#223 - Marsha Stern talks about almost 50 years "in the biz"

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Well, hello and thank you for
joining me today on Geyses of

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Gear Episode #223.
Today's episode is brought to

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you by AVL Media Group, a new
sponsor to Geyses of Gear, your

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premier North American
distribution partner.

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AVL Media Group is one of the
leading distributors of

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professional audio, video and
lighting equipment in North

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America.
Initially established in 1996 by

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Founder and CEO Steven Kosters,
after seeing an opportunity to

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inject a sense of genuine
passion into the distribution

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process as an exclusive US
distributor for Midas Pro

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Consoles, Lab Group and
Amplifiers, Lake processors,

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Tanoi Installation speakers,
Clark Technic Signal Processing,

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Turbo Sound Loud speakers and
Aston Microphones, AVL are

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committed to developing long
term business relationships with

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their partners at every level by
providing outstanding pre and

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post sale service and support.
AVL Music Group is your premier

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North American distribution
partner and today's podcast is

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also brought to you by another
amazing new sponsor and partner

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to our show, someone who's been
on the podcast recently.

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Yes, I'm talking about the Event
Safety Alliance.

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The ESA focuses on the
knowledge, behaviors, and

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guidances that provide the
ability to plan and respond

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consistently, empowering event
professionals of all stripes to

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identify and mitigate risks.
ESA education, training,

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standards and guidance and the
thought leadership is helping to

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shape safety at live events for
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Become a member of the Event
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a safer, more prosperous future
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Advance your knowledge by
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eventsafetyalliance.org.
The

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So I'm super excited to have two
new sponsors on today's podcast.

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I don't think I've ever had two
brand new sponsors on a podcast.

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And although ESA is not really a
sponsor, we're we're supporting

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their organization, we're
listing them as a sponsor and

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we're very happy and proud to
represent the ESA on this

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podcast now.
So welcome aboard to the ESA and

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AVL.
You know, I've known Steven

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Kosters a long time.
I I come from the music industry

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and lighting, I guess my
earliest sort of introduction to

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the lighting business in Canada.
And I met Steven Kosters, you

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know, through those connections.
And when I started early on at

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Martin Professional or at
Trackman, Martin's distributor,

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I got to know Steven and but
most recently he started this

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AVL as a different business
model and it's a very unique

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business model, different than
most distributors.

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And why you ask, I'll tell you
why.

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So first of all, he works and
this isn't a pitch by the way.

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This is just something I was
interested in his model.

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So I asked him questions about
it because it's unique and

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different, but he works
alongside manufacturers, not as

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a distributor, but really as a
partner as part of their channel

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instead of a replacement for
their channel to market.

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I would compare it maybe to the
Amazon FBA model, Fulfillment by

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Amazon model.
So AVL gets involved not only in

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fulfillment but invoicing.
They actually own the accounts

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receivable, although the way
invoicing works, it's

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interesting.
For example, if you buy a Midas

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console from them, you'll get a
an invoice from with the Midas

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logo on it.
And although AVL takes

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responsibility for that account
receivable, you know you're

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being invoiced by a company that
at least appears to be Midas

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North America or whatever.
And so I you know that part of

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it.
The other thing is AVL carries

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the inventory, but they don't
actually own the inventory.

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The manufacturer owns the
inventory.

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AVL will get involved in
marketing, but the manufacturer

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and the brand itself is
responsible for the marketing

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and the cost of the marketing.
And AVL handles all the sales,

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shipping, support, as I said,
accounts receivable, warranty

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service.
And and so what's the upside to

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the manufacturer #1?
It's not like a distributed

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model where you know, your
branding gets maybe pushed back

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a little bit or watered down or
the relationship changes between

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the brand and the customer.
It appears to the customer that

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you're basically dealing
directly with the brand and of

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course they cut their margins.
So instead of call it X, it's X

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-, 10% or whatever.
So instead of having to split

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your margins as a manufacturer
with the distributor, the

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distributor's taking far less
because they're taking just

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basically for those services
that they're providing.

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And so, you know, I don't know
how it works from a standpoint

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of dollars and cents as far as
you know, is it more successful

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to the manufacturer?
Is it less successful?

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But when I learned about it from
Steven, I I was very intrigued

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and I thought it was a really
cool sort of evolution of the

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distribution model.
And it seems to be something

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that we'll see more of as we go
forward because I think in many

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industries, not just ours, in
the car business, in

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electronics, in musical
instruments, in almost every

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industry you can imagine, we've
gone more to AD, to C model, so

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direct to consumer model,
removing dealers, removing

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distributors.
And I know that all of my

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friends who are huge, you know
equipment dealers or gear

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dealers don't like when I say
this, but I'm not the one

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creating it.
It's it's the market that's

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creating it.
It's Amazon that's creating it.

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It's it's you know we're all
moving to a more direct to

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consumer model and you know it's
why one of the reasons Tesla's

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so successful because they don't
put a franchise between them and

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the customer.
They sell directly to the

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customer and they hear feedback
directly from the customer and

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they're working directly with
the customer.

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So I know some of the large,
especially the the American car

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manufacturers are fighting
against this by offering more

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and more services and trying to
to form a better relationship

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between the the customer and the
brand.

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But I think at the end of the
day this is a model that's gonna

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keep pushing to AD to C model
and and we're gonna see that

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more and more.
So I think AVL is an interesting

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model.
I'm not saying it's the best

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model, I'm not saying it's the
worst model.

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I'm just saying it's
interesting, it's different.

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And so again we welcome them as
a new sponsor.

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We welcome the ESA as a new
sponsor and we've got a couple

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more to announce as well.
So we're pretty excited.

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It's a good time right now,
early 2024.

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So today's guest has been a
friend of mine for probably 30

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years now, maybe even more than
30 years, but about 30 years,

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we'll call it, and someone who
everyone knows.

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You see her at trade shows, you
see her at the bar at trade

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shows, you see her at events,
you see her on jobs.

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She's been around our industry
as much as anyone I can think of

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and just an amazing person, a
very talented person.

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If you've ever been belly up to
a bar with her, she's a very

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passionate person.
She loves to have a good chat.

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So unfortunately today I'm
limited by time.

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Otherwise this would be a four
hour podcast, but you know, I'm

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going to, I'm going to read her
bio here for you, just so you

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know a little bit more.
So of course I'm talking about

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Marcia Stern, who's an
award-winning lighting designer,

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programmer, technician and
production manager, whose career

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began in New York City in the
music business and spans the New

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York City nightclub and special
events circuit from the late 70s

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through the mid 90s when she
began to pioneer using automated

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lighting and entertainment
technologies in architectural

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lighting design.
In April of 1999, Marcia

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Incorporated as Marcia Stern
Lighting Design and Consulting,

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Inc, actively working as an
independent designer, programmer

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and consultant.
She's got a lot of stories, so

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let's go ahead and get going.
Well, hello Marcia.

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Hi, Marcel, how are you today?
Isn't that weird?

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We were just talking, and then I
just pop in and say hello, but

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we were just talking.
So it's kind of bizarre.

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Like, are we on some kind of
weird, funky psychedelics or

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something?
Given the AI world we live in

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today, anything's possible,
Marcel.

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Yeah, you know what's funny
though, when you speak about

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psycho psychedelics?
Like, you know, it was bad back

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when we were doing bad things,
but nowadays people are doing

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this for health reasons, like
they're taking psilocybin and

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whatever they call it,
psychotropics or whatever.

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Well, yeah, and it's becoming so
casual, it's almost a little

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scary.
But that said, that said, when

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you talk about back in the day
and you know coming from that,

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that that world of New York City
nightlife debauchery that I came

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from and being now, thank you
very much, officially an old

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geezer, I I remember back when
ketamine first came to New York

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City clubs and the first thought
in this, I'm talking like 1981.

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82.
And now it is part of a

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psychological therapy, and
rightly so, because I remember

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my first impression of that drug
was it was like truth serum.

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Yeah, you.
Confronted yourself immediately

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and it was friggin truth serum.
And that's what people are using

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now is therapy and Bravo, It's a
good thing.

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It's the way to get to the
bottom of it.

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That's.
Yeah, you know, I listen to, I

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listen to a lot of podcasts, Joe
Rogan being one of them.

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And Joe Rogan talks about this.
What is it?

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DCTDTCDCP whatever, The one that
you go on this wacky trip where

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you really find yourself and
you're in like outer space

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almost, right.
And he, yeah, he talks about

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that one and there's another one
and you know, I'm just like,

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yeah, you know, that whole thing
passed me by.

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You know it, Yeah.
I mean, now, you know, a glass,

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a glass or two of wine.
And I'm pretty much in the bag,

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so I don't need all that extra
help to find.

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My Yeah, I hear you.
I miss Billy Joel and the the

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Grammys last felt loud on Sunday
night, 'cause I fell asleep at

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the end.
I pooped out around 10:30 just

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when we went.
On I'm going to a thing in Miami

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tonight and you know, I'm in
Palm Beach, so it's it's like a

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two hour drive to get to this
place.

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It's at the Perez Art Museum and
yeah, and it's it's like 250

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tech people and investors and
stuff like that.

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It'll be a cool event and I.
I actually heard a buzz about

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something that was going on down
there.

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Bravo to you.
It's amazing.

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I'm speaking at it.
I'm speaking at this thing

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tonight.
So, so anyways, so I'm part of

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the in crowd in this little
group who's doing it.

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It's for a a software product
called Rome that is their

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official launch tonight.
And I've been a user all the way

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through beta.
My company has and we love it.

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And so they invited me to speak.
And so then today the CEO of the

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company said, hey, Marcel, we
want you to be part of our core

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team at a dinner after the
event.

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And I went, oh, OK, what time's
that at?

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And he said we've got
reservations.

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I forget which restaurant but
incredible restaurant at 9:30

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and I'm going, OK, wait, 930.
Finish dinner at 12.

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I'll be home at like 2215 and
I'm like, you know what?

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I I really appreciate that and I
would love to do that, but I

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ain't going.
Sorry, I got to skip dinner.

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So.
And traffic down here has gotten

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whack a do.
I mean, we've known each other

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for a good long while and it was
way different when you live out

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West in Hollywood.
No, it's brutal.

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I honestly, I hate when I got to
go down to to Miami, but you

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know, this is a really, really
special event and it's going to

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be pretty cool.
So anyways, we got a lot to

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discuss so we can't chitchat so
much.

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We got to get into the the meat
of this.

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First I want to tell you that I
actually, when I had a snack

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that I kind of called lunch, but
I was in such a hurry I just

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kind of threw stuff down my
throat.

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I listened to about 1/2 hour of
your podcast, Heartbeat of the

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Dance Floor and episode 12 with
Paul Gregory, Ken Billington and

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Militello.
And I forget the other guy's

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name.
I don't know him.

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Yeah I don't.
I have no knowledge of him.

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So.
But the other three I know.

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And you know, one funny thing is
that it was the longest

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00:13:40,880 --> 00:13:44,400
introduction of guests that I've
ever heard on any podcast in my

225
00:13:44,400 --> 00:13:48,120
entire life.
Like you know, each guest got

226
00:13:48,120 --> 00:13:51,920
like a good five minute
introduction of everything and

227
00:13:52,040 --> 00:13:55,120
every award.
For brief resumes, I mean those

228
00:13:55,200 --> 00:13:57,200
guests have some very long
resumes.

229
00:13:57,840 --> 00:14:00,400
It was very thorough.
It was very thorough.

230
00:14:00,400 --> 00:14:03,040
I I'm sitting here like
shoveling lunch down and looking

231
00:14:03,040 --> 00:14:05,320
at my watch and going, come on
Marsha, get through the intro.

232
00:14:05,320 --> 00:14:09,160
I want to hear the stories.
But yeah, they got into, you

233
00:14:09,160 --> 00:14:12,560
know, Paul was talking about the
Saturday Night Fever dance floor

234
00:14:12,560 --> 00:14:17,920
and and yeah, I mean great bunch
of people and actually I don't

235
00:14:17,920 --> 00:14:21,840
recall, I remember listening to,
I think maybe your first or

236
00:14:21,840 --> 00:14:25,240
second one that you did, but
this one I watched on YouTube

237
00:14:25,240 --> 00:14:27,240
and I actually enjoyed it.
It was, it was fun.

238
00:14:27,240 --> 00:14:29,720
I hope you're still doing that.
I am.

239
00:14:29,720 --> 00:14:33,280
I'm working on one, but you know
being A1 girl band between the

240
00:14:33,280 --> 00:14:35,160
music stuff that I've been
doing.

241
00:14:35,160 --> 00:14:37,800
In fact, one of my music
productions just dropped today

242
00:14:37,800 --> 00:14:41,160
through a colleague that I've
been collaborating with, Sound

243
00:14:41,160 --> 00:14:43,480
Metaphors out of Berlin.
They're a record store and a

244
00:14:43,480 --> 00:14:46,480
streaming service and DJ and
whatnot.

245
00:14:46,480 --> 00:14:49,440
So that just dropped at about
12:30 this afternoon on their

246
00:14:49,440 --> 00:14:54,480
SoundCloud platform.
And I do have two so.

247
00:14:54,520 --> 00:14:57,720
That means, like micro pennies
in royalties, perhaps?

248
00:14:58,680 --> 00:15:03,360
There's no royalties involved.
Just like the rest of the music

249
00:15:03,360 --> 00:15:05,880
business.
Well, we're not selling

250
00:15:05,880 --> 00:15:08,040
anything, so there's no
royalties involved.

251
00:15:08,040 --> 00:15:10,640
That comes about when you're
actually exchanging hands

252
00:15:10,640 --> 00:15:13,120
financially, which I was at.
This point, I was just making a

253
00:15:13,120 --> 00:15:15,680
joke really, about how streaming
works these days.

254
00:15:15,680 --> 00:15:17,600
You know, God forbid there is
royalties.

