,880
Diaz one.
It was pretty good.

2221
01:50:29,280 --> 01:50:32,800
But I mean, usually they're so
boring, the big effects and the

2222
01:50:32,800 --> 01:50:35,120
big, you know, it just looks so
stupid.

2223
01:50:35,640 --> 01:50:37,920
Correct.
But you know, if you have you

2224
01:50:37,920 --> 01:50:43,800
checked out Sora at all the, the
AI app, check out Sora or even

2225
01:50:43,800 --> 01:50:46,320
just search YouTube for some
Sora videos.

2226
01:50:46,680 --> 01:50:50,120
I mean, it is amazing what
they're pulling off already with

2227
01:50:50,200 --> 01:50:53,480
AI.
And so I don't know, I don't

2228
01:50:53,480 --> 01:50:56,600
know how long.
I don't know when I know that I,

2229
01:50:56,600 --> 01:51:00,480
I believe that also, obviously
Hollywood is, is losing their

2230
01:51:00,480 --> 01:51:04,120
minds over it right now because
you know who owns the content?

2231
01:51:04,120 --> 01:51:05,800
How does that all work?
What's it all?

2232
01:51:05,840 --> 01:51:11,280
You know, I it's such a scary.
And I think, I think that's a

2233
01:51:11,280 --> 01:51:15,800
big part of the restructuring
that's happening now.

2234
01:51:16,160 --> 01:51:18,280
It is.
You know, you know, Ben and I

2235
01:51:18,280 --> 01:51:23,080
did did skeleton crew together
and then we went and did after

2236
01:51:23,080 --> 01:51:25,080
that we went straight into
another show called the

2237
01:51:25,080 --> 01:51:27,840
Residence, which is which for
Netflix and Shondaland.

2238
01:51:28,320 --> 01:51:30,000
There's some really funny
concept.

2239
01:51:30,000 --> 01:51:33,560
You know, the idea is there's a
there's a, there's a state

2240
01:51:33,560 --> 01:51:37,840
dinner at the White House and
someone kills the head usher of

2241
01:51:37,840 --> 01:51:40,880
the of the White House staff and
they're bringing this kooky kind

2242
01:51:40,880 --> 01:51:43,600
of like investigator the workout
who did it.

2243
01:51:43,600 --> 01:51:46,160
The ironic thing for me is the
fact that the state dinner was

2244
01:51:46,160 --> 01:51:49,160
being held for the for that the
Prime Minister of Australia, and

2245
01:51:49,160 --> 01:51:50,920
the entertainment for the
evening was Kylie Minogue.

2246
01:51:50,920 --> 01:51:53,160
So I got to meet Kylie, which
was hilarious.

2247
01:51:53,160 --> 01:51:56,200
Yeah, it was really cool.
But but, you know, another,

2248
01:51:56,200 --> 01:51:58,680
again, another big show.
You know, we got one stage.

2249
01:51:58,680 --> 01:52:01,520
It's got like, you know, 700
vortexes on it or something.

2250
01:52:01,520 --> 01:52:07,680
Like it is big, big.
And, you know, like, again, that

2251
01:52:07,680 --> 01:52:10,280
kind of peak of the career
thing.

2252
01:52:10,280 --> 01:52:15,120
And then we have the writers
strike and the actors strike and

2253
01:52:15,120 --> 01:52:18,000
then come out of that.
And now there's just been this

2254
01:52:18,000 --> 01:52:21,160
sort of implosion in Hollywood.
It's part of the reason that I

2255
01:52:21,160 --> 01:52:22,680
moved.
I moved back to Australia for a

2256
01:52:22,680 --> 01:52:25,440
while, but yeah.
But a lot of those strikes seem

2257
01:52:25,440 --> 01:52:28,240
to be around like protect me
from AI.

2258
01:52:28,760 --> 01:52:30,960
But you can't.
At the end of the day, you

2259
01:52:30,960 --> 01:52:33,760
can't.
Like you can't protect everyone

2260
01:52:33,760 --> 01:52:35,360
from AI.
It just isn't going to.

2261
01:52:36,120 --> 01:52:36,440
Work.
Yeah.

2262
01:52:36,440 --> 01:52:41,280
And it's the same thing.
Like, you know, welding, you

2263
01:52:41,280 --> 01:52:44,040
know, robots replaced welders in
car factories.

2264
01:52:44,040 --> 01:52:47,040
Robots replaced spray painters
in car factories.

2265
01:52:47,280 --> 01:52:50,120
Yeah.
You know, robots replaces

2266
01:52:50,120 --> 01:52:52,520
surgeons, putting surgeons in
some.

2267
01:52:52,800 --> 01:52:54,200
Yeah.
Well, and there's this.

2268
01:52:54,200 --> 01:52:58,000
Robotic surgery, that's that's
cutting edge cancer surgery and

2269
01:52:58,160 --> 01:53:03,320
a very good friend of mine had I
think it was prostate cancer

2270
01:53:03,320 --> 01:53:07,560
surgery done by a robot that he
was one of the really early

2271
01:53:07,560 --> 01:53:10,680
recipients of this new
technology and it cured him of

2272
01:53:10,680 --> 01:53:12,000
cancer.
It's gone.

2273
01:53:12,080 --> 01:53:13,080
Yeah.
So I.

2274
01:53:13,080 --> 01:53:17,520
Mean, I think I've always been
one for embracing technology.

2275
01:53:20,320 --> 01:53:23,480
AI is a tough one, though.
It's scary because it probably

2276
01:53:23,480 --> 01:53:27,360
the most impactful, this is the
most impactful new technology.

2277
01:53:27,360 --> 01:53:31,240
I think even everything that
this planet and and our human

2278
01:53:31,240 --> 01:53:34,480
race has gone through, I think
this is probably the most

2279
01:53:34,480 --> 01:53:39,600
impactful change that we're
about to to be hit with is.

2280
01:53:40,440 --> 01:53:43,000
Well, and here's my take on it,
whether it's whether it's

2281
01:53:43,120 --> 01:53:48,640
robotics or automation or any
form of technology, at the end

2282
01:53:48,640 --> 01:53:53,800
of the day, it's just a tool and
how we how we implement it, what

2283
01:53:53,800 --> 01:53:57,440
we learn about it, how we use it
effects how it affects us.

2284
01:53:57,440 --> 01:54:01,560
You know, like, you know, like
the guys that were like, you

2285
01:54:01,560 --> 01:54:05,200
know, and you remember the the
giant old 96 channel lighting

2286
01:54:05,200 --> 01:54:07,840
consoles that were all famous.
Yeah, yeah, I'm sure when the

2287
01:54:07,840 --> 01:54:10,360
1st when the first whole hog
came out, the guys that had

2288
01:54:10,360 --> 01:54:12,320
spent their lives using those
were like, oh, that means a

2289
01:54:12,320 --> 01:54:14,960
little catchy.
Yeah, that's yeah, yeah, yeah.

2290
01:54:15,000 --> 01:54:17,160
I ain't using that little thing,
yeah.

2291
01:54:17,920 --> 01:54:20,640
Now I can literally run, you
know, now I can literally run

2292
01:54:20,640 --> 01:54:24,080
250 universes from my laptop.
I mean, it's, yeah, it's mind

2293
01:54:24,080 --> 01:54:25,080
blowing.
Yeah.

2294
01:54:26,400 --> 01:54:28,840
But again, you know, and it
comes back to the, you know,

2295
01:54:29,560 --> 01:54:31,440
console, just a computer with a
lot of buttons on it.

2296
01:54:31,440 --> 01:54:35,200
How you use it determines, you
know, how you are about it.

2297
01:54:35,320 --> 01:54:37,360
And and, you know, I think AI is
the same thing.

2298
01:54:37,360 --> 01:54:41,080
I think there are some, there
are some creative forms or

2299
01:54:41,080 --> 01:54:43,360
creative art forms that AI is
never going to replace.

2300
01:54:43,360 --> 01:54:47,080
There are some that will.
How's that going to affect film

2301
01:54:47,080 --> 01:54:50,240
in the long run?
I think that.

2302
01:54:50,680 --> 01:54:53,360
Yeah.
To me, like the future,

2303
01:54:54,200 --> 01:54:58,760
basically, if Netflix can
produce content for 110th of the

2304
01:54:58,760 --> 01:55:04,400
cost by doing it through AI
versus, you know, on location,

2305
01:55:04,520 --> 01:55:08,480
multiple locations, you know,
multiple thousands of people,

2306
01:55:08,480 --> 01:55:12,400
whatever it is paying actors $10
million and all that stuff,

2307
01:55:12,920 --> 01:55:16,040
instead they can just create
actors and etcetera.

2308
01:55:16,600 --> 01:55:19,800
So, yeah, I mean, we could go
down a rabbit hole on it and

2309
01:55:19,800 --> 01:55:22,040
neither one of us can spend all
day on that topic.

2310
01:55:22,040 --> 01:55:27,960
But AI is something I follow
very closely and I, you know,

2311
01:55:28,200 --> 01:55:33,200
certainly the arts in general
and, and creative in general is

2312
01:55:33,200 --> 01:55:35,160
one of the areas that most
concerns me.

2313
01:55:35,400 --> 01:55:39,000
You know, music, I've just
created a podcast and and that

2314
01:55:39,000 --> 01:55:45,920
was entirely AI and within it,
the theme music I did on AI, the

2315
01:55:45,960 --> 01:55:49,360
logo I did on AI.
The entire podcast is AI.

2316
01:55:49,840 --> 01:55:54,640
And in creating the music, I'm a
musician And you know the the

2317
01:55:54,640 --> 01:55:58,200
app is called Suno, Suno dot AI.
Check it out.

2318
01:55:58,320 --> 01:56:01,320
Someday when you've got time to
waste, it's going to blow your

2319
01:56:01,320 --> 01:56:03,080
mind.
You can literally grab your

2320
01:56:03,080 --> 01:56:08,320
iPhone and hum into it and go
and say create a song around

2321
01:56:08,320 --> 01:56:10,600
that.
That's about lighting consoles.

2322
01:56:11,280 --> 01:56:15,280
Within about 3 minutes, you're
gonna have an unbelievable song

2323
01:56:15,280 --> 01:56:18,200
using that melody.
Yeah, in whatever genre, you

2324
01:56:18,200 --> 01:56:19,480
say.
You could say now make it

2325
01:56:19,480 --> 01:56:24,200
reggae, now make it death metal,
now make it jazz, you know, make

2326
01:56:24,200 --> 01:56:27,480
it a British woman singer
instead of, you know, whatever.

2327
01:56:27,920 --> 01:56:33,560
It's just, it's so insane and.
And what I what I do know at the

2328
01:56:33,560 --> 01:56:37,240
moment is that part of the part
of the debate around the writer

2329
01:56:37,240 --> 01:56:40,640
strike was the fact that, you
know, they didn't want AI taking

2330
01:56:40,640 --> 01:56:42,320
the work of, of scriptwriters,
right?

2331
01:56:42,920 --> 01:56:44,280
Yeah.
And, and one of the questions

2332
01:56:44,280 --> 01:56:48,400
that no one's quite answered yet
is if something's created by AI,

2333
01:56:48,400 --> 01:56:51,080
who owns it?
You know, and that's that's one

2334
01:56:51,080 --> 01:56:53,200
of the great debates as far as.
It is.

2335
01:56:53,440 --> 01:56:55,120
Yeah, of course.
Rewriting and whatever.

2336
01:56:55,560 --> 01:56:58,680
Yeah, sorry, hate it when that
happens.

2337
01:56:58,680 --> 01:57:02,000
The other one still works.
Yeah, it does yeah, let me just

2338
01:57:02,600 --> 01:57:04,520
so that was that was a big part
of that debate.

2339
01:57:04,520 --> 01:57:09,600
So yeah, I I don't know, like I
said, I'm I'm not I'm not full

2340
01:57:09,600 --> 01:57:12,240
bottle on AI and I probably
should get around head into the

2341
01:57:12,240 --> 01:57:16,880
game, but so I I want to get
into.