255
00:15:17,600 --> 00:15:19,920
You know, it's you get like,
well, there are one one

256
00:15:20,040 --> 00:15:22,600
billionth of a penny every
listen or something.

257
00:15:23,120 --> 00:15:25,560
Well, it's it's sad.
It's gone with the wind.

258
00:15:25,600 --> 00:15:29,640
And you know, when I began my
life as an adult with career

259
00:15:29,640 --> 00:15:31,920
goals, it was to be a
songwriter.

260
00:15:32,080 --> 00:15:33,600
Yeah.
And producer.

261
00:15:33,600 --> 00:15:38,840
And as as a songwriter, those
royalties are important.

262
00:15:38,840 --> 00:15:41,480
So when I look at what goes on
now and what we just went

263
00:15:41,480 --> 00:15:44,160
through with the strike and all
the AI, there's righteous

264
00:15:44,160 --> 00:15:47,280
grounds for why some people are
in arms.

265
00:15:47,560 --> 00:15:51,000
I personally get pissed off when
I hear so much of the new music

266
00:15:51,000 --> 00:15:54,480
that is sampling.
Other artists work, and I always

267
00:15:54,480 --> 00:15:58,080
wonder if those artists are
getting acknowledged much less

268
00:15:58,400 --> 00:16:02,600
100th of a penny on each play or
whatever.

269
00:16:03,080 --> 00:16:04,800
And then everybody gets pissed
off.

270
00:16:05,040 --> 00:16:06,080
When?
When?

271
00:16:06,080 --> 00:16:08,480
Which streaming service?
Was it there recently?

272
00:16:10,720 --> 00:16:12,720
I'm not much of A social media
person.

273
00:16:12,720 --> 00:16:14,960
Tiktok didn't they pull?
Didn't Universal pull its

274
00:16:14,960 --> 00:16:16,160
catalog recently?
I didn't.

275
00:16:17,360 --> 00:16:21,280
I I believe Universal pulled its
catalog off of Tiktok recently.

276
00:16:21,280 --> 00:16:24,520
Everybody was bitching and
moaning, but nobody realizes

277
00:16:24,520 --> 00:16:28,520
that none of those artists are
even getting a thousandth of a

278
00:16:28,520 --> 00:16:31,400
penny.
Yeah, no, I I know lots and lots

279
00:16:31,640 --> 00:16:33,400
different types of artists than
you do.

280
00:16:33,400 --> 00:16:36,080
Like, I know, I know rock
musicians mostly.

281
00:16:36,480 --> 00:16:41,880
And the royalties are so small.
I mean, like you might get an $8

282
00:16:41,880 --> 00:16:44,480
check every month or a $10 check
every.

283
00:16:44,480 --> 00:16:46,160
Month or something.
Royalty is different than a

284
00:16:46,160 --> 00:16:48,400
songwriter.
No, I mean songwriter royalties.

285
00:16:48,720 --> 00:16:50,040
I'm, I'm talking about
Songwriter Royal.

286
00:16:50,400 --> 00:16:53,480
It's just not so much money
unless you're getting Taylor

287
00:16:53,480 --> 00:16:56,000
Swift types of plays, you know?
Like exactly.

288
00:16:56,240 --> 00:16:58,440
And more.
You can supplement it with

289
00:16:58,440 --> 00:17:02,240
something like a live career or
record sales or whatever.

290
00:17:02,240 --> 00:17:06,319
And yes, the entire music
business is way different from

291
00:17:06,319 --> 00:17:09,000
when I worked for record
companies and promoters and was

292
00:17:09,000 --> 00:17:13,040
a music producer in the 70s.
Yeah, you know, then radio

293
00:17:13,040 --> 00:17:15,839
pushed your charts.
Then everybody was in arms

294
00:17:16,240 --> 00:17:20,800
because you had DJs who were
playing music in clubs like

295
00:17:20,800 --> 00:17:28,640
Studio 54 or like Bonds or or
Ice Palace and they were

296
00:17:28,640 --> 00:17:31,120
selling.
They all of a sudden had a $2

297
00:17:31,120 --> 00:17:33,720
billion in record sales and they
didn't know where it came from

298
00:17:33,720 --> 00:17:38,520
and it wasn't the radio.
Then radio said, oh, let's have

299
00:17:38,520 --> 00:17:41,400
a disco radio station.
Yeah, yeah.

300
00:17:41,800 --> 00:17:46,000
No, it's it's it's bizarre like
one time my son and I got into

301
00:17:46,000 --> 00:17:49,680
this conversation about you know
how the music business is

302
00:17:49,680 --> 00:17:52,520
different today cuz you know his
mother is from the music

303
00:17:52,520 --> 00:17:55,000
industry and she complaints to
him about it often I guess.

304
00:17:55,440 --> 00:18:00,360
But we talked about it one day
and and you know he he was just

305
00:18:00,360 --> 00:18:05,480
blown away by as kids like he's
19 now but anyone under 30 years

306
00:18:05,480 --> 00:18:08,760
old when you talk to them about
different things like it's funny

307
00:18:08,760 --> 00:18:11,880
last night with with my
girlfriend Karen and her family

308
00:18:12,480 --> 00:18:17,360
it was one of her son's birthday
and we we played Family Feud

309
00:18:17,840 --> 00:18:19,480
like a board game.
Family Feud.

310
00:18:19,480 --> 00:18:25,440
Not not on the TV or anything.
And the questions like, you

311
00:18:25,440 --> 00:18:28,640
know, you know, name.
I forget what the question was,

312
00:18:28,640 --> 00:18:32,480
but something about a top sitcom
on television or whatever.

313
00:18:32,880 --> 00:18:36,480
And they were naming like or no
shows that you would watch in

314
00:18:36,480 --> 00:18:39,600
reruns.
And Jeremy is saying How I Met

315
00:18:39,600 --> 00:18:43,760
your mother, 'cause that, like
for his generation, they watched

316
00:18:43,760 --> 00:18:45,000
that over and over and over
again.

317
00:18:45,000 --> 00:18:46,960
He saw every episode, 10 times
or whatever.

318
00:18:47,360 --> 00:18:49,000
And you.
Know it was a little kid back

319
00:18:49,080 --> 00:18:49,800
then too?
Yeah.

320
00:18:49,880 --> 00:18:52,280
Right.
But it's those shows or newer

321
00:18:52,280 --> 00:18:54,480
that they're talking about.
And it was like all in the

322
00:18:54,480 --> 00:18:56,680
family.
I Love Lucy.

323
00:18:56,680 --> 00:18:59,600
And they're all going, what the
hell is that?

324
00:18:59,840 --> 00:19:02,800
What is all in the family?
And I'm like, oh, you have no

325
00:19:02,800 --> 00:19:05,480
idea.
And I grew up with Leave It to

326
00:19:05,480 --> 00:19:08,320
Beaver and Ozzy and Harry.
And if I really go back to some

327
00:19:08,320 --> 00:19:12,120
of my first impressions, Burns
and Allen and well, you.

328
00:19:12,320 --> 00:19:15,560
Know it's funny 'cause that was.
TV show The old The Lone Ranger.

329
00:19:15,560 --> 00:19:17,920
I used to love watching the.
Lone, you said leave it to

330
00:19:17,920 --> 00:19:20,320
Beaver.
But one of the questions was

331
00:19:20,320 --> 00:19:24,160
like famous moms, dead or alive,
and one of it was whatever Judy

332
00:19:24,160 --> 00:19:25,480
Cleaver.
Is that what her name was?

333
00:19:26,040 --> 00:19:26,840
June.
Cleaver.

334
00:19:26,840 --> 00:19:30,280
June Cleaver, right.
And they're like, who the hell

335
00:19:30,280 --> 00:19:32,920
is June Cleaver?
And I'm just laughing, right?

336
00:19:33,120 --> 00:19:38,280
They have no idea 'cause if
you're under 50 or 45, at least,

337
00:19:38,280 --> 00:19:41,480
you know, So I mean, it reminds
us how old we are.

338
00:19:42,000 --> 00:19:44,360
And with a name like that, they
probably associate it with a

339
00:19:44,360 --> 00:19:46,240
character in a Stephen King
novel.

340
00:19:46,440 --> 00:19:47,760
Something.
Yeah, Cleaver.

341
00:19:47,760 --> 00:19:50,840
Right, right.
Some kind of a slasher.

342
00:19:51,360 --> 00:19:55,880
Yeah.
No, it's funny, but so you know,

343
00:19:55,880 --> 00:19:58,680
getting into to your life, cuz
you know, it's funny.

344
00:19:58,680 --> 00:20:01,720
I looked at your bio and some of
this stuff I didn't even know,

345
00:20:01,720 --> 00:20:05,240
like I, you know, I know
basically that you got your

346
00:20:05,240 --> 00:20:07,520
start, I think, in the clubs,
right?

347
00:20:08,800 --> 00:20:12,400
Well, I got my start in the
music business, which did segue

348
00:20:12,400 --> 00:20:17,120
into the clubs and how it did
was kind of weird.

349
00:20:18,560 --> 00:20:22,520
But one day I ended up with a
job doing lights in the clubs

350
00:20:22,520 --> 00:20:26,040
because I knew the music and the
lighting guy had a summer gig he

351
00:20:26,040 --> 00:20:30,120
needed to go to and needed a
replacement and said literally,

352
00:20:30,120 --> 00:20:32,560
you know the music, if you can
figure out the controls, you

353
00:20:32,600 --> 00:20:34,920
have a job for the summer.
Well on the controls was

354
00:20:34,920 --> 00:20:37,600
probably like a two scene.
Hit this button then hit this.

355
00:20:37,680 --> 00:20:39,040
Button.
No, it was light lab.

356
00:20:39,040 --> 00:20:41,120
It was like 4 light lab, you
know.

357
00:20:41,120 --> 00:20:43,760
Yeah, yeah. 16 channel
controller and a couple of four

358
00:20:43,760 --> 00:20:45,800
channel controllers and a mirror
ball and this.

359
00:20:45,800 --> 00:20:47,360
And you had spinners and
rotators.

360
00:20:47,680 --> 00:20:51,400
It was at New York NY John
Addison and Maurice Brahms Club.

361
00:20:51,400 --> 00:20:54,400
It was just before they opened
Bonds and I.

362
00:20:54,400 --> 00:21:00,200
Then I moved to Bonds and then
anyway, that's I started back in

363
00:21:01,320 --> 00:21:05,200
1980.
Summer of 79 saw the end of my

364
00:21:05,200 --> 00:21:08,360
music production days because
the Joel Long sound kind of

365
00:21:08,360 --> 00:21:13,800
internally imploded due to a
bunch of what's that are not

366
00:21:13,800 --> 00:21:16,560
relevant to to today or the
story.

367
00:21:16,560 --> 00:21:20,840
But that said, you know, all the
albums on the top are the albums

368
00:21:20,840 --> 00:21:27,600
I produced back in back in 7879.
They're not all of them.

369
00:21:27,600 --> 00:21:28,920
They're just the ones that
charted.

370
00:21:30,760 --> 00:21:37,440
And the the company kind of
disbanded in 79.

371
00:21:37,440 --> 00:21:40,920
And in the fall of 79, I started
doing lights at a little club in

372
00:21:40,920 --> 00:21:42,720
the city.
And then in the spring I got

373
00:21:42,720 --> 00:21:45,400
this offer to fill in at New
York, NY.

374
00:21:45,400 --> 00:21:48,880
And there began my lighting
career in earnest, which went on

375
00:21:48,880 --> 00:21:52,000
until this day.
I just kind of, you know, and

376
00:21:52,000 --> 00:21:54,400
I've got to compliment you
before we go any further because

377
00:21:54,400 --> 00:21:58,520
when you started Happy Hour
during the pandemic, I would

378
00:21:58,560 --> 00:22:01,080
just say I can't thank you
enough.

379
00:22:01,720 --> 00:22:04,800
It really saved me and I think a
whole lot of people out there

380
00:22:04,800 --> 00:22:08,840
who all of a sudden found
themselves isolated and it was

381
00:22:08,840 --> 00:22:10,640
such a wonderful thing.
You had something to look

382
00:22:10,640 --> 00:22:12,080
forward to.
You had friends you could

383
00:22:12,080 --> 00:22:14,720
commiserate with.
It's a little early in the day

384
00:22:14,720 --> 00:22:17,320
for one.
I do have a glass of water for

385
00:22:17,320 --> 00:22:19,960
my dryness, but it was always a.
Wonderful.

386
00:22:19,960 --> 00:22:23,280
I have dribbles of a cup of
coffee called coffee here so.

387
00:22:23,480 --> 00:22:25,840
Thank you so very, very much for
that.

388
00:22:26,640 --> 00:22:31,040
Hey, thank you for filling in
all the dead air when nobody

389
00:22:31,040 --> 00:22:35,440
wanted to talk about anything.
Can always can always count on

390
00:22:35,440 --> 00:22:38,240
you to to take over the dead air
there, Marsha.

391
00:22:38,680 --> 00:22:39,480
No.
It was fun.

392
00:22:39,560 --> 00:22:44,600
It was it was timely and fun.
But I want to go back to so I

393
00:22:44,880 --> 00:22:48,240
this is going to show my
ignorance of the early stage of

394
00:22:48,240 --> 00:22:52,080
nightclubs in New York City.
But I think at some point, as I

395
00:22:52,080 --> 00:22:55,680
recall, you had some sort of an
attachment to Studio 54.

396
00:22:56,040 --> 00:22:57,720
Was that just as a customer or
did you work?

397
00:22:57,720 --> 00:23:00,000
There.
No, I did.

398
00:23:00,000 --> 00:23:04,920
I I had an attachment actually
through and this is kind of

399
00:23:06,240 --> 00:23:09,320
leading back to the pandemic.
A lot of people did a pivot.

400
00:23:09,320 --> 00:23:12,520
I think I made a circle because
that was in earnest a big turn

401
00:23:12,520 --> 00:23:14,960
that's bringing me back to music
and what I'm doing now.

402
00:23:15,440 --> 00:23:19,960
And the DJ Roy Thode, who I am
working earnestly on this legacy

403
00:23:19,960 --> 00:23:26,080
site with or for, he's dead.
So I guess it's for me and I.

404
00:23:26,120 --> 00:23:28,760
Hope it's not with him, because
that would be sorry.

405
00:23:29,160 --> 00:23:33,400
I hope it's not with him.
Well, it is spiritually, right?

406
00:23:33,640 --> 00:23:37,240
It's spiritually.
I feel Roy and have on right

407
00:23:37,240 --> 00:23:38,960
there ever since the day he
died.

408
00:23:38,960 --> 00:23:42,160
That said, I didn't.
Hear So he was the DJ he was the

409
00:23:42,160 --> 00:23:47,360
DJ at he was.
One of the original DJs at 54.

410
00:23:47,360 --> 00:23:51,000
There's another person whose
podcast is in the editing room

411
00:23:51,000 --> 00:23:57,240
still, who preceded Roy as an
original hire at Studio 54,

412
00:23:57,240 --> 00:23:59,760
who's a dear friend of mine as
well, and I have many of his

413
00:23:59,760 --> 00:24:02,640
archives.
But all this music that I'm

414
00:24:04,800 --> 00:24:08,160
regurgitating, for lack of a
better term, our old analogue

415
00:24:08,160 --> 00:24:12,440
tapes Roy recorded I have over
well over 100 of the.

416
00:24:12,440 --> 00:24:13,800
Real.
So let me ask you something,

417
00:24:13,840 --> 00:24:15,280
these DJ.
Archives.

418
00:24:15,320 --> 00:24:18,280
So back to your question, I'm
sorry to be breathy, because you

419
00:24:18,280 --> 00:24:19,240
know, no.
No, no, it's OK.

420
00:24:19,240 --> 00:24:20,600
I want to ask you another
question though.

421
00:24:21,160 --> 00:24:22,840
The DJs.
Let me answer the first one.

422
00:24:22,840 --> 00:24:27,480
My Studio 54 had more to do with
him and music and my record

423
00:24:27,480 --> 00:24:30,960
promotion days.
I was recognized back then as a

424
00:24:30,960 --> 00:24:33,840
record company Rep, or a
publicist, or a producer, or

425
00:24:33,840 --> 00:24:36,840
someone who worked with the
Village People, or the Ritchie

426
00:24:36,840 --> 00:24:41,920
family, or for Ariola Records,
or XY and Z, as well as being

427
00:24:41,920 --> 00:24:45,040
one of Roy's inner circle and
coming in with him early or

428
00:24:45,040 --> 00:24:46,680
whatever.
And one night I did work there.

429
00:24:46,680 --> 00:24:48,440
I worked the coat check.
Huh.

430
00:24:49,200 --> 00:24:51,480
One night it was probably.
A1 Night.

431
00:24:51,480 --> 00:24:52,760
Probably a memorable night
though.

432
00:24:52,760 --> 00:24:55,400
Marsha, if you're here, I need
help in the coat check.

433
00:24:55,400 --> 00:24:56,680
Are you mine?
I said no.

434
00:24:56,680 --> 00:24:58,320
Why not?
Was it memorable?

435
00:24:59,120 --> 00:25:02,920
It was, and I made a bundle in
tips way more than the paycheck.

436
00:25:03,080 --> 00:25:05,400
Who's the most famous person's
coat that you grabbed?

437
00:25:05,400 --> 00:25:12,560
Do you remember?
No, but remember Brian Keith

438
00:25:12,560 --> 00:25:16,000
from I think it was was that not
All in the family, it was the

439
00:25:16,400 --> 00:25:20,840
little kids show, TV show going
back to our childhood, I think

440
00:25:20,840 --> 00:25:22,640
Brian Keith.
I don't.

441
00:25:22,960 --> 00:25:25,240
Know was the father or the
adoptive father.

442
00:25:25,760 --> 00:25:29,280
You know, I've had a few passes
made by a couple of actors and

443
00:25:29,920 --> 00:25:32,640
that sort of stuff.
Liza Minnelli picked her up a

444
00:25:32,640 --> 00:25:38,000
couple of times off the
staircase, you know, oddball

445
00:25:38,040 --> 00:25:41,120
encounters.
Actually, a dear friend of mine

446
00:25:41,120 --> 00:25:43,320
who I used to dance and party
with a lot.

447
00:25:44,200 --> 00:25:48,000
Esther Comitari at the time she
was a very famous model, did a

448
00:25:48,000 --> 00:25:50,720
lot of Vogue and Terry Muegler
and runway stuff.

449
00:25:51,920 --> 00:25:56,320
She is indeed an in earnest now,
the queen of Burundi.

450
00:25:56,320 --> 00:25:58,880
At that time her parents were
alive and she is a born

451
00:25:58,880 --> 00:26:02,960
Princess.
She is Queen Princess Esther

452
00:26:02,960 --> 00:26:04,680
Comitari.
Wow.

453
00:26:05,160 --> 00:26:08,880
So she might be the most famous
person, not that I ever worked

454
00:26:08,880 --> 00:26:10,840
with, but that I was friends
with.

455
00:26:11,120 --> 00:26:13,240
So did you spend a lot of time
at 54?

456
00:26:13,240 --> 00:26:17,480
Like, were you a regular?
Yeah, you could say.

457
00:26:17,480 --> 00:26:19,640
You could say so.
There was a circuit of clubs

458
00:26:19,640 --> 00:26:21,760
that you did on various nights
of the week.

459
00:26:22,080 --> 00:26:27,560
Paradise Garage typically was a
Friday night either depending on

460
00:26:27,560 --> 00:26:30,840
the time of year you were in the
city or you were on Fire Island.

461
00:26:31,320 --> 00:26:38,880
So you might have done Studio 54
on a Thursday, Paradise Garage

462
00:26:38,880 --> 00:26:41,320
on a Friday, or 12 W on a
Friday.

463
00:26:41,320 --> 00:26:45,680
You had in the winter time 12 W
Flamingo or Paradise Garage of

464
00:26:45,680 --> 00:26:47,360
the private clubs to choose
from.

465
00:26:47,720 --> 00:26:50,680
Early when I first moved to the
city there was a place open

466
00:26:50,680 --> 00:26:53,880
called the Loft.
It preceded Paradise Garage by a

467
00:26:53,880 --> 00:26:57,320
guy named David Mancuso and if
you go back in some of the disco

468
00:26:57,320 --> 00:27:04,360
archives, he is a notable and I
was there a few times so clubs

469
00:27:04,400 --> 00:27:11,280
were a lot more the drill I.
Would say, yeah, but 54, was it

470
00:27:11,520 --> 00:27:13,880
like, did you know it was
something then?

471
00:27:13,880 --> 00:27:17,240
Or like did that notoriety
happen later?

472
00:27:17,480 --> 00:27:19,800
Like, in other words, no.
You you knew it.

473
00:27:19,800 --> 00:27:21,280
You know.
When it was happening, it was

474
00:27:21,280 --> 00:27:22,600
like a really big.
Deal.

475
00:27:23,160 --> 00:27:30,240
When it opened, it was kind of
the 1st of its kind in being a

476
00:27:30,240 --> 00:27:32,960
mega club.
The clubs that I went to prior

477
00:27:32,960 --> 00:27:36,720
to that were a lot more mundane,
a lot more sedate.

478
00:27:36,720 --> 00:27:40,240
La Mouche was very popular.
It was a private club, was down

479
00:27:40,240 --> 00:27:44,720
in Chelsea, but again, you're
talking smaller. 54 went out of

480
00:27:44,720 --> 00:27:47,440
its way to garner publicity.
Yeah.

481
00:27:48,280 --> 00:27:53,120
And that was something that
regimes used to do.

482
00:27:53,120 --> 00:27:56,400
So I would say when I moved to
the city and started going out

483
00:27:56,400 --> 00:28:02,200
in 1977, the club for
celebrities was Regimes and then

484
00:28:02,200 --> 00:28:07,160
54 opened in April of 77, and I
had just moved to New York in

485
00:28:07,160 --> 00:28:09,880
September of 76.
So yeah, I was right there at

486
00:28:09,880 --> 00:28:12,760
the beginning and the thick of
it and then boom.

487
00:28:12,760 --> 00:28:17,560
And then after that Xenon opened
and this opened and that opened

488
00:28:17,680 --> 00:28:20,920
and then so.
To get into these places, did

489
00:28:20,960 --> 00:28:23,720
did you have to know somebody to
get into these places?

490
00:28:23,720 --> 00:28:26,960
Like were you special to be able
to get in or were you like held

491
00:28:26,960 --> 00:28:29,320
behind velvet ropes or how did
that was that?

492
00:28:29,600 --> 00:28:31,880
Was there like a hierarchy or
something?

493
00:28:32,680 --> 00:28:36,640
Hard to answer that because so
many of the times I was over

494
00:28:36,640 --> 00:28:39,560
there on business or on a list
and I still.

495
00:28:39,640 --> 00:28:40,560
Knew me?
Right.

496
00:28:40,560 --> 00:28:45,680
However, I will say this, some
clubs imitated 54 that had the

497
00:28:45,680 --> 00:28:48,800
stanchions in the list and I
could be there on a list and

498
00:28:49,840 --> 00:28:53,120
damn, both Steve and Mark knew
who I was in some days, hi,

499
00:28:53,120 --> 00:28:55,040
Marsha.
And other days they would just

500
00:28:55,040 --> 00:28:56,960
look right past me.
That's funny, you know?

501
00:28:56,960 --> 00:28:59,560
And it And yeah, and it would,
but that was the thing and that

502
00:28:59,560 --> 00:29:01,800
was the thing that 54 came known
for.

503
00:29:02,320 --> 00:29:04,520
So of course, other clubs
imitated it.

504
00:29:05,160 --> 00:29:07,600
You know.
But most places you'd go and

505
00:29:07,600 --> 00:29:09,560
there's a guy at the door that
they knew you.

506
00:29:09,560 --> 00:29:13,280
If you were a regular, yeah.
Or if it was a membership club,

507
00:29:13,360 --> 00:29:14,840
you know, you had your
credentials.

508
00:29:14,840 --> 00:29:16,880
Or you'd go there and you'd say
I'm on the list.

509
00:29:17,120 --> 00:29:22,120
Yeah, you know, when I, when I
first moved to the US and was

510
00:29:22,120 --> 00:29:25,760
working with Martin at the time
or their distributor Trackman, I

511
00:29:25,760 --> 00:29:28,640
remember my first trip to New
York and one of the dealers in

512
00:29:28,640 --> 00:29:32,640
New York, the lighting dealers,
not drug dealers, took me out,

513
00:29:33,080 --> 00:29:36,920
took me out to a club one night
and we had to go to the door

514
00:29:36,920 --> 00:29:39,560
guy, you know, the infamous door
guy or whatever.

515
00:29:39,840 --> 00:29:43,240
And here's me, this dumb
Canadian.

516
00:29:43,240 --> 00:29:45,880
No nothing.
Never been exposed to anything

517
00:29:45,880 --> 00:29:49,480
weird at all cuz I'm from a
little city in Canada and

518
00:29:49,760 --> 00:29:54,240
there's this like 7 foot tall
tranny dude guy girl.

519
00:29:54,480 --> 00:29:58,280
I don't remember how you call
it, but it's a male who looks

520
00:29:58,280 --> 00:30:04,080
like a very tall very big female
And and you know, yes, you know,

521
00:30:04,080 --> 00:30:07,200
what do you want?
And and like just really like,

522
00:30:07,200 --> 00:30:11,200
you know you don't belong here.
Mr. Kind of an attitude.

523
00:30:11,200 --> 00:30:12,680
Right.
And I was just like I was in

524
00:30:12,680 --> 00:30:15,240
fear like I didn't know what to
do, right.

525
00:30:15,240 --> 00:30:20,000
Like Oh my God, I don't know.
I went to all of them.

526
00:30:20,000 --> 00:30:25,320
Like what year this would have
been 91 or early 92 maybe?

527
00:30:26,080 --> 00:30:29,360
I might have been Sound Factory.
I've been to Sound Factory a few

528
00:30:29,360 --> 00:30:31,560
times so it wouldn't have been
Sound Factory cuz I would have

529
00:30:31,560 --> 00:30:34,840
remembered that cuz I went there
with Derek Vasquez and.

530
00:30:35,280 --> 00:30:36,960
Those guys.
Right, Yeah.

531
00:30:37,040 --> 00:30:42,040
Yeah, Derek and I have worked
together since the old days.

532
00:30:42,040 --> 00:30:46,640
Yeah, in fact I have a few funny
old Dinosaur Geezer show and

533
00:30:46,640 --> 00:30:49,280
tell things here, but what I
didn't bring out of the old pin

534
00:30:49,280 --> 00:30:53,080
spots I have in the back that
are from Derek Custom lighting

535
00:30:53,840 --> 00:30:56,120
we did because we did special
events together.

536
00:30:56,560 --> 00:31:01,680
Yeah, well, I didn't meet most
of those guys until because when

537
00:31:01,680 --> 00:31:03,400
I was with Martin, we were the
dorks.

538
00:31:03,400 --> 00:31:06,840
Like we weren't the cool people
at all at at the big clubs or

539
00:31:06,840 --> 00:31:08,760
anything.
It was, it was high end at the

540
00:31:08,760 --> 00:31:11,080
time.
Well, it wasn't even high end

541
00:31:11,080 --> 00:31:14,600
yet in the early 90s.
High end sort of mid 90s.

542
00:31:14,600 --> 00:31:17,520
Got to be the real in thing,
right, with the intelibeams and

543
00:31:17,520 --> 00:31:21,760
all that stuff, but.
They were around the 80s

544
00:31:21,760 --> 00:31:23,440
intelibeams.
No.