2342
01:57:16,880 --> 01:57:20,000
Some other stuff you created,
you created a business around,

2343
01:57:20,760 --> 01:57:25,280
specifically around Onyx control
systems, I believe, Yeah, or I

2344
01:57:25,280 --> 01:57:29,600
think at least that's the
primary component of that

2345
01:57:29,600 --> 01:57:33,760
business anyways.
Yeah, like I said, I, I started

2346
01:57:33,760 --> 01:57:39,480
out in 2010, I bought an M1.
And so one of the things that's

2347
01:57:39,480 --> 01:57:42,320
unique about the film industry
is if it, it, you know, and, and

2348
01:57:42,360 --> 01:57:45,640
this might well eventually
change if you're a lighting

2349
01:57:45,640 --> 01:57:48,600
programmer and you own a
console, you get to rent it to

2350
01:57:48,600 --> 01:57:51,160
production.
So I ended up with a lighting

2351
01:57:51,160 --> 01:57:54,160
console and then I found that I
needed another one.

2352
01:57:54,160 --> 01:57:56,720
So I needed a backup.
So I bought another one and

2353
01:57:56,720 --> 01:57:59,880
then, oh, hang on, I need these
things called nodes.

2354
01:57:59,880 --> 01:58:05,240
So I bought a couple of nodes
and my, my business partner and

2355
01:58:05,240 --> 01:58:07,760
I created this company chokes
any control.

2356
01:58:08,280 --> 01:58:11,640
And we, we, we had some stuff
and we would rent it to

2357
01:58:11,640 --> 01:58:14,520
production.
And then, you know, I found out

2358
01:58:14,520 --> 01:58:17,720
I'm on another show.
So I need another console and I

2359
01:58:17,720 --> 01:58:24,080
need a couple more nodes.
And so one day again, my time

2360
01:58:24,080 --> 01:58:26,240
with Matthias, he's like, hey,
we've got this new thing coming

2361
01:58:26,240 --> 01:58:27,520
out.
I want you to check it out.

2362
01:58:27,520 --> 01:58:31,720
And he sent me one of the first
neutron en fours.

2363
01:58:31,720 --> 01:58:33,040
You know, the little 4 port
node.

2364
01:58:33,680 --> 01:58:35,320
Have a look at this.
Tell me, tell me if it's any

2365
01:58:35,320 --> 01:58:37,840
good.
And you know, I'd I'd used Swiss

2366
01:58:37,840 --> 01:58:40,400
on, I'd used DMX king, I'd used
a few of the other ones that I'd

2367
01:58:40,400 --> 01:58:43,000
seen around on sets and I'm
like, yeah, this thing's pretty

2368
01:58:43,000 --> 01:58:44,160
cool.
It looks solid and you know,

2369
01:58:44,160 --> 01:58:46,200
like what it does and it's got
some cool features in it.

2370
01:58:46,200 --> 01:58:51,240
And, you know, so he sent me one
and and then I bought another

2371
01:58:51,240 --> 01:58:52,840
six.
So I had 6 nodes and then I'm

2372
01:58:52,840 --> 01:58:54,520
like, oh, I need an obvious
better to go with those.

2373
01:58:54,520 --> 01:58:58,240
And so I started buying bits and
pieces and then I was like, wow,

2374
01:58:58,240 --> 01:59:00,040
this stuff's really cool.
And then like I said, my

2375
01:59:00,040 --> 01:59:02,520
relationship with Matthias, I
was like, do you mind if I'd

2376
01:59:02,520 --> 01:59:04,800
like make some videos with these
things?

2377
01:59:04,800 --> 01:59:06,840
Because like people keep asking
me how to use them.

2378
01:59:07,880 --> 01:59:11,680
So my partners say to Deborah
and I, we started making little,

2379
01:59:11,880 --> 01:59:14,920
little content things about, oh,
this is this is how you work

2380
01:59:14,920 --> 01:59:16,520
this thing and this is what this
does.

2381
01:59:16,520 --> 01:59:21,400
And yeah, we just watched some.
Of those videos, like I, I

2382
01:59:21,400 --> 01:59:25,760
learned, you know, one of the, I
don't remember what the item was

2383
01:59:25,760 --> 01:59:30,200
even called, but I think it was
one of the nodes and you could

2384
01:59:30,200 --> 01:59:33,520
switch the input and output
panels from the back to the

2385
01:59:33,640 --> 01:59:35,760
front and the sides and all that
stuff.

2386
01:59:36,080 --> 01:59:39,560
Like very, very good videos.
Again, I, you know, I, I

2387
01:59:39,560 --> 01:59:43,320
definitely compliment you on
your content created and, and

2388
01:59:43,680 --> 01:59:46,400
again, it's not that common.
Like, I don't know, do you know

2389
01:59:46,400 --> 01:59:49,040
a guy named Christian Jackson?
Fiona Christian.

2390
01:59:49,040 --> 01:59:50,680
I know, I know often.
I don't know him personally.

2391
01:59:50,880 --> 01:59:55,000
So Christian's one of the
probably the most prolific

2392
01:59:55,200 --> 01:59:58,520
YouTube in our in the lighting
industry.

2393
01:59:58,520 --> 02:00:03,200
He does a lot of how to videos,
a lot of just different types of

2394
02:00:03,200 --> 02:00:05,600
videos.
And he's got, you know, 10s of

2395
02:00:05,600 --> 02:00:11,040
thousands of followers that more
than what I think anyone else

2396
02:00:11,040 --> 02:00:12,960
has in our industry because it's
such a small.

2397
02:00:12,960 --> 02:00:15,760
Industry, he he, he does a lot.
There's a guy called David Henry

2398
02:00:15,760 --> 02:00:17,640
that does a lot.
He does a lot of content as

2399
02:00:17,640 --> 02:00:18,600
well.
Yeah.

2400
02:00:18,840 --> 02:00:21,920
But yeah, just kind of started
out as like, I would find things

2401
02:00:21,920 --> 02:00:24,760
that I found interesting.
And again, you know, like going

2402
02:00:24,760 --> 02:00:27,840
back to that guy showing me that
thing on that whole hog too.

2403
02:00:28,520 --> 02:00:30,680
People would call me and ask me
questions, like, how do you do

2404
02:00:30,680 --> 02:00:31,880
this?
And I'm like, I'll just make you

2405
02:00:31,880 --> 02:00:34,680
a video.
And and so it started that and

2406
02:00:34,680 --> 02:00:36,960
then, you know, it turned into
this other thing.

2407
02:00:36,960 --> 02:00:39,840
People would call me up and be
like, hey, man, what are you

2408
02:00:39,840 --> 02:00:42,000
getting your notes from them?
Like I just, you know, call

2409
02:00:42,000 --> 02:00:43,720
these guys.
They'll they'll get them for

2410
02:00:43,760 --> 02:00:45,080
you.
You can do a good price.

2411
02:00:45,560 --> 02:00:46,960
Yeah.
And then, you know, Saturday and

2412
02:00:46,960 --> 02:00:48,640
I were talking about it.
I was like, oh, yeah, such and

2413
02:00:48,640 --> 02:00:50,960
such has called me.
I told him to go and see, you

2414
02:00:50,960 --> 02:00:53,280
know, it's such and such a bag.
And it's just like, I know what.

2415
02:00:54,040 --> 02:00:54,760
Yeah, why?
Don't we?

2416
02:00:54,800 --> 02:00:57,160
Why?
Aren't we making a couple bucks

2417
02:00:57,160 --> 02:00:57,920
on that?
Yeah.

2418
02:00:58,200 --> 02:01:02,600
So we, we, we got together and
we called the guys that are

2419
02:01:02,600 --> 02:01:05,240
sitting and we're like, hey, you
know, like, you know, we're

2420
02:01:05,240 --> 02:01:08,680
referring a lot of people.
Could we, could we become a

2421
02:01:08,680 --> 02:01:09,960
dealer?
Yeah.

2422
02:01:09,960 --> 02:01:11,360
And they're like, well, you
know, you've got to have a

2423
02:01:11,360 --> 02:01:13,880
storefront and you've got to
carry this much stock and, you

2424
02:01:13,880 --> 02:01:15,320
know, all these, all these
things.

2425
02:01:15,320 --> 02:01:16,720
And I was like, hang on, you
guys.

2426
02:01:17,840 --> 02:01:19,440
You guys don't really understand
the film industry.

2427
02:01:19,440 --> 02:01:21,760
The guys that I work with, they
work 70 hours a week.

2428
02:01:21,760 --> 02:01:23,680
They don't want to go to a
storefront.

2429
02:01:23,680 --> 02:01:26,400
They don't want to do this.
But what they want to do is they

2430
02:01:26,400 --> 02:01:28,480
want me to bring them and show
them something or send them a

2431
02:01:28,480 --> 02:01:29,640
video.
And they're going to be like, I

2432
02:01:29,640 --> 02:01:31,200
want 10.
Yeah.

2433
02:01:31,200 --> 02:01:37,160
Or I want 20, Yeah.
And so they were like, OK, well,

2434
02:01:37,160 --> 02:01:38,840
why don't we give this a go?
And we're like, right.

2435
02:01:39,320 --> 02:01:42,680
And, you know, the next thing
you know, we're selling Netron

2436
02:01:42,680 --> 02:01:45,040
and, you know, Obsidian Netron
equipment, you know, to people

2437
02:01:45,040 --> 02:01:48,000
in LA and people in Atlanta and
people in New Mexico and people

2438
02:01:48,000 --> 02:01:50,440
in for you, man.
You know, we're selling all over

2439
02:01:50,440 --> 02:01:51,240
America.
Yeah.

2440
02:01:51,520 --> 02:01:55,720
Well, and meanwhile you've
probably been single handedly

2441
02:01:55,720 --> 02:01:59,760
responsible for introducing that
product into television and film

2442
02:01:59,760 --> 02:02:03,480
lighting, you know, and and
making it maybe the number 2 to

2443
02:02:03,480 --> 02:02:06,760
hog in in that market.
Absolutely.

2444
02:02:07,840 --> 02:02:10,240
Console wise, not so much.
I mean, you know, the big

2445
02:02:10,240 --> 02:02:13,400
players in Hollywood, Hog, Grand
MAETC.

2446
02:02:13,760 --> 02:02:15,800
So MA has cracked that market as
well.

2447
02:02:16,480 --> 02:02:18,560
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah.
I mean, there's definitely been,

2448
02:02:20,280 --> 02:02:24,240
you know, the, there was a,
there was a lot of ETC back in

2449
02:02:24,240 --> 02:02:28,000
the day because your multicam
sitcoms were all, you know, very

2450
02:02:28,000 --> 02:02:30,160
theatrical style.
They would come in, they would

2451
02:02:30,160 --> 02:02:34,240
rehearse, you know, 3 Cam
sitcoms are done like a theatre

2452
02:02:34,240 --> 02:02:35,600
show.
So that was all ETC.

2453
02:02:36,320 --> 02:02:39,480
Yeah, You know, Scotty really
revolutionized the game when he

2454
02:02:39,480 --> 02:02:42,720
started using, you know, hogs on
big features.

2455
02:02:43,360 --> 02:02:47,080
And then, you know, so a lot of
guys picked that up, you know,

2456
02:02:47,280 --> 02:02:49,960
the young guys that are coming
up now, like I'm going to have a

2457
02:02:49,960 --> 02:02:51,920
grand to make because it's the
greatest thing since sliced

2458
02:02:51,920 --> 02:02:53,320
bread.
Yeah, cool.

2459
02:02:53,320 --> 02:02:55,080
It does.
It does everything in the world

2460
02:02:55,320 --> 02:02:57,360
I can.
You know, I mean, the reason

2461
02:02:57,360 --> 02:03:00,040
that I stuck with Onyx is
because I'm just felt super

2462
02:03:00,040 --> 02:03:02,120
comfortable and it was the
console that I was the best on.

2463
02:03:02,520 --> 02:03:04,840
I mean, I honestly think, you
know, with Die Lost, they've got

2464
02:03:04,840 --> 02:03:06,880
the best pixel mapping engine in
the business.