545
00:31:24,160 --> 00:31:27,040
Yeah, I surely was.
Well, yeah, Intellibeams, I

546
00:31:27,040 --> 00:31:29,280
would say early 90s, ninety two,
I think.

547
00:31:29,640 --> 00:31:32,600
Intellibeam is a mirrored light.
We'll have to, we'll have to

548
00:31:32,600 --> 00:31:35,040
come back to this.
We'll have to come back to this.

549
00:31:35,040 --> 00:31:40,960
I think the Intellibeam would be
about 92 or maybe even 9394 like

550
00:31:40,960 --> 00:31:44,480
it was a bit later.
Whatever the fixture was, there

551
00:31:44,520 --> 00:31:46,240
were mirrored.
Golden scans.

552
00:31:46,280 --> 00:31:50,080
In the clubs at the time, yeah.
And the only and and I know this

553
00:31:50,080 --> 00:31:53,360
because I was a barrel light
snob, I was a Vera light snob

554
00:31:53,360 --> 00:31:58,400
and I stopped working in the
clubs in like 9091.

555
00:31:58,400 --> 00:32:02,160
It was that that year was the
end of my club days and went

556
00:32:02,160 --> 00:32:06,240
earnest into special events
until the mid 90s and I was a

557
00:32:06,240 --> 00:32:08,440
Vera light head.
Yeah, well, the.

558
00:32:08,760 --> 00:32:11,320
Snobbery.
The earliest we had a head that

559
00:32:11,320 --> 00:32:14,880
moved and everybody else had
mirrored lights, wiggle lights,

560
00:32:14,880 --> 00:32:16,760
and that's all that was around.
And it was.

561
00:32:16,800 --> 00:32:20,440
We couldn't buy them.
Yeah, Miami, Martin proliferated

562
00:32:20,440 --> 00:32:24,000
the market absolutely, Marcel,
right through the mid 90s.

563
00:32:24,000 --> 00:32:28,360
Yeah, In the earliest days it
was Comar with the robots and

564
00:32:28,360 --> 00:32:32,320
Clay Paki with the golden scans
and super scans and all of that

565
00:32:32,320 --> 00:32:34,760
stuff that were sort of the
earliest lights.

566
00:32:34,760 --> 00:32:36,240
So it was probably Clay Paki
stuff.

567
00:32:36,240 --> 00:32:39,400
I would guess that you're
talking about that.

568
00:32:39,400 --> 00:32:41,400
Was so pre day?
Yeah, if it had a mirror, I

569
00:32:41,520 --> 00:32:44,360
wasn't interested.
Yeah, sorry.

570
00:32:45,000 --> 00:32:47,800
Yeah, yeah, it doesn't matter.
Didn't change my life.

571
00:32:47,880 --> 00:32:48,680
I did.
OK.

572
00:32:48,920 --> 00:32:53,560
No, we met.
We met when you were at Martin

573
00:32:53,560 --> 00:33:00,120
in Florida, Martin Tracoman way
back and it was in the 90s and I

574
00:33:00,120 --> 00:33:03,360
think it was in the mid to late
90s because it was around the

575
00:33:03,360 --> 00:33:06,880
time that I did the bridge into
architectural lighting.

576
00:33:07,560 --> 00:33:13,320
I believe that it was when I was
at high end and I worked with

577
00:33:13,320 --> 00:33:16,800
you on one of the FAO Schwartz
jobs, if you.

578
00:33:16,800 --> 00:33:19,520
Worked on FAO then.
It definitely was, which was.

579
00:33:19,560 --> 00:33:24,600
Right around that time, it was.
9097 probably. 9697 cause the

580
00:33:24,680 --> 00:33:26,960
club debuted.
In fact, I was just wearing.

581
00:33:27,160 --> 00:33:30,480
Funny you should say that.
I was just wearing the T the

582
00:33:30,520 --> 00:33:32,720
other day.
The T-shirt from the opening,

583
00:33:32,720 --> 00:33:37,720
the preview of the the FAO
Schwarz.

584
00:33:38,120 --> 00:33:40,440
Yeah.
Yeah, no, that was a cool job.

585
00:33:40,440 --> 00:33:45,080
Those the, you know, honestly,
like you probably deserve some

586
00:33:45,080 --> 00:33:49,800
credit for being one of the, at
least from my knowledge, one of

587
00:33:49,800 --> 00:33:54,760
the earliest designers to
incorporate automated lighting

588
00:33:54,760 --> 00:33:58,960
into like architectural retail
environments.

589
00:33:59,240 --> 00:34:02,520
And you know, I I remember
working with you on NBAFAO

590
00:34:02,520 --> 00:34:06,320
Schwarz probably.
One of the luckiest because for

591
00:34:06,320 --> 00:34:11,080
FAO Schwarz I was stupid enough
to use a beta version of the

592
00:34:11,159 --> 00:34:16,480
high end colors and and nobody
uses beta versions in a

593
00:34:16,480 --> 00:34:19,400
permanent installation.
But somebody who is that naive

594
00:34:19,760 --> 00:34:23,440
and I was really lucky and I
will commend high end, we had an

595
00:34:23,440 --> 00:34:27,920
incredible support system and
FAO Schwarz also had an

596
00:34:27,920 --> 00:34:30,280
incredible technical team
because of all the other

597
00:34:30,280 --> 00:34:32,639
automation and technology that
was there.

598
00:34:32,960 --> 00:34:37,239
So we were able to take their
automation guy, send him down to

599
00:34:37,239 --> 00:34:41,360
Austin, train him and get him
set so that he could handle a

600
00:34:41,360 --> 00:34:45,320
lot of the regular maintenance
on the high end system and and

601
00:34:46,120 --> 00:34:48,360
you know, so it was a great team
effort.

602
00:34:48,360 --> 00:34:52,840
I must say our Yeah, and kudos
to high end for taking the

603
00:34:52,840 --> 00:34:55,639
gamble with me, because no one
else had ever done that before,

604
00:34:55,679 --> 00:34:56,800
so.
No, I mean, it was.

605
00:34:56,840 --> 00:35:00,280
A cool project I.
I think I got involved a little

606
00:35:00,280 --> 00:35:02,960
later.
Like I I think you were already

607
00:35:02,960 --> 00:35:06,040
underway when I started with
High end and and I kind of got

608
00:35:06,040 --> 00:35:10,080
thrown into the loop and it was
a really cool project.

609
00:35:10,080 --> 00:35:13,000
And I just remember, wow, you
know, I've never seen anybody

610
00:35:13,000 --> 00:35:15,240
use all these moving lights on a
job like this.

611
00:35:15,240 --> 00:35:19,080
And when you speak of being
crazy to use beta stuff at that

612
00:35:19,080 --> 00:35:22,280
time everything was beta stuff.
At that time.

613
00:35:22,280 --> 00:35:26,640
We were moving so fast and
creating things so quickly that

614
00:35:26,640 --> 00:35:30,520
almost every light, like you
know, I talked to to lighting

615
00:35:30,520 --> 00:35:32,520
people now like the kids these
days.

616
00:35:33,200 --> 00:35:37,040
Everything is so good right now.
Like even whether it's American

617
00:35:37,040 --> 00:35:42,480
DJ or it's, you know, High End
or Robe or Ayrton or Chauvet,

618
00:35:42,760 --> 00:35:45,560
all of it is really, really good
stuff right now.

619
00:35:46,120 --> 00:35:51,040
And back then it wasn't, I mean
even production, production

620
00:35:51,040 --> 00:35:53,880
stuff that we were selling
especially at Martin, but high

621
00:35:53,880 --> 00:35:57,320
end as well was buggy.
And you know, I don't know if

622
00:35:57,320 --> 00:36:01,600
you remember the the days at
high end when when there was

623
00:36:01,600 --> 00:36:04,680
like, I don't remember the exact
rule, but I think it was when

624
00:36:04,680 --> 00:36:08,760
there was either a problem with
a fixture beyond a certain

625
00:36:08,880 --> 00:36:13,400
whatever scope or the same
problem happened more than a few

626
00:36:13,400 --> 00:36:16,480
times or whatever.
Richard Bellevue would close the

627
00:36:16,480 --> 00:36:18,320
entire production of that
fixture.

628
00:36:18,320 --> 00:36:21,120
He'd shut down production until
they found a fix for it.

629
00:36:21,440 --> 00:36:23,760
And you've?
Got You could be a little

630
00:36:23,760 --> 00:36:26,880
obsessive when it came to that
and and and you're right it was

631
00:36:26,920 --> 00:36:27,920
new, but that was.
Cool.

632
00:36:28,040 --> 00:36:30,000
He really knew what they were
doing.

633
00:36:30,200 --> 00:36:34,760
Yeah, yeah, no, it was it, it
was it was a fun time.

634
00:36:34,760 --> 00:36:39,920
Like, I'm I'm so proud and happy
to have been there at the

635
00:36:39,920 --> 00:36:43,480
forefront of for sale automated
lighting.

636
00:36:43,480 --> 00:36:47,880
You know, like I wasn't at the
forefront of Vera Light, but the

637
00:36:47,880 --> 00:36:50,040
stuff that was actually being
sold, I was.

638
00:36:50,040 --> 00:36:53,520
I was one of the early guys in
involved in that industry with

639
00:36:53,520 --> 00:36:56,280
Martin at the time.
And it was fun.

640
00:36:56,680 --> 00:37:01,240
It was fun.
And and I too, share gratitude.

641
00:37:01,440 --> 00:37:06,320
And I'm grateful that I was
lucky enough to be at the right

642
00:37:06,320 --> 00:37:11,760
place at the right time and with
enough aptitude and talent to

643
00:37:11,760 --> 00:37:14,840
make something out of it.
Because certainly being thrown

644
00:37:14,840 --> 00:37:16,840
in the pot doesn't mean you're
going to be able to swim in the

645
00:37:16,840 --> 00:37:18,680
water.
Yeah, well, you know what

646
00:37:18,680 --> 00:37:20,400
though?
You're it's funny you say at the

647
00:37:20,400 --> 00:37:23,880
right place at the right time.
If I was to define your career,

648
00:37:24,160 --> 00:37:27,280
you know, to me, you're Marsha
at the right place at the right

649
00:37:27,280 --> 00:37:31,000
time, Stern, because you've been
at the right place at the right

650
00:37:31,000 --> 00:37:33,080
time about 100 times in your
career.

651
00:37:33,080 --> 00:37:36,480
You, you keep falling backwards
into these incredible

652
00:37:36,480 --> 00:37:38,240
opportunities.
And I mean, you're earning your

653
00:37:38,240 --> 00:37:41,440
way in.
You're like nobody works a trade

654
00:37:41,440 --> 00:37:43,320
show like Marsha works a trade
show.

655
00:37:43,320 --> 00:37:47,200
You know, you talk to everybody.
You talk to everybody at length.

656
00:37:47,440 --> 00:37:51,800
You know you you are out from
the morning till the night and

657
00:37:51,800 --> 00:37:54,960
and you hit 1000 conversations
in between those times.

658
00:37:55,480 --> 00:37:59,480
And that's what you got to do to
to forge ahead in this industry

659
00:37:59,480 --> 00:38:03,080
and to create A to create a life
for yourself in this industry.

660
00:38:03,080 --> 00:38:05,400
Otherwise, you know you're not
employed for very long.

661
00:38:06,280 --> 00:38:11,200
Well, and you know, as someone
who was, is not at the trade

662
00:38:11,200 --> 00:38:16,520
show seeking employment, but
rather going there to to be a

663
00:38:16,520 --> 00:38:21,960
part of something that's bigger
than me, like one of the

664
00:38:21,960 --> 00:38:25,400
proudest achievements that I've
ever done with you, Mr.

665
00:38:25,400 --> 00:38:27,600
Fairbairn, I have a little show
and tell.

666
00:38:28,240 --> 00:38:29,280
Are we make?
Sense.

667
00:38:29,680 --> 00:38:33,440
I mean, that was amazing.
That was a cohesiveness.

668
00:38:33,440 --> 00:38:37,520
That was, you know, as spiritual
as it was.

669
00:38:37,920 --> 00:38:42,240
As it was exuberant, I mean it
just gave you an energy and and

670
00:38:42,240 --> 00:38:46,520
we all sprang into and it showed
me what a community is and was

671
00:38:46,520 --> 00:38:48,400
and does and that's so much of
entertainment.

672
00:38:48,960 --> 00:38:52,240
And I don't say this in a
negative way, I just say this as

673
00:38:52,280 --> 00:38:56,240
an observer.
I spent a good number of years

674
00:38:56,240 --> 00:38:58,600
working in the entertainment
nightclub world.

675
00:38:58,840 --> 00:39:02,000
I transitioned to the
architectural world based on the

676
00:39:02,000 --> 00:39:06,240
luck I had being one of the few
people in 95 that had extensive

677
00:39:06,240 --> 00:39:12,680
experience both running,
operating, designing and fixing

678
00:39:12,720 --> 00:39:15,440
Vera lights because I was
trained and I used to do the

679
00:39:15,440 --> 00:39:21,680
repair at Palladium also after
Dexter left to know that when we

680
00:39:21,680 --> 00:39:24,600
met and I was starting in
architecture, to be at the cusp

681
00:39:24,640 --> 00:39:29,240
of something like that was just
amazing and to be vertical and

682
00:39:29,240 --> 00:39:32,680
lucid now to be able to talk.
About it is pretty cool.

683
00:39:32,680 --> 00:39:35,560
Too and in some ways it's kind
of led into this whole

684
00:39:35,560 --> 00:39:40,360
historical path that I'm on,
which is recent and it brought

685
00:39:40,360 --> 00:39:44,000
about a lot and the pandemic
kind of made me re evaluate.

686
00:39:44,000 --> 00:39:47,800
So when I look at the historical
perspective, when I look at the

687
00:39:47,800 --> 00:39:52,400
work, the the projections, now
it's more about the contacts,

688
00:39:52,400 --> 00:39:57,960
the the the comrade or ship that
I have with the various people

689
00:39:57,960 --> 00:39:59,800
that I love to see.
I'm sorry I missed this,

690
00:39:59,880 --> 00:40:01,160
Giselle.
The look like a.

691
00:40:01,160 --> 00:40:02,840
No, I didn't go either.
I didn't go either.

692
00:40:02,840 --> 00:40:05,760
My first one in God knows I
don't even remember.

693
00:40:06,360 --> 00:40:08,000
Yeah, it looked like we missed
the good one, kiddo.

694
00:40:08,040 --> 00:40:11,160
You know, you know going back
again to the sort of beginning

695
00:40:11,160 --> 00:40:16,520
of time with with whether it's
Studio 54 or any of these other

696
00:40:16,920 --> 00:40:21,480
you know, New York, NY or or
Bond or whatever The Saint, I

697
00:40:21,480 --> 00:40:26,760
know you were there as well.
First, females who run lights

698
00:40:26,760 --> 00:40:30,480
and be on the marquee.
Interesting, cool.

699
00:40:30,880 --> 00:40:35,840
But going back so one thing it
seems to me at least, and you

700
00:40:35,840 --> 00:40:39,640
can correct me if I'm way wrong
on this, but people who worked

701
00:40:39,760 --> 00:40:44,080
either in sound or lighting or
design at those early clubs went

702
00:40:44,080 --> 00:40:46,520
on to incredible careers in our
industry.

703
00:40:46,840 --> 00:40:51,040
And I'm guessing DJs probably
went on to become producers of

704
00:40:51,040 --> 00:40:55,680
of incredible, you know, hit
albums or something, you know,

705
00:40:55,680 --> 00:41:00,440
but even like Paul Gregory and
and Billington and Zay Moore and

706
00:41:00,800 --> 00:41:02,880
some of these guys who were
involved in some of those early

707
00:41:02,880 --> 00:41:05,960
projects.
Well, Billington already had a

708
00:41:05,960 --> 00:41:10,240
very successful Broadway career
and was hired by Jimmy Mary, who

709
00:41:10,240 --> 00:41:14,520
opened The Red Parrot to do a
Broadway lighting set up.

710
00:41:14,520 --> 00:41:20,640
We had we were the first disco,
if you will, in Manhattan in

711
00:41:20,640 --> 00:41:23,080
anywhere in the world that I
know of that had a computerized

712
00:41:23,080 --> 00:41:26,240
lighting system.
We who it opened, we the Red

713
00:41:26,240 --> 00:41:27,880
Parrot.
Oh, so you were there as?

714
00:41:28,160 --> 00:41:31,840
Well, I worked there as well,
but when it opened in I think

715
00:41:31,840 --> 00:41:37,080
New Year's Eve of 1980, if I'm
not mistaken, it, it opened with

716
00:41:37,080 --> 00:41:40,480
a live sound stage.
And they also had a swing band

717
00:41:40,480 --> 00:41:42,160
orchestra, the Red Parrot
Orchestra.

718
00:41:43,160 --> 00:41:47,720
And so they would have two show,
two or three shows with the Red

719
00:41:47,720 --> 00:41:52,720
Parrot orchestra doing swing
music in between, the disco DJ

720
00:41:52,720 --> 00:41:56,800
playing the hits of the day.
And we had video screens.

721
00:41:57,280 --> 00:42:00,560
It was a Kliegel Brothers,
Kliegel Gold Performer 2.

722
00:42:00,560 --> 00:42:04,200
That was our lighting console.
We had full sound, audio,

723
00:42:04,200 --> 00:42:06,640
soundstage.
It was amazing.

724
00:42:06,640 --> 00:42:10,600
And Ken came in, Ken and Jason
excuse me, Cantro is came in as

725
00:42:10,600 --> 00:42:14,520
Broadway designers and put a
completely new twist on it.

726
00:42:14,520 --> 00:42:19,360
Paul Gregory, on the other hand,
designed and fabricated through

727
00:42:19,360 --> 00:42:25,400
his company at the Time Light
Lab, the dance floor for the

728
00:42:25,400 --> 00:42:28,120
movie Saturday Night Fever,
which was 77.

729
00:42:28,120 --> 00:42:31,120
So that was three years prior.
And if if people want to hear

730
00:42:31,120 --> 00:42:34,120
about that, they can go to your
heartbeat of the dance or

731
00:42:34,360 --> 00:42:37,720
podcast episode 12 that I was
just listening to.

732
00:42:38,200 --> 00:42:39,640
He was just starting to talk
about it.

733
00:42:39,640 --> 00:42:42,720
But it was funny because he said
I I fabricated this thing and

734
00:42:42,720 --> 00:42:46,160
put it on the roof of my station
wagon and drove from Chicago to

735
00:42:46,160 --> 00:42:48,720
New York.
I mean, I was like, what?

736
00:42:49,080 --> 00:42:52,440
You know, that's insane.
You know, one of the most iconic

737
00:42:52,680 --> 00:42:54,640
nightclub movies ever?
Probably or.

738
00:42:54,640 --> 00:42:57,280
Dance.
I can mention a DJ who has an

739
00:42:57,280 --> 00:43:00,720
incredible career.
Today, two shows on SiriusXM.

740
00:43:00,720 --> 00:43:04,760
Many of your listeners may know.
Robbie Leslie, He has a show on

741
00:43:04,760 --> 00:43:06,520
Friday nights.
Robbie Leslie presents.

742
00:43:06,520 --> 00:43:10,680
He does a show on Andy Cohen
station, Kiki Radio.

743
00:43:10,880 --> 00:43:15,960
It's on Thursday nights.
He stems from those early days.

744
00:43:15,960 --> 00:43:19,640
Very sadly, we lost many of the
artists who just aren't with us

745
00:43:19,640 --> 00:43:23,040
and aren't around anymore that
were an integral force in the

746
00:43:23,040 --> 00:43:25,520
70s.
It was a hard lifestyle.

747
00:43:25,520 --> 00:43:28,520
I mean, it's, you know, it's not
an easy lifestyle to live

748
00:43:28,520 --> 00:43:31,720
through into your 80s or 90s or
whatever, you know?

749
00:43:32,520 --> 00:43:34,480
We're not that old, Marcel.
No, no.

750
00:43:34,480 --> 00:43:38,440
But I'm saying, I'm saying like.
80S or 90s is pushing it.

751
00:43:38,440 --> 00:43:42,880
However, sadly, AIDS, AIDS
incredible chunk aids.

752
00:43:43,040 --> 00:43:46,400
Was a big one.
Population in the mid to late

753
00:43:46,440 --> 00:43:52,160
80s and of that you lost many
artists of all ilks, whether

754
00:43:52,160 --> 00:43:53,440
they were.
Musicians magic.

755
00:43:53,720 --> 00:43:57,880
Designers or shows or whatever.
And so that's where a lot went

756
00:43:57,880 --> 00:44:02,600
and a lot went to drug overdoses
and a lot went to XY's and Z's,

757
00:44:02,600 --> 00:44:05,840
you know, And he kind of wonder
what music would Larry Levan be

758
00:44:05,840 --> 00:44:07,560
playing today?
I mean, he was the heart and

759
00:44:07,560 --> 00:44:09,720
soul of Paradise Garage,
probably one of the most

760
00:44:09,720 --> 00:44:12,040
infamous clubs to ever come out
of New York City.

761
00:44:13,080 --> 00:44:15,560
And a place where I did my first
installation.

762
00:44:15,560 --> 00:44:19,840
I learned not only how to put an
Edison plug on a park in, but

763
00:44:19,840 --> 00:44:23,640
what an Edison plug was that
day, my first day on the job.

764
00:44:23,880 --> 00:44:25,720
And you know who my crew chief
was?

765
00:44:25,720 --> 00:44:27,920
A lighting designer?
Joe Zamor.

766
00:44:27,920 --> 00:44:28,840
Oh.
Funny.

767
00:44:29,360 --> 00:44:32,640
That's where Joe and I met back
in 1980.

768
00:44:32,640 --> 00:44:34,160
Oh.
That's wild.

769
00:44:34,680 --> 00:44:39,080
And and a lighting designer
whose award is on the wall.

770
00:44:39,080 --> 00:44:40,960
It was given to me when the Red
Parrot closed.

771
00:44:40,960 --> 00:44:44,240
It's a Lumen award that is, you
know, is an architectural

772
00:44:44,240 --> 00:44:46,320
lighting design award.
But it was awarded to the Ice

773
00:44:46,320 --> 00:44:50,320
Palace 57 and the owner, Jimmy
Murray, who was the same owner

774
00:44:50,320 --> 00:44:52,800
as the Red Parrot and the
lighting designer was a guy by

775
00:44:52,800 --> 00:44:56,240
the name of Chris Harms and that
was a light Lab installation,

776
00:44:56,240 --> 00:45:00,280
which was a Paul Gregory
installation among many others.

777
00:45:00,280 --> 00:45:04,640
So, you know, sadly, so many of
those people, yes, I wonder

778
00:45:04,640 --> 00:45:06,680
where they would be, what their
music would be.

779
00:45:06,680 --> 00:45:11,320
Artists DJ is like a Jim Burgess
who had an opera background.

780
00:45:11,320 --> 00:45:15,400
I mean, we used to hang out.
He'd freaking sing opera Arias.

781
00:45:15,440 --> 00:45:19,160
I mean, it was amazing, amazing.
You wonder what they would be

782
00:45:19,160 --> 00:45:22,040
doing now, given all the
creative tools that people have

783
00:45:22,040 --> 00:45:25,560
at their disposal that they
didn't have back then, you know?

784
00:45:25,560 --> 00:45:28,400
So let me ask you this though,
did your like when?

785
00:45:29,160 --> 00:45:31,080
So you came from South Florida,
right?

786
00:45:32,120 --> 00:45:35,440
Born and raised, Sir.
So you you had a pretty normal

787
00:45:35,520 --> 00:45:39,040
upbringing, you know, normal
parents, normal family and

788
00:45:39,040 --> 00:45:39,920
everything else, right?
I.

789
00:45:41,120 --> 00:45:47,240
I I guess they were right.
I came from a very loving home.

790
00:45:47,680 --> 00:45:53,440
I had as normal a childhood as I
suppose anyone could want.

791
00:45:53,440 --> 00:45:56,680
We lived in a lovely suburban
neighborhood that at the time I

792
00:45:56,680 --> 00:45:59,280
was born was brand new in North
Miami.

793
00:45:59,760 --> 00:46:02,600
I went to North Miami Junior
High and Senior High and had a

794
00:46:02,600 --> 00:46:06,920
prom and was involved and and
went to our our Junior and

795
00:46:06,920 --> 00:46:08,440
senior prom.
We're at the Fountain Blue

796
00:46:08,440 --> 00:46:09,840
Hotel.
That's wild.

797
00:46:09,840 --> 00:46:12,200
What I'm getting at though.
Marsha is where did it all go

798
00:46:12,200 --> 00:46:14,040
wrong?
You know, how the hell did you

799
00:46:14,040 --> 00:46:15,160
end up on this?
I.

800
00:46:15,320 --> 00:46:17,960
Moved to New York.
Club scene in New York.

801
00:46:18,280 --> 00:46:18,880
What?
Do you think?

802
00:46:19,600 --> 00:46:22,480
No, but did your parents think,
What the heck are you doing,

803
00:46:22,480 --> 00:46:24,480
Marsha?
You're in these nightclubs,

804
00:46:24,480 --> 00:46:28,320
working all hours of the night
in these crazy places I am.

805
00:46:28,520 --> 00:46:35,480
Quite certain that my mother was
not pleased, but I was grateful

806
00:46:35,480 --> 00:46:39,680
that they both gave me the grace
to live my life and they

807
00:46:39,680 --> 00:46:42,840
accepted it even though they may
not have understood it.

808
00:46:44,440 --> 00:46:51,160
I I remember and and I also look
leaving Florida when I had a

809
00:46:51,160 --> 00:46:54,840
really good job at the age of
you know, 920 years old.

810
00:46:54,840 --> 00:47:03,000
I was making in 1975 like 20 to
30 grand a year and on the pace

811
00:47:03,000 --> 00:47:06,880
to double it annually.
That was not that was stay 2-3

812
00:47:06,880 --> 00:47:10,040
more years and move to New York
with 100 grand in your pocket

813
00:47:10,040 --> 00:47:11,840
was what the smart person would
have done.

814
00:47:11,840 --> 00:47:15,120
But Marcia didn't do that.
Marcia needed to do what she

815
00:47:15,120 --> 00:47:16,960
needed to do and follow her
heart.

816
00:47:17,320 --> 00:47:19,680
And, you know, my parents are
Holocaust survivors.

817
00:47:20,120 --> 00:47:24,120
And so they had to leave their
home in Vienna at the ages of 18

818
00:47:24,120 --> 00:47:29,640
and 19 respectively.
And I presented it to my mother

819
00:47:29,640 --> 00:47:32,200
in a way that I thought she
would understand.

820
00:47:32,200 --> 00:47:36,840
And that was that she didn't
have the opportunity to make the

821
00:47:36,840 --> 00:47:39,440
choice on how she was going to
become an adult.

822
00:47:40,080 --> 00:47:45,800
I was fortunate enough to have a
choice to make, and this was the

823
00:47:45,800 --> 00:47:49,280
choice I was going to do.
And I did it knowing I had a

824
00:47:49,280 --> 00:47:53,000
safety net to come back to.
And I don't think that I would

825
00:47:53,000 --> 00:47:56,880
have moved to New York at the
ripe old age of not quite 22 if

826
00:47:56,880 --> 00:48:00,840
I didn't have a safe home
environment to come to.