2465
02:03:07,400 --> 02:03:10,400
Yeah, yeah.
You know, it's, I mean, isn't

2466
02:03:10,400 --> 02:03:13,000
there a cost factor?
Like I know movies have these

2467
02:03:13,000 --> 02:03:15,680
massive budgets and stuff, but
still like when you can get a

2468
02:03:15,680 --> 02:03:18,200
console and I don't know the
price of a of an Obsidian

2469
02:03:18,200 --> 02:03:21,280
console these days, but when you
can get a console for, call it

2470
02:03:21,440 --> 02:03:26,400
1520 grand versus 80, you know?
Yeah, Like it.

2471
02:03:26,400 --> 02:03:26,640
Yeah.
Yeah.

2472
02:03:26,760 --> 02:03:28,480
Seems to make a lot of sense,
you know?

2473
02:03:28,560 --> 02:03:30,160
Yeah, I mean, that was, that was
always the thing.

2474
02:03:30,160 --> 02:03:33,960
I mean, I, like I said, I, I
only bought, I only like I own 5

2475
02:03:33,960 --> 02:03:37,720
Onyx consoles in a road hub.
There's a reason for that, you

2476
02:03:37,720 --> 02:03:39,680
know, I've never bought a grand
in my because I would, you know,

2477
02:03:39,680 --> 02:03:41,960
I would rather have be paying a
mortgage than paying a console.

2478
02:03:41,960 --> 02:03:43,960
Payment that makes sense, you
know.

2479
02:03:44,080 --> 02:03:46,760
Most, most of what we do in most
of what we do in Hollywood is

2480
02:03:47,800 --> 02:03:49,600
change intensity and color
temperature.

2481
02:03:50,000 --> 02:03:52,360
Yeah, that's, that's 80% of the
work.

2482
02:03:52,360 --> 02:03:54,760
You know, you've got some, some
whizbang stuff to do in there,

2483
02:03:54,760 --> 02:03:57,400
but you know, if you've got a
good pixel mapping engine or a

2484
02:03:57,400 --> 02:04:00,400
media server, you could do with
just about any console.

2485
02:04:00,560 --> 02:04:04,040
Yeah, yeah, you know, and.
Your relationship obvious,

2486
02:04:04,040 --> 02:04:08,400
obviously, you know, between
Max's and and now Obsidian and

2487
02:04:08,480 --> 02:04:12,360
with Matthias and and the gang
over there at at elation slash

2488
02:04:12,360 --> 02:04:16,040
Obsidian.
Obviously this is still a

2489
02:04:16,040 --> 02:04:18,840
relationship industry.
So you, you do business with the

2490
02:04:18,840 --> 02:04:20,960
companies that you feel
comfortable and you feel like,

2491
02:04:21,280 --> 02:04:27,360
you know, if you're on a, a, a
Marvel film set and, and you

2492
02:04:27,360 --> 02:04:29,720
have a problem, you know that
there's somebody that you can

2493
02:04:29,720 --> 02:04:34,000
reach out to that.
You know, it, it's, you know,

2494
02:04:34,000 --> 02:04:38,000
for me, like if I was doing, if
I'm doing, you know, a small,

2495
02:04:38,160 --> 02:04:40,600
not a small TVI mean you like
something like Hell's Kitchen

2496
02:04:40,600 --> 02:04:46,200
isn't exactly a small TV show.
But there are things that I

2497
02:04:46,200 --> 02:04:48,640
would only use Onyx for.
And there are certain things

2498
02:04:48,640 --> 02:04:51,000
where I'd be like, well, I
probably need, you know, the

2499
02:04:51,000 --> 02:04:54,560
networking capabilities that
Hulk has that other show,

2500
02:04:54,560 --> 02:04:56,480
because, you know, Onyx doesn't
do that as well.

2501
02:04:57,720 --> 02:05:00,360
And you know, a lot of it is
about, you know, how I need, I'm

2502
02:05:00,360 --> 02:05:02,240
going to need someone to cover
me who's available.

2503
02:05:02,240 --> 02:05:05,440
And if there's, you know, if
there's 12 Onyx guys and 30 Hog

2504
02:05:05,440 --> 02:05:07,240
guys, you know, like it just
depends.

2505
02:05:07,240 --> 02:05:09,320
Yeah, it double s your
availability of people.

2506
02:05:09,720 --> 02:05:12,120
Sure, sure.
I mean for me, it's for me.

2507
02:05:12,120 --> 02:05:14,560
I'm I've always been about
what's the best tool for the job

2508
02:05:15,120 --> 02:05:18,360
yeah, but also what's what fits
within my budget and has the

2509
02:05:18,360 --> 02:05:21,240
best ROI.
Yeah, yeah, You know, that was

2510
02:05:21,240 --> 02:05:25,680
the same thing with me with, you
know, like me getting into

2511
02:05:25,680 --> 02:05:30,200
Netron wasn't just about you
know, it's a product that that a

2512
02:05:30,200 --> 02:05:33,400
guy that I know and respects
makes it's it's more for less.

2513
02:05:33,400 --> 02:05:35,680
Why would I buy a Swiss on
that's only got 8 ports when I

2514
02:05:35,680 --> 02:05:38,680
can buy a Neutron in 12?
It's got 12 ports and it's about

2515
02:05:38,680 --> 02:05:40,840
400 bucks less.
Plus it's got a whole bunch of

2516
02:05:40,840 --> 02:05:42,360
other feature, you know, like
this is whole.

2517
02:05:42,360 --> 02:05:44,120
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
That makes sense.

2518
02:05:45,080 --> 02:05:48,400
And you know, like that's kind
of what, what Sydney control

2519
02:05:48,400 --> 02:05:51,920
became, started out with a
console and a couple of nodes

2520
02:05:51,920 --> 02:05:54,040
and now it's, you know, like, I
don't know, we got six or seven

2521
02:05:54,040 --> 02:05:57,680
consoles and we had at one stage
we had something like 48 data,

2522
02:05:57,680 --> 02:06:01,960
data racks.
Well, I saw, I saw in the video

2523
02:06:01,960 --> 02:06:05,960
that I watched, I saw some stuff
from your warehouse and I was

2524
02:06:05,960 --> 02:06:08,760
like, holy shit, He's got a lot
of inventory in there.

2525
02:06:08,760 --> 02:06:12,440
He's got lots of stuff going on,
you know, You know.

2526
02:06:13,400 --> 02:06:14,880
Yeah.
And and, you know, like it was

2527
02:06:14,880 --> 02:06:18,080
all about, it was all about the
demands of the productions that

2528
02:06:18,080 --> 02:06:19,640
were happening.
And, you know, like I said, on

2529
02:06:19,640 --> 02:06:24,360
something like Star Wars, you've
got, you know, our backbone data

2530
02:06:24,360 --> 02:06:27,480
network for each of our stages.
Just up in the poems, we would

2531
02:06:27,480 --> 02:06:30,800
have, you know, two big data
racks, which is like an EN12 and

2532
02:06:30,800 --> 02:06:33,480
two RDM 10s.
You've got 32 ports of data

2533
02:06:33,480 --> 02:06:34,720
stuff coming out.
Yeah.

2534
02:06:34,920 --> 02:06:36,840
That's why.
This is before we were even into

2535
02:06:36,840 --> 02:06:39,200
fully managed networks.
Like if I was going to do that

2536
02:06:39,200 --> 02:06:42,000
show now, it would all be, it
would all be fully managed

2537
02:06:42,000 --> 02:06:44,520
networks with multiple Vlans
just to get around all the

2538
02:06:44,520 --> 02:06:47,400
information that we need.
While yeah.

2539
02:06:47,480 --> 02:06:50,280
And it and it just kind of built
up into this thing.

2540
02:06:50,280 --> 02:06:52,920
And so, yeah, so you know that
net.

2541
02:06:53,560 --> 02:06:55,840
Yeah, just to jump topics again,
sorry.

2542
02:06:55,920 --> 02:06:58,680
Yeah.
So last year you moved back to

2543
02:06:58,880 --> 02:07:05,320
to Australia and but still most
of your work is in California or

2544
02:07:05,320 --> 02:07:06,000
how does that?
Work.

2545
02:07:06,000 --> 02:07:09,280
No, no, no.
So I mean, the longest short of

2546
02:07:09,280 --> 02:07:19,080
it is my, my mom passed away in
20 terrible 2023 In September

2547
02:07:19,080 --> 02:07:22,120
2023, my mom passed away.
So, you know, mom and dad had

2548
02:07:22,120 --> 02:07:24,320
always lived in Perth, although
they lived in in Brooklyn for

2549
02:07:24,320 --> 02:07:27,440
about 5 years, which is a really
fun time because, yeah, strange.

2550
02:07:27,800 --> 02:07:29,240
And I could.
Yeah, I know.

2551
02:07:29,240 --> 02:07:32,040
My mom was, like I said, my mom
was a university professor.

2552
02:07:32,800 --> 02:07:35,440
She was a literacy specialist,
and she got hired by the New

2553
02:07:35,440 --> 02:07:37,920
York Board of Education to be a
literacy consultant.

2554
02:07:38,320 --> 02:07:40,240
To teach New Yorkers how to
speak English.

2555
02:07:40,760 --> 02:07:42,960
Yeah, pretty much, Pretty much.
Just kidding.

2556
02:07:44,080 --> 02:07:46,000
Yeah, it's true though.
But she lived, she lived in

2557
02:07:46,000 --> 02:07:48,040
Brooklyn for five years.
So we were all in America for

2558
02:07:48,040 --> 02:07:49,520
five years at the same time,
which is cool.

2559
02:07:49,520 --> 02:07:52,920
But so, yeah, Mum passed away
and you know, my dad wasn't in

2560
02:07:52,920 --> 02:07:55,160
growth, great health and a bit
of dementia going on.

2561
02:07:55,160 --> 02:08:01,320
So I came back to Australia for
about 5 1/2 months and I was

2562
02:08:01,320 --> 02:08:04,440
here and it was pretty
tumultuous year because it was

2563
02:08:04,440 --> 02:08:07,920
just after the strike and, and a
few other things and brutal

2564
02:08:07,920 --> 02:08:10,640
marriage.
Yeah, my marriage broke down and

2565
02:08:11,560 --> 02:08:14,960
Jesus, you know, I got back to,
I got back to LA after, you

2566
02:08:14,960 --> 02:08:17,480
know, 5 1/2 months in Australia
and I was kind of like, you know

2567
02:08:17,480 --> 02:08:19,800
what, I don't think I like it
here anymore.

2568
02:08:22,000 --> 02:08:25,960
No, it was just like I said, you
might might not have liked

2569
02:08:25,960 --> 02:08:28,760
Australia, but or might not have
liked Perth, but it is seriously

2570
02:08:28,760 --> 02:08:30,320
one of the prettiest cities in
the world.

2571
02:08:30,320 --> 02:08:32,400
Yeah.
You know, and you, I mean, not

2572
02:08:32,400 --> 02:08:34,320
that you could eat off the
sidewalks here, but you just

2573
02:08:34,320 --> 02:08:35,760
about could.
Yeah.

2574
02:08:36,040 --> 02:08:38,200
And I get back to LA and I'm
just like, well.

2575
02:08:39,000 --> 02:08:40,080
You know it's.
Interesting cuz.

2576
02:08:40,080 --> 02:08:45,120
That's me going from my town in
Canada that I'm absolutely in

2577
02:08:45,120 --> 02:08:47,440
love with.
And the people are amazing and

2578
02:08:47,440 --> 02:08:50,600
the it's clean and it's
wonderful and people are kind

2579
02:08:50,600 --> 02:08:53,640
and you can trust people and you
don't even have to lock your car

2580
02:08:53,640 --> 02:08:58,040
doors and stuff or your house.
And then I come back to Florida

2581
02:08:58,520 --> 02:09:00,800
and, you know, it's a little
different than that.

2582
02:09:00,800 --> 02:09:03,400
And Florida's pretty nice.
And it, you know, politically

2583
02:09:03,400 --> 02:09:06,160
it's pretty easy to deal with in
Florida versus, you know, the

2584
02:09:06,160 --> 02:09:11,480
crazy politics of California.
And but I get the same feeling

2585
02:09:11,480 --> 02:09:14,440
like every time I come back, I
go, why am I back here again?

2586
02:09:14,720 --> 02:09:18,280
You know, and then, and then
it's, you know, 85° while it's

2587
02:09:18,280 --> 02:09:20,360
-20 in Canada.
And I remember.

2588
02:09:20,920 --> 02:09:23,880
Oh yeah, it was 100 and it was
106 here today, I think.

2589
02:09:24,040 --> 02:09:26,800
Holy shit, Yeah.
It's not that warm here.

2590
02:09:27,440 --> 02:09:31,000
Not that warm here, Yeah?
It'll be like this for, you

2591
02:09:31,000 --> 02:09:32,600
know, a couple of weeks back to
normal.

2592
02:09:33,400 --> 02:09:36,400
So you just didn't want to live
in LA anymore, which I can this.

2593
02:09:36,400 --> 02:09:39,320
Is a combination of things.
I knew I, I'm an only child, so

2594
02:09:39,320 --> 02:09:42,160
I knew I had to be here to look
after my dad, make sure my dad's

2595
02:09:42,160 --> 02:09:44,680
OK and he's in full Care now,
but I still have to be here to

2596
02:09:44,680 --> 02:09:47,680
sort of manage things.
I'm doing that from, from, from

2597
02:09:47,680 --> 02:09:51,840
California was not a long term
prospect and I do.

2598
02:09:57,240 --> 02:10:00,880
I knew I had to do that and I'd
kind of, I'd had a couple of

2599
02:10:00,880 --> 02:10:04,280
opportunities to come back to
Australia before, like I was

2600
02:10:04,280 --> 02:10:07,640
invited to come back to Perth in
2008 and program on a movie

2601
02:10:07,640 --> 02:10:09,360
here.
And there was a few people be

2602
02:10:09,360 --> 02:10:11,080
like, oh man, you should, you
should stay in Perth.

2603
02:10:11,080 --> 02:10:13,000
You could do really well here.
And I'm just kind of like, yeah,

2604
02:10:13,000 --> 02:10:16,280
I've still got, still got things
I need to do in America, still

2605
02:10:16,280 --> 02:10:17,720
got things I need to achieve
there.

2606
02:10:17,880 --> 02:10:19,960
Yeah.
And you know, I came back after

2607
02:10:19,960 --> 02:10:21,880
this last trip and everything
that was going on with my

2608
02:10:21,880 --> 02:10:23,040
parents.
I've kind of like, well, I've

2609
02:10:23,040 --> 02:10:26,920
done, I've done 2 Marvel shows.
I've done a Star Wars show.

2610
02:10:27,560 --> 02:10:31,120
I've kind of feel like I've hit
that, done those.

2611
02:10:31,120 --> 02:10:34,360
Things downhill from here, yeah.
Well, no, there's not downhill

2612
02:10:34,360 --> 02:10:35,880
as much.
I mean, I could keep doing that,

2613
02:10:35,880 --> 02:10:39,400
but it would just be more of
that and and anything other than

2614
02:10:39,400 --> 02:10:40,960
that would be kind of a
disappointment.

2615
02:10:41,040 --> 02:10:42,760
And I like that.
Yeah, I like that.

2616
02:10:42,920 --> 02:10:47,880
That makes sense.
Part of it is at a certain point

2617
02:10:47,880 --> 02:10:51,080
you just, you're just fulfilling
your own ego, right?

2618
02:10:51,680 --> 02:10:53,560
You know, like everyone in
Hollywood wants, every

2619
02:10:53,560 --> 02:10:56,280
programmer in Hollywood wants to
be as good as Scott Barnes.

2620
02:10:56,800 --> 02:10:58,240
Yeah.
There's only ever going to be 1

2621
02:10:58,240 --> 02:10:59,640
Scott Barnes.
And.

2622
02:10:59,640 --> 02:11:02,280
And until he dies, no one else
is going to be him.

2623
02:11:02,640 --> 02:11:04,000
Yeah.
It's kind of like, you know

2624
02:11:04,000 --> 02:11:04,520
what?
I've.

2625
02:11:04,600 --> 02:11:05,880
I've, I've worked with him, he
said.

2626
02:11:05,880 --> 02:11:07,000
Awesome guy.
I love him to death.

2627
02:11:07,520 --> 02:11:09,400
I don't, I don't need to be him.
I can just.

2628
02:11:09,400 --> 02:11:10,720
Do that.
Yeah, that's what I'm saying.

2629
02:11:10,720 --> 02:11:11,920
Becoming him.
And then what?

2630
02:11:12,160 --> 02:11:14,160
You get to the top of a mountain
and you go.

2631
02:11:14,160 --> 02:11:17,760
You know what?
And like you now, I got to walk

2632
02:11:17,760 --> 02:11:20,360
back down.
Don't get me wrong, Like if Ben

2633
02:11:20,360 --> 02:11:22,280
Wire called me tomorrow and
said, hey, man, we're doing

2634
02:11:22,280 --> 02:11:24,720
another episode, another doing
another series of skeleton Crew,

2635
02:11:24,720 --> 02:11:26,120
like I would be on a plane
tomorrow.

2636
02:11:26,480 --> 02:11:28,560
Yeah, I'm going, I'm going for
that one.

2637
02:11:29,200 --> 02:11:31,480
Yeah.
Living in Los Angeles full time

2638
02:11:31,480 --> 02:11:34,840
and, and doing the grind that is
Hollywood because when you're

2639
02:11:34,840 --> 02:11:38,000
working 70 hours a week and then
you've got an out of two hours

2640
02:11:38,040 --> 02:11:40,560
of commute on either end of
that, like, but come on weekend,

2641
02:11:40,560 --> 02:11:43,000
man, you're just knackered.
It's like, I want to, I'm going

2642
02:11:43,000 --> 02:11:45,040
to sleep all this Saturday,
Sunday I'm going to do the

2643
02:11:45,040 --> 02:11:46,880
laundry, and then Monday I'm
going to go and do it again.

2644
02:11:47,440 --> 02:11:49,080
Yeah.
And it's not like you go on a 2

2645
02:11:49,080 --> 02:11:50,760
/ 3 months and then you get a
month off.

2646
02:11:50,760 --> 02:11:53,440
It's like you work on a show
like Skeleton Crew.

2647
02:11:53,440 --> 02:11:56,480
It's seven months of that.
Yeah, yeah.

2648
02:11:56,480 --> 02:11:58,960
And then you have a week or two
and then you do that again for

2649
02:11:58,960 --> 02:11:59,800
another 5.
Or 6.

2650
02:11:59,800 --> 02:12:01,200
I get it.
It's just constant.

2651
02:12:01,560 --> 02:12:04,200
Well, and on a personal note,
I'm real real sorry about your

2652
02:12:04,200 --> 02:12:07,640
your dad and the dementia too,
because I have the same thing.

2653
02:12:07,640 --> 02:12:11,280
So one of the reasons I, I built
a house in Canada is because my

2654
02:12:11,280 --> 02:12:16,760
mom is still in Calgary and my
sisters are still in Calgary and

2655
02:12:17,120 --> 02:12:20,920
my mom's been in a home for, I
mean, fortunately it's moved

2656
02:12:20,920 --> 02:12:25,400
really slow with her.
She's still alive, still

2657
02:12:25,400 --> 02:12:26,800
healthy.
She's 90.

2658
02:12:26,840 --> 02:12:32,040
She's turning 93 next week.
And you know, she's, I, I

2659
02:12:32,040 --> 02:12:34,040
shouldn't say healthy.
I mean, she's in a wheelchair

2660
02:12:34,040 --> 02:12:36,960
now and she has no idea what
planet she's on.

2661
02:12:36,960 --> 02:12:40,240
You know, one day I'll visit her
and I'm her husband, then I'm

2662
02:12:40,240 --> 02:12:42,960
her brother, then I'm some
asshole who's trying to steal

2663
02:12:42,960 --> 02:12:44,080
her wheelchair.
And.

2664
02:12:44,480 --> 02:12:48,720
And occasionally she she at
least believes that I'm her son,

2665
02:12:48,720 --> 02:12:49,320
you know?
Yeah, Yeah.

2666
02:12:49,520 --> 02:12:52,280
But I mean, we're happy to still
have her alive, but it's it's so

2667
02:12:52,280 --> 02:12:55,120
hard when you're dealing.
This is it's my brutal thing.

2668
02:12:55,640 --> 02:12:57,360
Yeah, I mean, my dad's not at
that stage yet.

2669
02:12:57,360 --> 02:12:59,440
He still, he still recognizes
who I am.

2670
02:12:59,440 --> 02:13:00,840
And that's good.
But you know what?

2671
02:13:00,840 --> 02:13:02,680
He'll he'll call me up.
I'll be like, hey man, how you

2672
02:13:02,680 --> 02:13:03,840
doing?
He's like, yeah man, I just got

2673
02:13:03,840 --> 02:13:06,840
back from Melbourne and I went
and saw a bunch of family and

2674
02:13:06,840 --> 02:13:08,480
friends.
I'm like, uh huh, yeah, it's

2675
02:13:08,480 --> 02:13:09,080
cool.
That sounds.

2676
02:13:09,080 --> 02:13:09,800
Like fun?
Really.

2677
02:13:09,960 --> 02:13:11,640
Yeah.
Like is it is in is in the log

2678
02:13:11,640 --> 02:13:13,480
ward in Como.
Like he hasn't been anywhere.

2679
02:13:13,480 --> 02:13:16,920
But last summer my mom told me
she she rode her bike to get

2680
02:13:16,920 --> 02:13:21,080
there to visit me that day.
And, you know, my mom rode a

2681
02:13:21,080 --> 02:13:24,160
bike when she was a little girl
and she fell off of it and she's

2682
02:13:24,160 --> 02:13:26,000
been scared to death of bikes
ever since.

2683
02:13:26,320 --> 02:13:28,120
She don't ride little bikes, you
know.

2684
02:13:28,120 --> 02:13:30,080
But she told me, oh, yeah, I
ride it all the time.

2685
02:13:30,080 --> 02:13:33,560
I ride it, you know, to to your
sister's houses.

2686
02:13:33,560 --> 02:13:35,760
And I rode it here today and I
always ride.

2687
02:13:35,760 --> 02:13:37,880
My bike.
It's amazing the stories they

2688
02:13:37,880 --> 02:13:39,840
create in their brain.
And my mom's really quick.

2689
02:13:39,840 --> 02:13:42,800
Like if I ask her when was the
last time you went to Mars,

2690
02:13:42,800 --> 02:13:45,760
she'll say, oh, yeah, yesterday
I had lunch there.

2691
02:13:45,760 --> 02:13:48,560
We had grilled cheese
sandwiches, and it was really

2692
02:13:48,560 --> 02:13:50,040
good.
And, you know, I mean, she'll,

2693
02:13:50,040 --> 02:13:53,280
she'll make up the whole story,
you know, not whatever happened.

2694
02:13:53,320 --> 02:13:57,760
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
And the secret of that is not

2695
02:13:57,760 --> 02:13:59,160
arguing and saying that's not
the case.

2696
02:13:59,160 --> 02:14:02,440
It's like, man, that's that was
really cool, which I'll tell you

2697
02:14:02,440 --> 02:14:04,760
which is.
Yeah, exactly.

2698
02:14:04,960 --> 02:14:09,000
Sometimes I play games with her,
you know, like I'll say, like,

2699
02:14:09,000 --> 02:14:13,160
I'll just, I'll just go with it.
But the one thing that I started

2700
02:14:13,160 --> 02:14:16,520
doing, and at first the home
that that she's in didn't like

2701
02:14:16,520 --> 02:14:18,360
it.
They they sort of said, you

2702
02:14:18,360 --> 02:14:20,360
know, you're being deceptive.
So what?

2703
02:14:20,480 --> 02:14:23,400
My girlfriend and I would stop
every time we went to visit my

2704
02:14:23,400 --> 02:14:28,000
mom and we'd pick up a cupcake
and we'd bring it in and we'd

2705
02:14:28,000 --> 02:14:29,920
sing happy birthday to her every
time we came to.

2706
02:14:29,960 --> 02:14:32,560
Visit her it was It was her
birthday it was her birthday and

2707
02:14:32,600 --> 02:14:33,760
she.
Loved it.