827
00:48:00,840 --> 00:48:03,960
And I think that was a huge part
of what gave me the confidence

828
00:48:04,440 --> 00:48:07,400
to do things that I probably
shouldn't have done and go

829
00:48:07,400 --> 00:48:11,240
places I probably shouldn't have
gone and explore things that

830
00:48:11,240 --> 00:48:14,320
maybe I shouldn't have gone.
But I think now that I look back

831
00:48:14,320 --> 00:48:19,080
on it, I'm glad I had the balls.
Yeah, well, here's.

832
00:48:19,080 --> 00:48:21,920
The thing though, like I, you
know, it's going to sound

833
00:48:21,920 --> 00:48:22,960
sexist.
It's not.

834
00:48:23,360 --> 00:48:26,840
You know, I did AI took a
similar route in that I went out

835
00:48:26,840 --> 00:48:29,440
on the road as a musician much
younger than 22.

836
00:48:29,440 --> 00:48:36,280
I was, I think I was 16 or 17
with a fake ID because you had

837
00:48:36,280 --> 00:48:39,160
to be 18 in Canada to play in
the bars and stuff.

838
00:48:39,720 --> 00:48:44,920
And you know, my mom, just my
dad was dead when I was four and

839
00:48:44,920 --> 00:48:47,000
my stepdad was already out of
the picture by then.

840
00:48:47,000 --> 00:48:49,600
So my mom just said, hey, look,
you know, that's what you want

841
00:48:49,600 --> 00:48:51,000
to do.
I support you, you know,

842
00:48:51,000 --> 00:48:57,600
whatever you want.
And but I was a guy and so, you

843
00:48:57,600 --> 00:49:00,160
know, I I always think it's
different for a daughter.

844
00:49:00,160 --> 00:49:01,880
And you were an only child too,
weren't you?

845
00:49:02,520 --> 00:49:05,240
I yeah, up to this day, I'm
still an only child.

846
00:49:05,360 --> 00:49:10,920
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
And and I, you know, before I

847
00:49:10,920 --> 00:49:14,920
got the cojones to stop
everything and do what I wanted

848
00:49:14,920 --> 00:49:18,000
to do and then move to New York,
you know, I did the things you

849
00:49:18,000 --> 00:49:21,160
were supposed to do.
I went to college, you know,

850
00:49:21,160 --> 00:49:23,640
they transferred to a nice
dental hygiene school.

851
00:49:23,640 --> 00:49:27,360
And I had nice jobs and medical
offices were a nice young woman

852
00:49:27,360 --> 00:49:30,520
at the age of 19 or 20 could
earn a good living in yada, yada

853
00:49:30,520 --> 00:49:32,800
and yada, yada.
And you know, and then it was

854
00:49:32,800 --> 00:49:38,040
like one day I just said I don't
think I could do this anymore.

855
00:49:38,520 --> 00:49:40,440
Yeah, yeah.
You know, it's funny.

856
00:49:40,440 --> 00:49:44,840
When I was looking at your, your
info that you sent over, I saw,

857
00:49:44,880 --> 00:49:48,680
you know, went to college for
dental hygiene and you know,

858
00:49:48,680 --> 00:49:51,840
then my first job, you know,
whatever, not first job.

859
00:49:51,880 --> 00:49:55,640
But yeah, now I'm now I'm now
I'm in a nightclub in New York.

860
00:49:55,640 --> 00:49:59,960
And I'm like, so you went to
school for dental hygiene so

861
00:49:59,960 --> 00:50:02,520
that you could be a tech in a
nightclub, you know?

862
00:50:02,520 --> 00:50:05,520
I mean, these are just the paths
we take sometimes, right?

863
00:50:05,960 --> 00:50:09,320
Well, not for nothing.
When I moved to New York, one of

864
00:50:09,320 --> 00:50:13,400
my early jobs that supported me
while I was looking for a job in

865
00:50:13,400 --> 00:50:17,240
the music business was as an
assistant in a dentist office.

866
00:50:17,480 --> 00:50:19,920
An endodontist office, to be
particular.

867
00:50:20,160 --> 00:50:23,600
Interesting.
And they knew I was looking for

868
00:50:23,600 --> 00:50:27,200
work.
And as soon as I secured the job

869
00:50:27,200 --> 00:50:30,160
as a publicist with the Howard
Bloom organization, which was

870
00:50:30,160 --> 00:50:34,560
like in Jed, right after the New
Year in 77, that that was it, It

871
00:50:34,560 --> 00:50:39,040
was a goodbye and Be friends and
Barry Moosie Kant the Dent, the

872
00:50:39,040 --> 00:50:42,960
endodontist, performed a couple
of my root canals and my dentist

873
00:50:42,960 --> 00:50:45,240
for 40 years.
I met through that building.

874
00:50:45,240 --> 00:50:48,320
And you know, it's funny where
life takes you.

875
00:50:48,360 --> 00:50:51,920
And and lucky that I had enough
of a skill set in that arena.

876
00:50:52,280 --> 00:50:54,680
Yeah.
The earn a living when I had

877
00:50:54,720 --> 00:50:57,280
just moved to New York.
The only other dental person I

878
00:50:57,280 --> 00:51:01,080
knew in the nightclub business
was Tim.

879
00:51:01,320 --> 00:51:04,680
What's his last name?
Tim, who owned Tantra in Miami

880
00:51:04,680 --> 00:51:07,080
Beach and some other places as
well.

881
00:51:07,080 --> 00:51:09,160
He owns some clubs and
restaurants and stuff.

882
00:51:09,960 --> 00:51:11,920
Tim.
I can't remember his damn last

883
00:51:11,920 --> 00:51:15,320
name, but he was a dentist
during the day and like at night

884
00:51:15,320 --> 00:51:19,960
you'd see, you know, him and his
wife doing crazy things on poles

885
00:51:19,960 --> 00:51:22,960
in his restaurants and or in his
nightclubs or whatever, right?

886
00:51:23,040 --> 00:51:27,360
It's like what is going on here?
But a really cool guy.

887
00:51:27,360 --> 00:51:32,360
But, you know, seeing him in the
nightclub at night made me never

888
00:51:32,360 --> 00:51:35,880
want to be under, you know, a
light with him with knives and

889
00:51:35,880 --> 00:51:42,560
stuff in my mouth in the
morning, you know, No, thank

890
00:51:42,560 --> 00:51:43,720
you.
Yeah.

891
00:51:44,320 --> 00:51:46,920
Maybe just give me some of that
stuff you took last night and I

892
00:51:46,920 --> 00:51:49,120
won't feel a thing.
Yeah.

893
00:51:49,760 --> 00:51:52,680
Well, you know, yeah.
And you have to kind of have

894
00:51:52,680 --> 00:51:56,840
your wits about you if you're on
the other end of, you know, even

895
00:51:56,840 --> 00:51:59,320
what we do.
I mean, working in a nightclub

896
00:51:59,320 --> 00:52:02,760
and being the person who is
responsible for making the party

897
00:52:02,760 --> 00:52:05,480
is a little bit different than
being the rigor on the job that

898
00:52:05,480 --> 00:52:08,520
does the sets and the staging
the day before.

899
00:52:08,880 --> 00:52:12,360
Yeah, yeah.
So how did you, how, and maybe

900
00:52:12,360 --> 00:52:14,680
even why?
Like what made you decide or

901
00:52:14,680 --> 00:52:18,280
whatever?
But was it like a really natural

902
00:52:18,280 --> 00:52:22,240
sort of transition from being a
club lighting person to being

903
00:52:22,440 --> 00:52:25,640
more of an architectural or
architectainment or

904
00:52:25,840 --> 00:52:29,000
architectural retail or whatever
you want to call it, but a a

905
00:52:29,000 --> 00:52:31,640
more sophisticated lighting
person?

906
00:52:32,640 --> 00:52:36,680
Or like were you following the
path of maybe a Paul Gregory or

907
00:52:36,680 --> 00:52:41,320
or someone along those lines?
I was not following anyone

908
00:52:41,320 --> 00:52:45,920
else's path, but again, it was
luck and circumstances that led

909
00:52:45,920 --> 00:52:50,680
me where I needed to be.
At the time in the 90s, post

910
00:52:50,680 --> 00:52:55,400
Palladium, I was working with
Robert Isabelle Incorporated.

911
00:52:55,400 --> 00:52:59,080
We were doing massive special
events again.

912
00:52:59,080 --> 00:53:01,520
I was continuing as a Vera Light
head.

913
00:53:01,520 --> 00:53:07,080
Van Coe was our supplier in New
York, Teddy van Brahmel's

914
00:53:07,080 --> 00:53:13,040
company, and we were the largest
renter of Vera lights in the

915
00:53:13,040 --> 00:53:17,200
Northeast, if that gives you any
idea beyond tours, beyond all

916
00:53:17,200 --> 00:53:19,280
kinds of stuff.
And you couldn't buy a Vera

917
00:53:19,280 --> 00:53:26,080
light in 1990 or 91 or 95.
And that was where I got my

918
00:53:26,080 --> 00:53:31,600
bread and butter doing doing
these mega mega events and

919
00:53:31,600 --> 00:53:34,000
working on my own special
events.

920
00:53:34,000 --> 00:53:36,640
I did a lot of my own special
events where I did a lot of work

921
00:53:36,640 --> 00:53:39,680
as I mentioned with Derek
Vasquez and his company Custom

922
00:53:39,680 --> 00:53:43,200
Lighting.
And I had a ski accident and I

923
00:53:43,200 --> 00:53:47,160
blew my knee out.
And when I blew my knee out,

924
00:53:47,160 --> 00:53:51,720
that kind of put the kibosh on
climbing ladders and running

925
00:53:51,720 --> 00:53:56,920
around like a lunatic and doing
all these events and post during

926
00:53:56,920 --> 00:54:01,440
not long rehab, but post initial
rehab as I'm ready now to go

927
00:54:01,440 --> 00:54:03,560
back to work.
And what the blank am I doing?

928
00:54:03,560 --> 00:54:07,240
Because now what I was doing, it
doesn't really make sense right

929
00:54:07,240 --> 00:54:12,440
now since I'm still on the on
the mend was an ad in the Times

930
00:54:12,680 --> 00:54:16,040
from an architectural lighting
design firm called Johnson

931
00:54:16,040 --> 00:54:19,360
Schwinghamer.
And I happened to answer it and

932
00:54:19,360 --> 00:54:22,280
Johnson Schwinghamer was looking
for a designer they were

933
00:54:22,280 --> 00:54:24,960
interviewing.
Turned out they had a new

934
00:54:24,960 --> 00:54:27,080
project, which is why they
wanted a designer.

935
00:54:27,080 --> 00:54:29,560
That was FAO Schwarz in Las
Vegas.

936
00:54:29,880 --> 00:54:33,240
I presented the idea of doing
this all with automated

937
00:54:33,240 --> 00:54:35,680
lighting, something that had
never been done before.

938
00:54:36,080 --> 00:54:39,480
Both Clark Johnson and Bill
Schwinghammer loved it.

939
00:54:39,520 --> 00:54:42,320
It was more of a bill project
than well, the two of them

940
00:54:42,320 --> 00:54:45,000
worked together on that, but FAO
ended up being a little more of

941
00:54:45,000 --> 00:54:49,320
a bill client.
But be that as it may, that was

942
00:54:49,320 --> 00:54:51,080
how I segwayed into
architecture.

943
00:54:51,080 --> 00:54:52,440
Lucky.
Interesting.

944
00:54:53,080 --> 00:54:58,160
Fucking lucky.
No, but why, what, what made you

945
00:54:58,160 --> 00:55:04,000
think that going all automated
on a job like that in retail,

946
00:55:04,200 --> 00:55:08,480
your first basically foray into
architectural lighting.

947
00:55:09,200 --> 00:55:13,920
I mean, if you look back, that
was pretty friggin brave, you

948
00:55:13,920 --> 00:55:18,280
know, it was pretty.
Palsy There were 3-4 aspects of

949
00:55:18,280 --> 00:55:22,440
the store that I was involved
with, with my special lighting

950
00:55:22,440 --> 00:55:25,480
segment and it had its own
heading and its own section in

951
00:55:25,480 --> 00:55:28,360
the contract and blah blah blah
blah blah blah blah, you know,

952
00:55:28,360 --> 00:55:31,880
in its own drawings and whatnot.
And one aspect, the main aspect

953
00:55:31,880 --> 00:55:34,920
was the Trojan horse, which was
this like 65 foot animated

954
00:55:34,920 --> 00:55:36,840
Trojan horse that was at the
entrance.

955
00:55:37,160 --> 00:55:41,000
It was the FAO Schwarz shops at
Caesars Forum Shops in Las

956
00:55:41,000 --> 00:55:47,040
Vegas, and that was an animated
attraction and they had a

957
00:55:47,040 --> 00:55:51,440
soundtrack and a show that was
going to be repeated like every

958
00:55:51,440 --> 00:55:55,560
15 or 20 minutes throughout with
the animation and a whole

959
00:55:55,560 --> 00:55:58,560
thingama do.
And they needed an intermission,

960
00:55:58,560 --> 00:56:03,800
if you will.
And I thought that was a great

961
00:56:03,800 --> 00:56:07,840
opportunity to introduce moving
light whether the fixtures and

962
00:56:07,840 --> 00:56:12,640
the the lights themselves moved
as they did in the animation or

963
00:56:12,640 --> 00:56:16,400
if it was a stagnant with color
very slowly.

964
00:56:16,400 --> 00:56:19,440
And actually the in between
looks that I did my program was

965
00:56:19,440 --> 00:56:22,480
Brad Schiller.
And we spent an entire night in

966
00:56:22,480 --> 00:56:26,960
the store programming the in
between sections so that we had

967
00:56:26,960 --> 00:56:31,680
maybe a four hour uninterrupted
loop that would run, that would

968
00:56:31,680 --> 00:56:35,760
pause every time there was an
animated show that was a pre

969
00:56:35,760 --> 00:56:39,840
recorded segment that would
repeat so that our show didn't

970
00:56:39,840 --> 00:56:43,400
repeat so it didn't look like
every time the ceiling turned

971
00:56:43,400 --> 00:56:45,360
blue.
Then boom, the animation starts.