2708
02:14:33,760 --> 02:14:36,720
And she'd eat the muffin and
everybody would sing and clap

2709
02:14:36,720 --> 02:14:40,880
and stuff in the place and they
kind of reprimanded me saying I

2710
02:14:40,880 --> 02:14:44,040
was being deceptive and it's not
good for a dementia patient to

2711
02:14:44,040 --> 02:14:46,840
trick them and all this stuff.
And I said basically, I said

2712
02:14:46,920 --> 02:14:48,760
fuck you.
It makes her happy, you know,

2713
02:14:48,840 --> 02:14:51,960
she smiles, she's happy and I'm
going to do it every time.

2714
02:14:51,960 --> 02:14:54,320
So if you want me to do it in
another room, I'll drag her in

2715
02:14:54,320 --> 02:14:56,400
another room and and sing happy
birthday.

2716
02:14:56,840 --> 02:14:59,800
And then they said, you know, we
think it's amazing what you're

2717
02:14:59,800 --> 02:15:01,960
doing.
We love it and and other people

2718
02:15:01,960 --> 02:15:05,360
are starting to do it now, so
why not, you know?

2719
02:15:05,360 --> 02:15:07,240
Yeah, no, Why not?
Yeah, I mean, you know, you want

2720
02:15:07,240 --> 02:15:09,280
to try and make their lives as
happy as possible.

2721
02:15:09,280 --> 02:15:12,280
And of course, of course.
Yeah, it's a terrible place to

2722
02:15:12,280 --> 02:15:13,480
be.
At least, Yeah.

2723
02:15:13,720 --> 02:15:15,960
Yeah, at least once a week I'll
go and pick that up and we'll go

2724
02:15:15,960 --> 02:15:18,440
after drive and yeah.
We'll go and get a couple of.

2725
02:15:18,440 --> 02:15:20,840
We used to do that.
Unfortunately that ends that

2726
02:15:20,840 --> 02:15:24,600
stage ends because it just
becomes so hard to get them out

2727
02:15:24,600 --> 02:15:27,280
of there and they don't
remember.

2728
02:15:27,280 --> 02:15:30,720
So you're doing it for you, you
know, at some point, like, and I

2729
02:15:30,720 --> 02:15:33,800
hope your dad never gets to that
point, but you know, that's how

2730
02:15:33,800 --> 02:15:36,760
my mom progressed.
Like she used to, I used to pick

2731
02:15:36,760 --> 02:15:39,080
her up.
She lived at my sister's house

2732
02:15:39,080 --> 02:15:42,440
at first when she first got got
into this problem.

2733
02:15:42,960 --> 02:15:45,880
And I pick her up at my sister's
house whenever I flew into

2734
02:15:45,880 --> 02:15:48,560
Calgary and take her out with me
to the to the house in the

2735
02:15:48,560 --> 02:15:51,520
mountains.
And she loved it there and

2736
02:15:51,520 --> 02:15:54,280
everything was fine.
And, and then it just got to

2737
02:15:54,280 --> 02:15:57,280
where she couldn't get up and
down the stairs and, and she,

2738
02:15:57,520 --> 02:16:00,760
she started smoking again for
some reason after having not

2739
02:16:00,760 --> 02:16:02,800
smoked for like 40 years or
something.

2740
02:16:03,240 --> 02:16:05,760
And she almost burned my house
down one day.

2741
02:16:05,760 --> 02:16:08,680
Like I found a burnt cigarette
and she claimed she didn't

2742
02:16:08,680 --> 02:16:10,040
smoke.
She didn't know what I was

2743
02:16:10,040 --> 02:16:13,640
talking about and all this.
So it it just got too hard.

2744
02:16:13,640 --> 02:16:16,080
Gets a little and then we'd.
We'd bring her out occasionally

2745
02:16:16,080 --> 02:16:17,960
on Thanksgiving or something.
But yeah.

2746
02:16:17,960 --> 02:16:19,360
So anyways, good luck with your
dad.

2747
02:16:19,360 --> 02:16:20,920
I I hope that works out.
OK.

2748
02:16:21,880 --> 02:16:23,680
So now you're now you're a sales
guy, right?

2749
02:16:24,440 --> 02:16:27,600
Well, it's an interesting thing.
What had happened was I'd been

2750
02:16:27,600 --> 02:16:30,600
working, I was working in LA and
I was, you know, I had this

2751
02:16:30,600 --> 02:16:33,600
thing, I had all the, I had all
my daughter racks with Neutron

2752
02:16:33,600 --> 02:16:39,440
stuff in and Power Distribution
of the film sets.

2753
02:16:39,440 --> 02:16:41,959
Very different in the way it's
done.

2754
02:16:41,959 --> 02:16:45,080
You know, we have these, you
know, 200 M lunch boxes that we

2755
02:16:45,080 --> 02:16:48,280
pull out everywhere and you
know, normally on the corner of

2756
02:16:48,280 --> 02:16:50,639
each set you'll have a data
distribution point with power.

2757
02:16:50,639 --> 02:16:58,080
And also you'll have a here like
have a 1200 amp box with a bunch

2758
02:16:58,080 --> 02:17:00,559
of bytes connectors and then you
whack a node rack on top of

2759
02:17:00,559 --> 02:17:02,559
that.
And then just it just got really

2760
02:17:02,559 --> 02:17:04,520
messy.
So I went to the guys at dad

2761
02:17:04,520 --> 02:17:08,360
come and I'm like, can you guys
build me like a rack mount that

2762
02:17:08,360 --> 02:17:12,440
is like 12 Edison sockets run
off 100 amp bytes.

2763
02:17:12,440 --> 02:17:14,240
And they went, yeah, we can, we
can do that.

2764
02:17:14,240 --> 02:17:16,920
So they built me a prototype and
I was like, yeah, that's cool,

2765
02:17:16,920 --> 02:17:20,080
but can you flip it around so
that the sockets lined up more

2766
02:17:20,080 --> 02:17:23,040
with the ports on an EN12?
And they went, yeah, OK, so

2767
02:17:23,040 --> 02:17:25,080
they, they built me that
prototype and I tested it for a

2768
02:17:25,080 --> 02:17:26,480
while and I was like, yeah,
that's really cool.

2769
02:17:26,480 --> 02:17:30,160
We should build some of these.
And that was right before the

2770
02:17:30,160 --> 02:17:34,840
strike started, But I have, I
still have that first one.

2771
02:17:34,840 --> 02:17:36,520
And so I was like, oh, that's
really cool.

2772
02:17:36,520 --> 02:17:41,760
And, and later that year I came
back to to Perth and I have a

2773
02:17:41,760 --> 02:17:44,559
friend, Craig Bateson that runs
a company called Amigatech.

2774
02:17:45,480 --> 02:17:49,719
And I went to him because he
makes electrical distribution

2775
02:17:49,719 --> 02:17:52,080
products for the entertainment
industry.

2776
02:17:52,080 --> 02:17:56,520
So, you know, rack mount distros
and stage boxes and cabling and

2777
02:17:56,520 --> 02:17:58,760
all this sort of stuff.
And I was like, hey man, I

2778
02:17:58,760 --> 02:18:00,440
designed this thing with the
guys in the states.

2779
02:18:00,440 --> 02:18:02,520
He's like, I could build that.
I said, I'm like, you can build

2780
02:18:02,520 --> 02:18:04,320
something like that.
And he's like, yeah, he's like,

2781
02:18:04,320 --> 02:18:07,000
yeah, easy man, no worries.
So I was like, oh, cool, OK.

2782
02:18:07,480 --> 02:18:09,879
And so, you know, I thought, Oh,
well, maybe we can do something

2783
02:18:09,879 --> 02:18:12,879
with that.
And then, you know, when I came

2784
02:18:12,879 --> 02:18:17,719
back after a couple of years
later after my mom died, he was

2785
02:18:17,719 --> 02:18:19,000
like, Hey, man, I know you're in
town.

2786
02:18:19,000 --> 02:18:20,520
I know what happened.
He said, hey, man, if you're

2787
02:18:20,520 --> 02:18:22,879
bored or if you need some money
or if you want to come and do

2788
02:18:22,879 --> 02:18:25,639
something, come and hang out of
the shop for a couple of days.

2789
02:18:25,639 --> 02:18:28,639
And because I've known, I've
known Craig for about 25 years.

2790
02:18:28,639 --> 02:18:31,559
He was a, he was like a young
kid with a van with, you know, a

2791
02:18:31,559 --> 02:18:35,280
few, a few parking bars and he
was doing little gigs and stuff.

2792
02:18:35,280 --> 02:18:39,760
And then he had a small rental
company and, and, you know, at

2793
02:18:39,760 --> 02:18:42,080
the time, before I left Perth, I
had a lot of club gigs.

2794
02:18:42,080 --> 02:18:43,639
I was doing bands and all this
sort of stuff.

2795
02:18:43,639 --> 02:18:45,440
And then I decided to move to
America.

2796
02:18:45,440 --> 02:18:48,200
I called him up.
I said, hey, man, I'm moving to

2797
02:18:48,200 --> 02:18:49,840
the USI got all these gigs.
Do you want him?

2798
02:18:49,840 --> 02:18:50,879
And he was like, yeah, yeah,
yeah.

2799
02:18:51,360 --> 02:18:54,840
So he began the heir apparent.
He, you know, I basically gave

2800
02:18:54,840 --> 02:18:56,760
him my slate.
Of gigs you handed him your

2801
02:18:56,760 --> 02:18:59,000
business, Yeah.
Yeah, pretty much, yeah.

2802
02:18:59,000 --> 02:19:01,840
Yeah.
And then so, you know, when I

2803
02:19:01,840 --> 02:19:05,240
was here, he, he, you know, I
only ended up working a few, you

2804
02:19:05,240 --> 02:19:08,920
know, 3-4 days, whatever it was.
And then, you know, we kept in

2805
02:19:08,920 --> 02:19:12,280
touch and he's like, see, and I
sort of started to intimate to

2806
02:19:12,280 --> 02:19:14,360
him that I was going to move
back to Australia.

2807
02:19:17,080 --> 02:19:21,799
And, you know, obviously his
focus has always been live

2808
02:19:21,799 --> 02:19:24,920
entertainment, live events.
I'm a film guy.

2809
02:19:25,200 --> 02:19:27,920
I know film guys.
Let's, let's, let's see if we

2810
02:19:27,920 --> 02:19:29,639
can get a film product line
going.

2811
02:19:29,639 --> 02:19:32,240
Let's, let's see if I can help
you build your business.

2812
02:19:33,280 --> 02:19:35,320
You know, let's see if we can
get into the lighting control

2813
02:19:35,320 --> 02:19:36,520
side of things.
Yeah.

2814
02:19:36,520 --> 02:19:38,360
So there was a few things going
on.

2815
02:19:39,360 --> 02:19:42,600
And when I basically made the
decision to move home, I told

2816
02:19:42,600 --> 02:19:44,799
him and he said, all right, I've
got a job for you.

2817
02:19:44,799 --> 02:19:50,120
I was just like, well, OK,
Because you know, I'd had a few

2818
02:19:50,120 --> 02:19:52,080
people say to me, look, listen
man, if you move back to

2819
02:19:52,080 --> 02:19:55,000
Australia, throw your hat in the
pool as a film program in

2820
02:19:55,000 --> 02:19:57,520
Australia, you know, you'd be
top five day one.

2821
02:19:58,280 --> 02:20:00,400
And I'm kind of like, yeah, but
all most of the major film

2822
02:20:00,400 --> 02:20:03,320
production happens in, you know,
Brisbane or Melbourne or Sydney

2823
02:20:04,160 --> 02:20:06,720
and, you know, if I'm going to.
Work on might as well be in LA,

2824
02:20:06,720 --> 02:20:08,960
yeah?
Might as well be in LA.

2825
02:20:09,000 --> 02:20:11,920
Yeah, I mean, you know, it's a 5
hour flight instead of a 20 hour

2826
02:20:11,920 --> 02:20:14,600
flight, but can't be there for
my dad if I'm in Brisbane flight

2827
02:20:14,640 --> 02:20:16,840
four or five months at a time.
Right.

2828
02:20:17,320 --> 02:20:21,640
So, you know, yeah, Craig
basically offered me a job in

2829
02:20:21,640 --> 02:20:24,680
sales and marketing, which is
again a tie back to that first

2830
02:20:24,680 --> 02:20:28,560
job that I had at a high school
where my, where I learned about

2831
02:20:28,560 --> 02:20:31,720
inventory control and and
customer relations and all that

2832
02:20:31,720 --> 02:20:33,240
sort of stuff.
Yeah.

2833
02:20:33,840 --> 02:20:37,560
So I started working for Craig,
still running Sydney control in

2834
02:20:37,560 --> 02:20:40,760
the US, which is one of the
reasons that I was, you know, at

2835
02:20:40,760 --> 02:20:44,480
LDI and met you this year.
Yeah, one of one of the things

2836
02:20:44,480 --> 02:20:48,120
for a few years now, Cedar and I
have been running training

2837
02:20:48,120 --> 02:20:52,160
classes on Onyx for Local 728.
We call it the lighting or the

2838
02:20:52,160 --> 02:20:55,920
film lighting program as boot
camp because if you go to any

2839
02:20:55,960 --> 02:21:00,000
major console manufacturers
training class, they're teaching

2840
02:21:00,000 --> 02:21:04,080
how to be a rock'n'roll program
and not how to be a film

2841
02:21:04,080 --> 02:21:07,120
programmer.
So basically we sat down and we

2842
02:21:07,120 --> 02:21:10,200
wrote a training course for how
to be a film programmer.

2843
02:21:10,560 --> 02:21:13,680
You know how we use, you know,
groups and presets differently.

2844
02:21:13,680 --> 02:21:16,800
How can we, how we can utilize
2D plans differently?

2845
02:21:16,800 --> 02:21:19,960
How we can do, you know, the
same skill set that you would

2846
02:21:19,960 --> 02:21:23,040
use in a class, but that's
slightly tweaked application for

2847
02:21:23,040 --> 02:21:24,440
a movie set?
Yeah.

2848
02:21:24,440 --> 02:21:27,080
So we've been teaching that for
a few years and we decided to

2849
02:21:27,080 --> 02:21:31,040
basically record that.
And in fact, I'm heading back to

2850
02:21:31,040 --> 02:21:32,960
LA at the end of February and
early March.

2851
02:21:32,960 --> 02:21:36,560
We're going to be teaching a
couple of courses for 7:28

2852
02:21:36,560 --> 02:21:37,920
again.
We're going to be we're going to

2853
02:21:37,920 --> 02:21:40,520
be opening up our class to the
public for the first time.

2854
02:21:41,320 --> 02:21:45,520
And we're also filming the
advanced portion of the class

2855
02:21:45,520 --> 02:21:48,960
where we really dive into pixel
mapping and, you know, the

2856
02:21:48,960 --> 02:21:50,200
effects engineering, lots of the
stuff.

2857
02:21:50,200 --> 02:21:53,680
Very cool.
At the moment I'm still kind of

2858
02:21:53,680 --> 02:21:57,080
jumping back and forth between
both a little bit, but I'm

2859
02:21:57,240 --> 02:22:01,760
really, you know, we, one of the
things I like about Craig and

2860
02:22:01,760 --> 02:22:04,120
Omega and the way the business
works is that there's this

2861
02:22:04,120 --> 02:22:06,120
general product line that he
makes.

2862
02:22:07,320 --> 02:22:10,240
But we had, we had a client call
up last week that was like, hey

2863
02:22:10,240 --> 02:22:12,320
man, you know, I could do a lot
of stuff with like corporate

2864
02:22:12,320 --> 02:22:13,800
gigs.
And, you know, we've always got

2865
02:22:13,800 --> 02:22:17,360
cameras and then, you know, like
there's always someone that just

2866
02:22:17,360 --> 02:22:20,080
wants to take a power board and
gaffe tape it to the leg of the

2867
02:22:20,080 --> 02:22:21,640
tripod and doesn't look very
professional.

2868
02:22:22,560 --> 02:22:23,600
Can you guys come up with
something?

2869
02:22:23,920 --> 02:22:26,520
And so, you know, like we make a
large stage box, which is like,

2870
02:22:26,520 --> 02:22:30,280
you know, power con or true con
in and six GPO outlets and all

2871
02:22:30,280 --> 02:22:33,040
this sort of stuff.
And I was like, could we put a

2872
02:22:33,040 --> 02:22:35,320
power board in like a metal,
metal housing?

2873
02:22:35,320 --> 02:22:38,280
So basically over the course of
a couple of days and working

2874
02:22:38,280 --> 02:22:40,760
with this client, we basically,
I said, I said to Craig, I said,

2875
02:22:40,760 --> 02:22:41,840
all right, what about if we
build this?

2876
02:22:41,840 --> 02:22:44,000
And I just drew up something
and, you know, handed over the

2877
02:22:44,000 --> 02:22:46,200
desk and he looked at it and
then he jumped into his design

2878
02:22:46,200 --> 02:22:48,600
software and he came up with
something and he send that to

2879
02:22:48,600 --> 02:22:49,920
me.
And I'm like, yeah, that's cool.

2880
02:22:49,920 --> 02:22:51,600
And I said that to the client.
I said, what do you think of

2881
02:22:51,600 --> 02:22:52,800
this?
And he's like, yeah, how about,

2882
02:22:52,840 --> 02:22:54,120
but what about this, this and
this?

2883
02:22:54,880 --> 02:22:57,000
Give that back to Craig.
Craig sits there and spends

2884
02:22:57,000 --> 02:22:59,480
another day drawing it.
And, you know, in the course of

2885
02:22:59,480 --> 02:23:01,960
four days, we'd basically
redesign this new product.

2886
02:23:01,960 --> 02:23:06,080
And we got the we got the cost
of the the metal stampings from

2887
02:23:06,080 --> 02:23:07,880
the from our sheet metal guys
today.

2888
02:23:07,880 --> 02:23:10,320
And so tomorrow I'm going to be
able to call the client and say,

2889
02:23:10,320 --> 02:23:12,720
yeah, it's amazing.
That's one of the best things

2890
02:23:12,720 --> 02:23:16,600
about being a small company is
that you, you still listen to

2891
02:23:16,600 --> 02:23:19,560
your customers.
You know, like when you get big

2892
02:23:19,560 --> 02:23:23,600
enough that you now think that
you know everything and use this

2893
02:23:23,600 --> 02:23:26,720
because I told you, you should
use this, right?

2894
02:23:26,720 --> 02:23:28,080
I hate that.
I hate that.

2895
02:23:28,080 --> 02:23:30,200
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
No, I mean, you know, that's,

2896
02:23:30,200 --> 02:23:32,200
that's one of the things.
I mean, that's always been

2897
02:23:32,480 --> 02:23:34,520
Craig's philosophy.
If you buy ten of them, I'll

2898
02:23:34,520 --> 02:23:36,680
build it.
Yeah, and that's amazing.

2899
02:23:36,680 --> 02:23:38,600
So this customer.
It's not very scalable.

2900
02:23:38,600 --> 02:23:40,760
It's difficult to scale that
type of a business.

2901
02:23:40,760 --> 02:23:44,200
Although like City Theatrical
did it, there's a bunch of

2902
02:23:44,200 --> 02:23:47,560
companies that are sort of like
little skunk works manufacturers

2903
02:23:47,760 --> 02:23:52,720
and they're able to to quickly
be able to create those those

2904
02:23:52,720 --> 02:23:55,800
nichy products.
Yeah, just because I want to

2905
02:23:55,800 --> 02:23:57,640
need some.
Where I find it really

2906
02:23:57,640 --> 02:23:59,840
interesting is, is that a
megatech sort of falls and, you

2907
02:23:59,840 --> 02:24:01,920
know, you have the guys that are
just like one guy building

2908
02:24:01,920 --> 02:24:05,240
something in this garage.
And then you have someone like,

2909
02:24:05,320 --> 02:24:08,000
you know, LSC who builds, you
know, Right.

2910
02:24:08,040 --> 02:24:09,440
You know, we're kind of in the
middle.

2911
02:24:09,960 --> 02:24:12,080
Yeah.
You know, we could we could

2912
02:24:12,080 --> 02:24:15,240
spend a bunch of money on R&D
and build a more digital

2913
02:24:15,240 --> 02:24:17,440
interface and that would put us
all into the LSC league.

2914
02:24:17,440 --> 02:24:18,760
But that's going to take a lot
of capital.

2915
02:24:19,720 --> 02:24:22,080
But at the same time, we're
still in that sort of niche

2916
02:24:22,080 --> 02:24:24,960
boutique kind of thing where
someone says, can you build me

2917
02:24:24,960 --> 02:24:26,040
this?
Yep, we can do that for you.

2918
02:24:26,040 --> 02:24:27,120
We're going to do that for you
in a couple.

2919
02:24:27,120 --> 02:24:29,680
Yeah.
You know, like we.

2920
02:24:29,880 --> 02:24:34,640
Does con but does Khan do the
the Obsidian stuff as well or

2921
02:24:34,640 --> 02:24:39,560
just elation?
They're the, as far as I know,

2922
02:24:39,560 --> 02:24:41,640
they're the national distributor
for for.

2923
02:24:41,640 --> 02:24:43,560
Obsidian.
Well, I know they're elation,

2924
02:24:43,560 --> 02:24:47,200
but I didn't know if they're
Obsidian as well ula yeah.

2925
02:24:48,800 --> 02:24:51,600
I think they handle more of the
neutron stuff than Netflix

2926
02:24:51,600 --> 02:24:53,320
stuff.
OK, so.

2927
02:24:53,320 --> 02:24:55,040
Yeah.
That's a whole interesting,

2928
02:24:55,560 --> 02:25:03,320
Yeah, but you know, it's again,
it's one of my areas of

2929
02:25:03,320 --> 02:25:06,160
expertise because I'm actually a
certified trainer for relation.

2930
02:25:08,400 --> 02:25:10,120
So yeah, actually it was really
cool.

2931
02:25:10,120 --> 02:25:14,000
I got to got to go to HQ in in
the Netherlands last year and

2932
02:25:14,160 --> 02:25:18,040
and kit anointed as a trainer
for those guys, which was really

2933
02:25:18,040 --> 02:25:18,920
cool.
That's cool.

2934
02:25:19,400 --> 02:25:22,560
Very nice people.
I mean, Eric, Eric is a very,

2935
02:25:22,560 --> 02:25:26,080
very close friend of mine.
He has been for a long time.

2936
02:25:26,080 --> 02:25:28,120
I'm not close with with Toby at
all.

2937
02:25:28,120 --> 02:25:29,720
I know him, but I'm not close
with them.

2938
02:25:29,960 --> 02:25:33,240
And I was, I was close with
Scott and Chuck Davies back in

2939
02:25:33,240 --> 02:25:37,440
the day, you know, But so, yeah.
Well, I mean, this is this is

2940
02:25:37,440 --> 02:25:39,160
where the Elation guys got
really smart.

2941
02:25:39,160 --> 02:25:42,800
As you know, when when Martin
started to sort of empty out the

2942
02:25:42,800 --> 02:25:45,040
talent pool, they picked up a
whole bunch of those guys.

2943
02:25:45,040 --> 02:25:46,600
They did that's.
Been a huge part of their

2944
02:25:46,600 --> 02:25:48,440
success.
I mean, I, you know, like I

2945
02:25:48,440 --> 02:25:52,320
said, late 90s, you know, Martin
was like this company that made

2946
02:25:52,320 --> 02:25:55,760
these cheap crappy DJ lights.
And then, you know, the pinnacle

2947
02:25:55,760 --> 02:25:58,440
at that stage was, you know,
very light or whoever.

2948
02:25:58,840 --> 02:26:02,400
And then, you know, 10 years
later, Martin was the the thing.