972
00:56:45,400 --> 00:56:48,600
I didn't want that.
I wanted something that really

973
00:56:48,600 --> 00:56:49,680
was different in.
Me.

974
00:56:51,000 --> 00:56:55,560
Yes, and and they gave me FAO
Shores, they gave me Dick Glass

975
00:56:56,120 --> 00:57:01,800
was the VPO at the time and he
gave me a clean pallet, the

976
00:57:02,000 --> 00:57:05,000
design team of Johnson
Schwinghammer that I worked with

977
00:57:05,000 --> 00:57:08,560
those guys, they were great and
they really just let me run with

978
00:57:08,560 --> 00:57:10,560
it.
I worked with Joanne Newbold,

979
00:57:10,560 --> 00:57:14,840
who was the creative designer
for the store, and we did a

980
00:57:14,840 --> 00:57:19,400
thing for, I don't remember
what, but there was a tree.

981
00:57:19,400 --> 00:57:22,720
It was one of the bears things
and they did a tree and they

982
00:57:22,720 --> 00:57:24,960
wanted twinkle lights for the
tree.

983
00:57:25,320 --> 00:57:27,880
And so that was a segment that I
was involved in.

984
00:57:27,880 --> 00:57:31,840
And then there was a Star Wars
area where, you know, at the

985
00:57:31,840 --> 00:57:37,280
cafe, the Cantina in Star Wars
where they animated fixtures

986
00:57:37,280 --> 00:57:41,280
come out and they do that well.
They had a show and they had

987
00:57:41,320 --> 00:57:45,200
animatronics doing that and that
was a light show that I was

988
00:57:45,200 --> 00:57:48,080
involved with.
So I had a lot of different

989
00:57:48,080 --> 00:57:50,680
arenas.
There was a huge long vault that

990
00:57:50,680 --> 00:57:54,400
led down to the FAO Schweese,
which was their new candy line

991
00:57:55,360 --> 00:57:59,880
and that was, I don't know,
maybe a 60 foot long arc that

992
00:57:59,880 --> 00:58:02,280
was just rainbow neon back and
forth.

993
00:58:02,280 --> 00:58:04,880
So there was lots of wonderful.
You know, it's it's funny

994
00:58:04,880 --> 00:58:08,200
though, because you talk about
it now and of course now nothing

995
00:58:08,200 --> 00:58:11,400
about that is too edgy or
cutting edge or.

996
00:58:11,400 --> 00:58:13,800
Or out.
There or anything, right?

997
00:58:14,000 --> 00:58:17,480
But at the time really nothing
like that had been done.

998
00:58:17,480 --> 00:58:20,960
I remember, I, I just remember
being involved in that project

999
00:58:20,960 --> 00:58:23,680
and just going, wow, this is
like the coolest thing ever in a

1000
00:58:23,680 --> 00:58:24,600
retail store.
Like.

1001
00:58:24,800 --> 00:58:29,240
And then the NBA job that you
did was similar to and it was

1002
00:58:29,240 --> 00:58:31,000
just really cool to be a part
of, you know?

1003
00:58:31,000 --> 00:58:36,000
And again, now everybody does
that stuff now and and times 10,

1004
00:58:36,000 --> 00:58:39,080
you know, 'cause there's so, so
many cool products out there

1005
00:58:39,080 --> 00:58:40,760
now.
It's so easy to do stuff like

1006
00:58:40,760 --> 00:58:43,280
that.
But back then it was unheard of.

1007
00:58:43,720 --> 00:58:45,200
It was pretty cool.
It did.

1008
00:58:45,200 --> 00:58:46,840
It did break ground.
Thank you.

1009
00:58:46,880 --> 00:58:49,240
Thank you very much.
And there were a handful of

1010
00:58:49,240 --> 00:58:53,280
people who were on that cutting
room floor, cutting edge floor

1011
00:58:53,280 --> 00:58:57,160
if you will, Paul being one of
them, his company Focus

1012
00:58:57,160 --> 00:58:59,120
Lighting.
I mean, I knew Paul back from

1013
00:58:59,120 --> 00:59:02,920
the Light Lab days and actually
worked at Light Lab for a stint

1014
00:59:02,920 --> 00:59:05,400
back in like 80 or 81 or
something.

1015
00:59:06,720 --> 00:59:11,960
But he had founded Focus
Lighting, which again put that

1016
00:59:11,960 --> 00:59:14,840
that entertainment technology
that we knew.

1017
00:59:15,440 --> 00:59:19,560
I put it to work in a changing
world so that now you had Times

1018
00:59:19,560 --> 00:59:21,760
Square that was getting
involved.

1019
00:59:21,800 --> 00:59:25,920
It wasn't just the neon we had
now moved.

1020
00:59:25,920 --> 00:59:28,600
You had video that was a little
more accessible putting up

1021
00:59:28,600 --> 00:59:31,840
screens, this and that.
You know, I had again.

1022
00:59:31,840 --> 00:59:34,840
Look, I'm Marshall.
Lucky Stern.

1023
00:59:34,840 --> 00:59:36,160
And that's really OK by.
Me.

1024
00:59:36,320 --> 00:59:38,760
Yeah, no, but you know what
again, you made your luck cuz

1025
00:59:38,760 --> 00:59:42,760
you talked to 1000 people and at
the end of the day, our

1026
00:59:42,760 --> 00:59:46,880
industry, more than any other
that I know of is built on

1027
00:59:46,880 --> 00:59:48,560
network.
Who do you know?

1028
00:59:48,640 --> 00:59:52,000
It's really, it's not what do
you know?

1029
00:59:52,000 --> 00:59:54,960
It's not how great is your skill
set necessarily.

1030
00:59:54,960 --> 00:59:56,680
It's not that you don't have
skills.

1031
00:59:56,680 --> 00:59:59,360
I'm just saying that, you know,
because I don't have any special

1032
00:59:59,360 --> 01:00:00,800
skills.
I've just always been a good

1033
01:00:00,800 --> 01:00:03,440
networker and I know a lot of
the right people and stuff right

1034
01:00:03,440 --> 01:00:05,120
it.
Is your skill set, Marcel,

1035
01:00:05,120 --> 01:00:08,160
exactly.
Your job was at the time when we

1036
01:00:08,200 --> 01:00:12,680
met, was to be a networker and
cast your net and bring into the

1037
01:00:12,680 --> 01:00:16,800
company People like me who took
the product and then did

1038
01:00:16,800 --> 01:00:18,800
something with it so that the
public knew.

1039
01:00:18,840 --> 01:00:21,600
And before you knew it, you
know, by the time I had been

1040
01:00:21,600 --> 01:00:26,600
doing this for four or five
years of the architectural

1041
01:00:26,600 --> 01:00:30,680
world, all of a sudden I
remember doing a light fair

1042
01:00:32,320 --> 01:00:35,240
manufacturer's showcase thing
because I used to open up light

1043
01:00:35,240 --> 01:00:38,360
fair when they do the
manufacturer's showcase and I

1044
01:00:38,360 --> 01:00:43,080
didn't intentionally do it as a
blowout, but at that time, high

1045
01:00:43,080 --> 01:00:47,600
end, ETC.
Martin and Vera Light all had

1046
01:00:47,600 --> 01:00:49,640
architectural fixtures.
Yeah.

1047
01:00:50,600 --> 01:00:55,440
And I used all of them in
different parts and different

1048
01:00:55,440 --> 01:00:57,600
aspects.
And I didn't mean it to be a

1049
01:00:57,600 --> 01:01:01,200
shootout at any kind.
I just meant to illustrate to

1050
01:01:01,480 --> 01:01:05,720
the architectural community that
what you're seeing has been mod,

1051
01:01:05,760 --> 01:01:08,920
has is is taking your theater
experience and it's modified it

1052
01:01:08,920 --> 01:01:14,240
for your use, ETC.
Did the high did the HID version

1053
01:01:14,240 --> 01:01:17,360
of the Source 4.
I wouldn't say that I was the

1054
01:01:17,360 --> 01:01:20,400
only reason, but certainly the
fact that I had specs.

1055
01:01:20,400 --> 01:01:24,080
Source 4 is in NASDAQ Amex
Marketplace and the maintenance

1056
01:01:24,080 --> 01:01:27,600
people were not happy.
Going 6070 feet in the air every

1057
01:01:28,080 --> 01:01:32,800
50 hours to change a lamp was
inspiration.

1058
01:01:33,120 --> 01:01:37,360
And that was what was happening
around 2000, 2001, which was

1059
01:01:37,440 --> 01:01:40,640
when.
You know, again, it's another

1060
01:01:40,640 --> 01:01:44,480
fun part about being old is that
you and I remember a lot of the

1061
01:01:44,480 --> 01:01:48,400
same things like, you know, the
very first architectural wash

1062
01:01:48,400 --> 01:01:50,840
lights that were coming out,
things like the high end, what

1063
01:01:50,840 --> 01:01:55,240
was it called, the EC1 and
Martin had the Mac exterior and

1064
01:01:56,160 --> 01:01:59,240
and then you know, everybody was
coming out with those things at

1065
01:01:59,240 --> 01:02:01,520
that point.
Before that there was nothing.

1066
01:02:01,520 --> 01:02:06,840
There was these big, you know,
discharge fixtures of some sort

1067
01:02:06,840 --> 01:02:13,200
or whatever, exactly a lot.
Of Hidi remember being on the

1068
01:02:13,200 --> 01:02:17,320
balcony over on the 9th Ave.
building of the Verolite offices

1069
01:02:17,320 --> 01:02:18,920
when they were at the Chelsea
Piers.

1070
01:02:19,440 --> 01:02:21,760
And I'm going back to when the
Palladium was open and I

1071
01:02:22,040 --> 01:02:26,680
remember being there with Gary
Delansky and the and their

1072
01:02:27,000 --> 01:02:30,840
Iridian architectural line.
It just been launched, it was

1073
01:02:31,120 --> 01:02:34,720
pre ETC.
It was part of the Verolite

1074
01:02:34,720 --> 01:02:40,040
family and Gary Delansky was the
Rep and I remember the first

1075
01:02:40,040 --> 01:02:43,080
fixture that came out was their
AR5 and they.

1076
01:02:43,120 --> 01:02:45,360
The little moving light thing,
The little moving head thing,

1077
01:02:45,360 --> 01:02:46,400
right?
Is that the one?

1078
01:02:46,960 --> 01:02:48,640
I'm sorry.
No, it was the AR500.

1079
01:02:48,640 --> 01:02:49,880
It was.
It wasn't the little one.

1080
01:02:49,880 --> 01:02:53,160
Yes, the little one I use in FAO
Schwarz, but a year, two years

1081
01:02:53,160 --> 01:02:57,040
before that, it was the big
monster, I guess it was an

1082
01:02:57,160 --> 01:03:02,120
AR500.
And they were doing a demo for

1083
01:03:02,120 --> 01:03:05,680
the Empire State Building.
Now at that time, the Empire

1084
01:03:05,680 --> 01:03:09,160
State Building was exactly what
you're saying, huge HI DS and

1085
01:03:09,160 --> 01:03:12,160
the union guys would come out
and when they chat a holiday and

1086
01:03:12,160 --> 01:03:14,400
you wanted red, white and blue,
they'd come out and they'd

1087
01:03:14,400 --> 01:03:15,680
change the filters and they'd
come back.

1088
01:03:15,680 --> 01:03:20,480
And this was a Union gig, right?
And I remember seeing the mock

1089
01:03:20,480 --> 01:03:23,880
up on the Balcon out on the
rooftop of the bit, the office

1090
01:03:23,880 --> 01:03:25,160
building, and then setting it
up.

1091
01:03:25,160 --> 01:03:28,160
It's that Empire State Building
and blah, blah, blah.

1092
01:03:28,880 --> 01:03:33,200
And I was told the reason at the
time that they couldn't go

1093
01:03:33,200 --> 01:03:36,320
automated was because of the
union contract, Because if it

1094
01:03:36,320 --> 01:03:41,960
was just one guy and there was a
lot of rebuttal on Broadway as

1095
01:03:41,960 --> 01:03:47,400
well, until the lighting people
got trained in automation and

1096
01:03:47,400 --> 01:03:49,840
got trained in the new
technology.

1097
01:03:49,840 --> 01:03:52,440
There was a lot of this head
butting that went on because

1098
01:03:52,440 --> 01:03:54,200
guys were afraid of losing their
jobs.

1099
01:03:54,200 --> 01:03:57,240
All of a sudden the moving
companies, the automated

1100
01:03:57,240 --> 01:03:59,240
companies.
And that coincided a lot with

1101
01:03:59,240 --> 01:04:06,080
the patent ending on verilite 25
year patent that I think began

1102
01:04:06,080 --> 01:04:10,680
in 79 or 80.
When that ended, now you could

1103
01:04:10,680 --> 01:04:14,200
have Martin and High End and
Clay Paki and every other

1104
01:04:14,200 --> 01:04:17,800
company had access to the moving
head, the yoke.

1105
01:04:18,160 --> 01:04:19,960
Yeah.
Well, yeah, we.

1106
01:04:20,160 --> 01:04:24,560
Have the mirror, which also
limited how it could be used in

1107
01:04:24,560 --> 01:04:27,840
an installation.
So maybe you think it was 95 or

1108
01:04:27,840 --> 01:04:31,840
96 when the patent ran out?
Well, it was actually.

1109
01:04:31,840 --> 01:04:35,080
Challenged.
It was challenged in in some big

1110
01:04:35,080 --> 01:04:38,160
fights with Martin and and high
end and.

1111
01:04:38,200 --> 01:04:40,880
Yeah.
But those studio colors came out

1112
01:04:40,880 --> 01:04:43,880
mid 90s, yeah.
And they were all among the

1113
01:04:43,880 --> 01:04:48,920
first of the competitors.
Yeah, moving heads, yeah,

1114
01:04:48,960 --> 01:04:51,040
because that was the technology.
It was the moving head.