2949
02:26:02,880 --> 02:26:05,720
Yeah.
And elation made cheap little

2950
02:26:05,720 --> 02:26:07,720
DJ.
Lights and it's funny how nice

2951
02:26:07,720 --> 02:26:10,560
to all.
Yeah, I mean, I remember when I

2952
02:26:10,600 --> 02:26:13,240
was all you had, was it?
Was got LDI and and Martin and

2953
02:26:13,240 --> 02:26:17,440
high end had the big booths and
and then all of a sudden, like

2954
02:26:17,440 --> 02:26:21,520
by the early 2000s, Martin and
high end had tiny little booths

2955
02:26:21,560 --> 02:26:23,640
and Elation and Chauvet were
huge.

2956
02:26:23,640 --> 02:26:26,120
You know, it was like what just
happened here?

2957
02:26:26,120 --> 02:26:29,880
Something happened, so it's.
Just again, I think it's that

2958
02:26:30,040 --> 02:26:32,720
ability to manufacture at scale,
yeah.

2959
02:26:34,040 --> 02:26:35,880
Well, I mean, the next
interesting step with all of

2960
02:26:35,880 --> 02:26:38,920
that is going to be seeing, you
know, I think everyone's in a

2961
02:26:38,920 --> 02:26:42,600
bit of a panic to try and find
an alternative to manufacturing

2962
02:26:42,600 --> 02:26:46,920
in China, partially because of
the president who's now in the

2963
02:26:47,000 --> 02:26:49,080
US who's dead set on, on
tariffs.

2964
02:26:49,480 --> 02:26:52,800
And, you know, it makes it
complicated when you're

2965
02:26:53,040 --> 02:26:56,960
manufacturing in China because
you're able to manufacture for,

2966
02:26:56,960 --> 02:27:01,280
call it, 70% less or 60% less
than somewhere else in the

2967
02:27:01,280 --> 02:27:02,920
world.
Well, now if you've got a

2968
02:27:02,920 --> 02:27:06,960
president who's adding 50%
tariffs in your largest market

2969
02:27:07,760 --> 02:27:11,600
in the world, you know, possibly
50% of your sales, yeah, it's

2970
02:27:11,640 --> 02:27:13,440
brutal.
So you got to find alternatives.

2971
02:27:13,440 --> 02:27:16,320
And I know a lot of them are
scrambling to do that now, so.

2972
02:27:17,640 --> 02:27:18,920
Yeah.
I mean, that's, that's going to

2973
02:27:18,920 --> 02:27:21,200
be another thing that's going to
have an interesting effect on

2974
02:27:21,200 --> 02:27:25,800
the industry and, and how it how
it's going to get a function.

2975
02:27:27,800 --> 02:27:31,600
I mean, you know, as a guy that
runs a sales company, it's going

2976
02:27:31,600 --> 02:27:33,280
to be like, like, I think it's
interesting.

2977
02:27:34,880 --> 02:27:37,520
You know, I think one of the one
of the advantages that Megatech

2978
02:27:37,520 --> 02:27:39,920
certainly has is the fact that
we're based in Australia.

2979
02:27:39,920 --> 02:27:42,440
We manufacture in Australia.
Our customer base is mostly

2980
02:27:42,440 --> 02:27:45,320
Australian, although we do have
clients in New Zealand and other

2981
02:27:45,320 --> 02:27:49,560
regions in the apex.
So, yeah, you know, for us, I

2982
02:27:49,560 --> 02:27:55,440
mean, I've had this discussion
with Craig, would would not make

2983
02:27:55,440 --> 02:27:59,080
a lot of sense for us to try and
track into the American market

2984
02:27:59,080 --> 02:28:01,440
just because of the volume and
the saturation there and the

2985
02:28:01,440 --> 02:28:04,080
fact that going to the UL
listing is a pain in the arse.

2986
02:28:04,760 --> 02:28:07,800
All of that, yeah, yeah, more
money, your problems.

2987
02:28:07,800 --> 02:28:10,160
We could, well, no, but I mean
this is the thing, the product

2988
02:28:10,160 --> 02:28:12,840
that we make in Australia would
work equally as well in Europe.

2989
02:28:13,240 --> 02:28:15,160
Yeah.
So, you know, that could be,

2990
02:28:15,400 --> 02:28:17,280
that could be part of the
fabulous five year plan.

2991
02:28:17,280 --> 02:28:19,760
I don't know.
Yeah, yeah.

2992
02:28:19,760 --> 02:28:22,200
You know the.
Well, it's always the argument

2993
02:28:22,200 --> 02:28:25,240
when, when you're in business,
you, you either need to find,

2994
02:28:25,480 --> 02:28:29,160
you need to create more product
for your customers or find more

2995
02:28:29,160 --> 02:28:31,320
customers for your product.
So there's new ways to grow a

2996
02:28:31,320 --> 02:28:32,600
business.
And those are the two.

2997
02:28:32,600 --> 02:28:35,320
Well, it's it's not that
scientific really so.

2998
02:28:35,320 --> 02:28:36,880
Yeah, and, and it's it's
interesting.

2999
02:28:36,880 --> 02:28:39,360
I had a couple of people with
conversations with people that

3000
02:28:39,360 --> 02:28:43,880
know both Craig and I Craig is
a, Craig is a, a genius when it

3001
02:28:43,880 --> 02:28:47,920
comes to designing this stuff
and, and, and the, the thought

3002
02:28:47,920 --> 02:28:49,840
and the logic and how things
work together.

3003
02:28:49,840 --> 02:28:52,720
You know, like we have a, we
have a little, you know, one of

3004
02:28:52,720 --> 02:28:55,200
the bumper stickers we made
recently, it says made by the

3005
02:28:55,200 --> 02:28:57,880
people who have fought the fight
because he's been there and he's

3006
02:28:57,880 --> 02:29:01,800
done that same as me.
So he knows, he knows what

3007
02:29:02,280 --> 02:29:04,240
clients want.
And if he's not sure, he asks

3008
02:29:04,240 --> 02:29:07,360
them.
We, we, you know, our products

3009
02:29:07,360 --> 02:29:09,920
are built to solve problems that
people have faced.

3010
02:29:11,040 --> 02:29:12,360
And he's really, really good at
that.

3011
02:29:12,480 --> 02:29:14,720
I'm really good at getting in
front of people and being like,

3012
02:29:14,720 --> 02:29:16,920
hey, you need this and you need
this, and This is why this is

3013
02:29:16,920 --> 02:29:18,400
good.
And yeah, you know, like.

3014
02:29:18,760 --> 02:29:20,880
Well, you gave me that
indication right when you said

3015
02:29:20,880 --> 02:29:24,800
you were in, in that town in, in
Oregon and you walked right up

3016
02:29:24,800 --> 02:29:28,080
to the grip truck and said, hey,
you the lighting guys, you know,

3017
02:29:28,400 --> 02:29:29,800
I'm Chris.
Nice to meet you.

3018
02:29:30,160 --> 02:29:31,520
Yeah, exactly.
No, I mean you.

3019
02:29:31,520 --> 02:29:32,440
Ever.
Need somebody?

3020
02:29:32,840 --> 02:29:34,480
Yeah.
That's kind of my personality.

3021
02:29:34,480 --> 02:29:37,240
Like I'm a I'm a people person.
I like interacting with people.

3022
02:29:37,320 --> 02:29:40,040
I think that's one of the
reasons that I enjoy, you know,

3023
02:29:40,040 --> 02:29:42,080
the training side of what I do
so much.

3024
02:29:42,080 --> 02:29:45,800
You know, when it comes back to
someone showed me, I feel

3025
02:29:48,080 --> 02:29:51,200
indebted in a way.
You know, I've got the career

3026
02:29:51,200 --> 02:29:53,440
that I've got because someone
saw me and said, oh, this kid is

3027
02:29:53,440 --> 02:29:54,800
interested.
I want to show him something

3028
02:29:54,800 --> 02:29:57,520
that I know.
Whereas for me, it's like, I

3029
02:29:57,520 --> 02:30:00,520
want to, I want to, you know,
like even when I was, when I was

3030
02:30:00,760 --> 02:30:03,200
working on movie sets full time,
there's always that one guy that

3031
02:30:03,200 --> 02:30:05,200
was kind of like hanging around
the console, kind of like, Oh

3032
02:30:05,280 --> 02:30:07,560
yeah, what are you doing, man?
That looks really cool.

3033
02:30:07,560 --> 02:30:08,760
I'm like, are you interested in
this?

3034
02:30:09,200 --> 02:30:10,720
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Come on, man, Hang out.

3035
02:30:10,720 --> 02:30:12,000
I'll show you what I'm doing.
You're.

3036
02:30:12,000 --> 02:30:14,360
So right, you're so right.
You know, I have a 20 year old

3037
02:30:14,360 --> 02:30:16,200
son and I'm trying to teach him
the same thing.

3038
02:30:16,200 --> 02:30:22,000
Like my magic power is, is, is,
you know, my network, you know,

3039
02:30:22,000 --> 02:30:24,120
it's, it's not me.
It's the friends that I have.

3040
02:30:24,360 --> 02:30:27,080
They're, they're the, they're
the important people.

3041
02:30:27,080 --> 02:30:29,680
I'm not, I just, I talk to a lot
of people.

3042
02:30:29,680 --> 02:30:34,440
I know a lot of people and that
brings a lot of value to me both

3043
02:30:34,440 --> 02:30:38,120
personally and professionally.
But, and I try to tell my son

3044
02:30:38,120 --> 02:30:41,920
that talk to everyone.
Assume the guy next to you at

3045
02:30:41,920 --> 02:30:45,640
McDonald's ordering his food is
the next guy that's going to

3046
02:30:45,640 --> 02:30:48,040
make a difference in your life.
And if he's.

3047
02:30:48,040 --> 02:30:49,960
Not.
What did you lose, you know?

3048
02:30:49,960 --> 02:30:51,760
Exactly.
Well, one of the one of the

3049
02:30:51,760 --> 02:30:55,400
things that I first did when I
first joined 728 in 2015 and I

3050
02:30:55,400 --> 02:30:57,000
tell this story to people
because I'm like, you should do

3051
02:30:57,000 --> 02:31:02,080
this when I first joined.
I'm still living in Portland and

3052
02:31:02,960 --> 02:31:06,800
a mate of mine who I met on that
first movie in Ashland was

3053
02:31:06,800 --> 02:31:09,520
living in LA at the time and I
was like, hey man, I'm coming

3054
02:31:09,520 --> 02:31:11,040
down to LA, can I crash on your
couch?

3055
02:31:11,640 --> 02:31:13,280
So I crashed on his couch for
like 6 months.

3056
02:31:13,880 --> 02:31:18,760
So in order to get out of his
hair a little bit, if there was

3057
02:31:18,760 --> 02:31:22,800
a training class at the 728 hall
on the weekend, I went in the

3058
02:31:22,800 --> 02:31:25,560
training class and it might have
been something that I knew that

3059
02:31:25,560 --> 02:31:27,280
I thought I knew something
about.

3060
02:31:27,800 --> 02:31:31,680
And every time I went to a class
I always learned something, I

3061
02:31:31,680 --> 02:31:34,080
was met some new people and
there was always a free lunch,

3062
02:31:34,080 --> 02:31:36,400
which is pretty rare these days
3.

3063
02:31:36,400 --> 02:31:39,720
Pretty great reasons.
Exactly, you know, pick up some

3064
02:31:39,720 --> 02:31:42,240
knowledge, increase your
network, get some free, fill

3065
02:31:42,240 --> 02:31:44,160
your belly and meet some cool
people.

3066
02:31:44,200 --> 02:31:48,520
And and I think that was a
reason why I became, you know,

3067
02:31:50,280 --> 02:31:52,400
more well known in in the local
more quickly.

3068
02:31:52,400 --> 02:31:54,360
Yeah, yeah.
I mean, you know, the fact that

3069
02:31:54,360 --> 02:31:56,640
I'm an Aussie doesn't hurt.
But you know, there's, yeah, you

3070
02:31:56,640 --> 02:31:58,680
know, there's a million Aussies
in LA, so it's not actually a

3071
02:31:58,680 --> 02:32:02,120
huge deal in LA.
But you know, like increasing

3072
02:32:02,120 --> 02:32:04,840
your knowledge base, increasing
your network is critical things

3073
02:32:04,840 --> 02:32:08,040
if you want to if you want to be
successful in this industry to

3074
02:32:08,040 --> 02:32:08,720
the point.
That.

3075
02:32:09,760 --> 02:32:13,400
As someone that teaches training
classes, I like to go to

3076
02:32:13,400 --> 02:32:19,000
training classes just to see how
other people are doing it, You

3077
02:32:19,040 --> 02:32:20,400
know, what are their techniques?
What?

3078
02:32:20,400 --> 02:32:21,040
Do they teach?
Yeah.

3079
02:32:21,040 --> 02:32:25,000
It's it's smart because it's
smart, man.

3080
02:32:25,480 --> 02:32:27,280
It's smart it.
Increases your own skill set,

3081
02:32:27,720 --> 02:32:30,240
yeah.
Well, and even even if it's just

3082
02:32:30,640 --> 02:32:34,720
sitting down at a bar to grab a
beer, talk to the person next to

3083
02:32:34,720 --> 02:32:37,480
you, you know, like what, what
are you losing?

3084
02:32:37,480 --> 02:32:40,040
You're already sitting there,
you're already having the beer.

3085
02:32:40,480 --> 02:32:43,600
And and not just talk to them,
listen to them.

3086
02:32:43,600 --> 02:32:46,280
Like sometimes I'll be 20
minutes into a conversation

3087
02:32:46,280 --> 02:32:50,120
before we get around to what do
I do, you know, cuz I'm, I'm

3088
02:32:50,120 --> 02:32:53,600
learning about that person
because I'm slotting them in

3089
02:32:53,600 --> 02:32:57,280
somewhere, whether it's useless
information, information that

3090
02:32:57,280 --> 02:33:00,040
could help me personally,
information that I could help

3091
02:33:00,040 --> 02:33:02,360
him personally, professionally,
etcetera.

3092
02:33:02,360 --> 02:33:05,760
You know, and, and, and
sometimes it's just meaningless

3093
02:33:05,760 --> 02:33:07,640
conversation.
Sometimes it's just killing

3094
02:33:07,640 --> 02:33:09,320
time.
We're talking about, Hey, how do

3095
02:33:09,320 --> 02:33:11,640
you think the dolphins are going
to do next year?

3096
02:33:11,640 --> 02:33:15,400
You know and.
And if yeah, if, if anything

3097
02:33:15,400 --> 02:33:19,280
from me, I, I want to talk less
about what I do for a living

3098
02:33:19,280 --> 02:33:21,360
because the minute you tell
people that you work in the film

3099
02:33:21,360 --> 02:33:23,240
industry or that you worked on
the Star Wars show.

3100
02:33:23,240 --> 02:33:24,200
Yeah, they shut up.
Novel.

3101
02:33:24,200 --> 02:33:26,560
Yeah, they shut up.
No, no, they, they, well, they

3102
02:33:26,600 --> 02:33:29,000
either shut up or they ask you a
million questions just about

3103
02:33:29,000 --> 02:33:30,680
that thing.
And it's just like it becomes

3104
02:33:30,680 --> 02:33:31,800
about that, yeah.
Yeah.

3105
02:33:31,800 --> 02:33:34,160
Yeah, yeah.
Well, not only that, you, you

3106
02:33:34,160 --> 02:33:35,960
lose all the value that you were
going to get.

3107
02:33:35,960 --> 02:33:39,520
Like, you know, it's like dinner
parties I used to say to to

3108
02:33:39,520 --> 02:33:43,240
people, like I hate going to to
dinner parties with regular

3109
02:33:43,240 --> 02:33:45,080
people who aren't in the
industry.

3110
02:33:45,560 --> 02:33:47,480
And they're like, well, why?
That's kind of weird.

3111
02:33:47,480 --> 02:33:51,520
And it's because as soon as
someone realizes that last week

3112
02:33:51,520 --> 02:33:54,680
you just met Taylor Swift and
and, you know, you were

3113
02:33:54,680 --> 02:33:57,600
backstage and hanging out
because your buddy is the

3114
02:33:57,600 --> 02:34:01,880
lighting designer or something,
the the whole room sort of

3115
02:34:02,040 --> 02:34:04,800
either shuts down completely or
they ask you a billion

3116
02:34:04,800 --> 02:34:07,960
questions, but they shut down
because their stories dwarf in

3117
02:34:07,960 --> 02:34:10,000
comparison to.
I was hanging out with Taylor

3118
02:34:10,000 --> 02:34:11,680
Swift last week, right?
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

3119
02:34:11,680 --> 02:34:15,640
And so, yeah, I mean, it's an
interesting industry from that

3120
02:34:15,640 --> 02:34:18,760
standpoint because, you know, I
remember a great conversation I

3121
02:34:18,760 --> 02:34:20,880
had with a guy.
I got upgraded to 1st class.

3122
02:34:20,880 --> 02:34:24,840
I was flying to Chicago and this
guy spent two hours telling me

3123
02:34:25,280 --> 02:34:28,120
that he works in springs.
He's in the in the springs

3124
02:34:28,120 --> 02:34:31,000
business springs, anything from
the tiniest little spring in

3125
02:34:31,200 --> 02:34:34,760
these springs that are 25 feet
in diameter or whatever, right?

3126
02:34:35,000 --> 02:34:38,360
And he's going to a hardware
show in, in, in Chicago.

3127
02:34:38,360 --> 02:34:40,960
And it probably wasn't two
hours, it was probably 1/2 hour.

3128
02:34:40,960 --> 02:34:44,240
And I learned way more about
springs and the spring business

3129
02:34:44,240 --> 02:34:46,400
than I ever wanted to know he.
Wanted to know Yeah.

3130
02:34:46,400 --> 02:34:47,560
And I.
Listened to his entire

3131
02:34:47,560 --> 02:34:49,360
conversation and then he said,
So what do you do?

3132
02:34:49,360 --> 02:34:52,160
And I said, well, you know, I
sell lighting and, and concert

3133
02:34:52,160 --> 02:34:55,480
lighting and stuff.
And he's like, oh, you know, and

3134
02:34:55,480 --> 02:34:58,600
he just felt shitty about his
own life after that moment, You

3135
02:34:58,600 --> 02:35:00,880
know, It's like, oh, man, my
life sucks.

3136
02:35:00,880 --> 02:35:04,760
But you know the thing I would
have been the the take away I

3137
02:35:04,760 --> 02:35:07,080
would have had from that
conversation.

3138
02:35:07,080 --> 02:35:11,440
And and if you're going to talk
about springs for two hours, you

3139
02:35:11,440 --> 02:35:13,280
better be pretty bloody
passionate about it.

3140
02:35:13,520 --> 02:35:15,000
He's passionate about springs
and that's.

3141
02:35:15,000 --> 02:35:15,920
What?
And that's what would have

3142
02:35:15,920 --> 02:35:18,080
struck me about that
conversation and I would have

3143
02:35:18,080 --> 02:35:20,760
been there for sure.
Can you make me a set of springs

3144
02:35:20,760 --> 02:35:22,720
from my 84 SVI?
That would have been my

3145
02:35:22,720 --> 02:35:25,600
question.
Yeah, that's perfect.

3146
02:35:25,680 --> 02:35:28,000
But but no, it's you know what?
So like I said.

3147
02:35:28,640 --> 02:35:31,720
It's it's been 2 hours and I
think 2 1/2 hours actually

3148
02:35:31,720 --> 02:35:33,560
because we started over again at
one point.

3149
02:35:33,560 --> 02:35:36,760
But I know it's friggin it's
what is it?

3150
02:35:36,760 --> 02:35:40,320
It's 12:30 in the morning for
you too, so.

3151
02:35:40,520 --> 02:35:42,400
Yeah, yeah.
I'd, I'd, I'd stop watching.

3152
02:35:42,400 --> 02:35:43,920
I'd stop looking at I feel like
we can talk.

3153
02:35:43,920 --> 02:35:46,360
For another two hours, though,
like this is probably is.

3154
02:35:46,520 --> 02:35:48,840
I hate to say it, but it's been
way more interesting than I

3155
02:35:48,840 --> 02:35:50,880
expected.
Not that I expected you to be

3156
02:35:50,880 --> 02:35:53,960
boring, but I don't know enough
about, I don't know enough about

3157
02:35:53,960 --> 02:35:57,400
television and film lighting to
really have have good

3158
02:35:57,400 --> 02:35:59,400
conversations.
But you're a great

3159
02:35:59,400 --> 02:36:01,880
conversationalist, so.
So you've taught me a lot.

3160
02:36:01,880 --> 02:36:03,480
So.
Well, here's here's what I would

3161
02:36:03,480 --> 02:36:04,800
do.
You should get, you should get

3162
02:36:04,800 --> 02:36:06,920
Ben Wild back on the podcast.
Yeah.

3163
02:36:07,600 --> 02:36:10,560
And then you should talk to my
business partner, Sayda Devero,

3164
02:36:10,600 --> 02:36:13,800
who is actually a nominal
lighting drafts person in 728.

3165
02:36:14,320 --> 02:36:16,960
I'm sure Sarah is all over.
That because we do a podcast

3166
02:36:16,960 --> 02:36:22,000
called leading Ladies and it's
it's all about the women in the

3167
02:36:22,000 --> 02:36:23,960
industry and.
Yeah.

3168
02:36:24,720 --> 02:36:28,880
It's been great.
She's she's the host of it and I

3169
02:36:28,880 --> 02:36:32,520
think she's probably on her 8th
or 9th episode by now.

3170
02:36:32,520 --> 02:36:35,120
And she's done a great job and
had some amazing people.

3171
02:36:35,560 --> 02:36:38,760
So I'm sure she unfortunately,
when great women come forward

3172
02:36:38,760 --> 02:36:43,360
now, she usually nips them
before I ever get to even talk

3173
02:36:43,360 --> 02:36:45,240
to them or know about them or
anything.

3174
02:36:45,240 --> 02:36:48,600
She just grabs them and and I
lose that opportunity.

3175
02:36:48,600 --> 02:36:51,400
So sure.
But yeah, we'll definitely do

3176
02:36:51,400 --> 02:36:53,600
that.
So, but I mean, we should do

3177
02:36:53,600 --> 02:36:57,280
this again someday.
You know, I'd, I'd love to hear

3178
02:36:57,280 --> 02:37:02,040
a lot more and, and I'm sure
given the sort of path that your

3179
02:37:02,040 --> 02:37:06,040
life has taken, there's going to
be 1000 more stories, you know,

3180
02:37:06,040 --> 02:37:08,880
in the next year.
I mean, it's, it's definitely

3181
02:37:08,880 --> 02:37:12,760
been, it's been a great
adventure and I've had a lot of

3182
02:37:12,760 --> 02:37:15,120
fun and I've met some amazing
people.

3183
02:37:15,120 --> 02:37:17,960
And, and one of the things I've
loved about working in film is

3184
02:37:17,960 --> 02:37:21,400
you get to see shit that I look
like I've rigged lights inside

3185
02:37:21,400 --> 02:37:23,920
the wings of the Spruce Goose.
Not everyone can say they've

3186
02:37:23,920 --> 02:37:26,240
even been on the Spruce Goose,
but I've been it's wings.

3187
02:37:26,280 --> 02:37:29,160
There.
That is crazy, Yeah.

3188
02:37:29,480 --> 02:37:31,400
It's just, it's just fun, man.
It's been a trip.

3189
02:37:31,440 --> 02:37:34,240
And yeah, and again, you know,
like I said, people help me

3190
02:37:34,240 --> 02:37:35,600
along the way.
I want to help other people.

3191
02:37:35,600 --> 02:37:38,880
And that's kind of kind of one
of my motives about how it is.

3192
02:37:38,960 --> 02:37:40,800
That's what it's about.
That's what it's about, so.

3193
02:37:41,000 --> 02:37:42,720
And good luck.
With your another conversation

3194
02:37:42,720 --> 02:37:44,040
you can.
Help with that?

3195
02:37:44,040 --> 02:37:45,200
Yeah, Thank you.
Thank you.

3196
02:37:46,000 --> 02:37:47,280
It's right.
It's thanks so.

3197
02:37:47,280 --> 02:37:49,000
Much to be here for him.
Thanks, buddy.

3198
02:37:49,000 --> 02:37:50,320
Yeah, all right, buddy.