1115
01:04:51,040 --> 01:04:53,680
Not the light that was moving,
but the head that was moving it.

1116
01:04:53,720 --> 01:04:56,200
Yeah, yeah.
No, I mean, it was a.

1117
01:04:56,200 --> 01:04:58,720
It was a.
Cool to be an old geezer, and I

1118
01:04:58,720 --> 01:05:04,080
think it's great to be vertical
and lucid and and to know where

1119
01:05:04,080 --> 01:05:06,040
we've came from and how much
we've changed.

1120
01:05:06,040 --> 01:05:08,680
Maybe that's why I've turned
into this historical nut.

1121
01:05:09,080 --> 01:05:11,280
Yeah, no, there's nothing wrong
with that, you know.

1122
01:05:11,280 --> 01:05:15,360
I mean it's I think it's really
cool like I it's one of the

1123
01:05:15,360 --> 01:05:19,320
reasons I do this podcast is I
love hearing stories.

1124
01:05:19,320 --> 01:05:23,320
Like, I think it was Paul Dexter
who told me that when he was

1125
01:05:23,320 --> 01:05:27,640
doing his earliest, and I forget
what band it it was, but when he

1126
01:05:27,640 --> 01:05:30,840
was doing his earliest lighting
designs for whatever band, it

1127
01:05:30,840 --> 01:05:36,720
was in the 70s and there maybe
yeah, it was the 70s.

1128
01:05:37,000 --> 01:05:39,560
And you know, he had no park
hands or anything.

1129
01:05:39,560 --> 01:05:45,240
So he took old pineapple cans
and you know mounted lamps in

1130
01:05:45,240 --> 01:05:48,160
them and and he created these
square park hands out of these

1131
01:05:48,160 --> 01:05:52,120
pineapple cans.
And you know it, it worked

1132
01:05:52,160 --> 01:05:54,560
right.
And the same thing with sound

1133
01:05:54,560 --> 01:05:56,320
systems.
Everybody just built their own

1134
01:05:56,320 --> 01:05:58,680
sound systems and Bob over there
built this one.

1135
01:05:58,680 --> 01:06:00,800
I'm going to build one louder.
My speakers are going to be

1136
01:06:00,800 --> 01:06:04,520
bigger, you know, and.
I remember my friend Wendy and I

1137
01:06:04,520 --> 01:06:09,080
scrounging for old pizza cans in
Chinatown because she needed

1138
01:06:09,080 --> 01:06:13,520
lights for a dance company show
and we made park hands out of

1139
01:06:13,520 --> 01:06:16,200
pizza cans.
Very Paul Dexter story.

1140
01:06:16,200 --> 01:06:18,240
That's funny.
Yeah, and that's what we did.

1141
01:06:18,240 --> 01:06:20,720
We Jerry rigged it.
I mean my buddy Martin and I,

1142
01:06:20,720 --> 01:06:22,640
who I worked with, the
Palladium, we used to come up

1143
01:06:22,640 --> 01:06:26,920
with the craziest ideas of
things to do that would just

1144
01:06:26,920 --> 01:06:30,600
make something out of nothing,
even if it was just for the day,

1145
01:06:30,760 --> 01:06:32,560
you know?
And for that, and for that

1146
01:06:32,560 --> 01:06:34,520
matter, my friend Roy tho, the
DJ.

1147
01:06:34,680 --> 01:06:38,320
Yeah, his home was out on Fire
Island at the Ice Palace, and I

1148
01:06:38,320 --> 01:06:42,560
can't tell you how many
Saturdays were spent literally

1149
01:06:42,560 --> 01:06:45,480
Jerry rigging silly things so
that it looked cool.

1150
01:06:45,480 --> 01:06:49,200
For that Saturday night crowd,
we would do stuff like take the

1151
01:06:49,200 --> 01:06:52,400
fire hose and run it through the
pool and make it into a fountain

1152
01:06:52,400 --> 01:06:53,640
for the night.
Huh.

1153
01:06:53,680 --> 01:06:57,640
Just stupid crap.
But that's you know, that's

1154
01:06:57,640 --> 01:06:59,200
creative too.
And.

1155
01:06:59,200 --> 01:07:00,680
And.
I love that kind of stuff.

1156
01:07:00,960 --> 01:07:04,520
It doesn't have to be a $20,000
light to to be cool, you know?

1157
01:07:04,800 --> 01:07:08,640
So do you know a designer out of
Chicago, Rob Jepsen?

1158
01:07:09,520 --> 01:07:12,360
Yeah, so well.
But I do know we.

1159
01:07:12,560 --> 01:07:17,120
Yeah, Rob was on my podcast and
he told a story of when he was,

1160
01:07:17,480 --> 01:07:19,920
you know, first getting into
lighting and stuff.

1161
01:07:20,600 --> 01:07:24,840
He saw ACLS and he went whoa and
you know, he just thought they

1162
01:07:24,840 --> 01:07:30,600
were car headlights.
And so he, he went to the auto

1163
01:07:30,600 --> 01:07:36,400
wrecker and stole some car
headlights and and, you know,

1164
01:07:36,400 --> 01:07:38,840
put four of them together on a
bar or whatever.

1165
01:07:39,280 --> 01:07:42,880
And he kept blowing fuses or
popping circuits or whatever he

1166
01:07:42,880 --> 01:07:45,400
was doing.
And he was like, what the hell?

1167
01:07:45,400 --> 01:07:47,680
How come people can do this and
I can't do this?

1168
01:07:47,680 --> 01:07:51,200
It's not working.
And so he finally went to

1169
01:07:51,360 --> 01:07:53,360
somebody else and he goes,
you're an idiot, you know, you

1170
01:07:53,360 --> 01:07:55,360
need to run six of them in
series.

1171
01:07:55,920 --> 01:08:00,040
And he goes, so I went and stole
two more.

1172
01:08:00,040 --> 01:08:05,280
I'm like, you know, this is how
you built a lighting rig back in

1173
01:08:05,280 --> 01:08:06,640
the day I guess, right?
That's funny.

1174
01:08:06,640 --> 01:08:08,400
Well, you know what the ACL
stands for.

1175
01:08:09,000 --> 01:08:11,480
Yeah, of course.
Aircraft landing lights.

1176
01:08:11,520 --> 01:08:16,680
That's why they're zeroed in.
The 1st place I became familiar

1177
01:08:16,680 --> 01:08:21,560
with that was really in
Palladium, because Palladium was

1178
01:08:21,560 --> 01:08:27,120
a true theatre.
The Saint was a true theatre,

1179
01:08:27,120 --> 01:08:32,720
but it wasn't run as a theatre.
So and that was post, that was

1180
01:08:32,720 --> 01:08:36,680
post.
Studio 54 Studio 54 also was a

1181
01:08:36,680 --> 01:08:41,319
theater, but it but I wasn't.
I wasn't Privy as much to the

1182
01:08:41,319 --> 01:08:44,080
lighting as I said.
I was more involved in my music

1183
01:08:44,080 --> 01:08:46,960
career at that time.
The only time I would punch

1184
01:08:46,960 --> 01:08:49,640
lights is when Bobby Da Silva,
the lighting guy, would run off

1185
01:08:49,640 --> 01:08:53,600
and go on one of his long and
involved breaks and something

1186
01:08:53,600 --> 01:08:55,840
needed to happen because the
music required it.

1187
01:08:55,840 --> 01:08:58,640
So that I, you know, knew enough
to punch a light or two.

1188
01:08:58,920 --> 01:09:02,359
But but other than that, I was
not a lighting person per SE at

1189
01:09:02,359 --> 01:09:06,040
the time.
I was a music person, but, you

1190
01:09:06,040 --> 01:09:10,200
know, and and I learned what an
ACL was in my Palladium tenure

1191
01:09:10,319 --> 01:09:13,399
because that was really when I
became, you know, a true techie

1192
01:09:13,399 --> 01:09:17,120
in theater and did a lot of Off
Broadway, off off Off Broadway

1193
01:09:17,120 --> 01:09:21,479
and proper theater gigs.
And then I recognized how

1194
01:09:21,479 --> 01:09:25,920
different theater was from
disco, from clubs, from the way

1195
01:09:25,920 --> 01:09:29,080
they were built, from what you
could use fly rail systems, high

1196
01:09:29,080 --> 01:09:30,800
ceilings, all that sort of
thing.

1197
01:09:31,000 --> 01:09:34,760
It really did make a difference.
Yeah, you know one of the clubs,

1198
01:09:36,040 --> 01:09:39,479
one of the things you were able
to another one of your sort of

1199
01:09:39,640 --> 01:09:42,640
what you would call a lucky
moment or whatever, I think

1200
01:09:42,640 --> 01:09:47,399
probably for 10 years or maybe
more before before it I think

1201
01:09:47,399 --> 01:09:50,080
kind of ended with COVID.
But you got into a pretty good

1202
01:09:50,080 --> 01:09:52,240
run with working with
manufacturers.

1203
01:09:52,240 --> 01:09:55,640
You got into a couple of
different manufacturers where

1204
01:09:55,640 --> 01:09:57,720
you were in pretty good
positions where you were either

1205
01:09:57,720 --> 01:10:00,200
a consultant or a Rep or
whatever it was called.

1206
01:10:00,200 --> 01:10:04,240
But that I enjoyed that, did you
I?

1207
01:10:04,240 --> 01:10:05,600
Enjoyed that very much.
I did.

1208
01:10:05,600 --> 01:10:07,480
I enjoyed that very much.
In fact.

1209
01:10:08,400 --> 01:10:13,800
COVID and Trans kind of put the
halt on our lives and in my

1210
01:10:13,800 --> 01:10:17,320
personal moment in time, I was
in the middle of making a

1211
01:10:17,320 --> 01:10:22,760
transition from being primarily
and solely working with Acclaim

1212
01:10:22,760 --> 01:10:25,560
product.
I had just learned Matthias's

1213
01:10:25,560 --> 01:10:27,520
new control system over
italation.

1214
01:10:27,520 --> 01:10:30,840
I had just been trained on it.
I came to New York for the

1215
01:10:31,200 --> 01:10:35,200
opening of the Brooklyn Museum
Studio 54 Night Magic exhibit

1216
01:10:35,200 --> 01:10:39,520
that actually I had some of my
artifacts in the museum exhibit

1217
01:10:40,200 --> 01:10:43,800
and when I was in New York,
COVID hit and I ran to Florida

1218
01:10:43,800 --> 01:10:47,720
and that was the end of that.
On the 13th of March I flew from

1219
01:10:47,720 --> 01:10:51,640
New York to Florida and the
world shut down and and and you

1220
01:10:51,640 --> 01:10:58,240
know that ended any possible
forward motion and and you know

1221
01:10:58,240 --> 01:11:00,440
I say we all pivoted during the
pandemic.

1222
01:11:00,440 --> 01:11:04,280
I think I made a circle because
my pivot was to go back to my

1223
01:11:04,280 --> 01:11:08,320
musical roots, to pick up all of
these legacy projects that were

1224
01:11:08,320 --> 01:11:10,920
in music that had been lying
dormant, that I have been

1225
01:11:10,920 --> 01:11:16,040
otherwise too busy working full
time for a claim or for whatever

1226
01:11:16,040 --> 01:11:18,760
design or this, that or the
other thing, you know.

1227
01:11:18,760 --> 01:11:24,600
And now I had the time and the
interest to do something with it

1228
01:11:24,600 --> 01:11:26,240
instead of just letting it sit
there.

1229
01:11:26,640 --> 01:11:30,360
And it's turned into a real
passion project.

1230
01:11:30,360 --> 01:11:36,080
Marcel, I can't tell you the
enthusiasm and the joy that I

1231
01:11:36,080 --> 01:11:39,880
get from reconstructing these
old musical files, from putting

1232
01:11:39,880 --> 01:11:44,120
them out, from presenting them,
the feedback I've gotten from

1233
01:11:44,120 --> 01:11:47,800
the Roy Thode website, which is
all music, to the heartbeat of

1234
01:11:47,800 --> 01:11:51,640
the dance floor, which relives
the stories with people that are

1235
01:11:51,640 --> 01:11:56,560
still here to tell them.
And I constantly.

1236
01:11:58,560 --> 01:12:06,320
I constantly shed a tear over
the dear friend who didn't want

1237
01:12:06,320 --> 01:12:08,880
to do an interview and now it's
too late, or we couldn't

1238
01:12:08,880 --> 01:12:12,520
schedule it because of XYZ.
And now it's too late.

1239
01:12:12,520 --> 01:12:16,200
And I hate the it's too late.
So we've had too many, It's too

1240
01:12:16,200 --> 01:12:17,840
late.
And I think that also.

1241
01:12:18,680 --> 01:12:20,960
Yeah.
And I think that also spurns us.

1242
01:12:20,960 --> 01:12:23,920
I mean I can only so you and I
have been friends a very long

1243
01:12:23,920 --> 01:12:28,240
time and surely we have a lot of
commonalities that has let that

1244
01:12:28,240 --> 01:12:31,360
friendship endure.
And and I think we're both

1245
01:12:31,360 --> 01:12:36,160
inspired by spreading joy and by
we.

1246
01:12:36,160 --> 01:12:39,960
Like a good time, Marsha.
Yeah, we like to have a good

1247
01:12:39,960 --> 01:12:41,680
time.
We've had some fun.

1248
01:12:43,200 --> 01:12:47,680
I remember a few fun nights.
Oh, maybe more than a few fun

1249
01:12:47,680 --> 01:12:51,520
nights.
More than a few, I know.

1250
01:12:51,520 --> 01:12:55,880
God, I think I I think back to
golf course days and going out

1251
01:12:55,880 --> 01:12:58,000
on the boat when I for when we
first met.

1252
01:12:58,040 --> 01:13:00,840
Way back.
I remember when my dad drove me

1253
01:13:00,840 --> 01:13:02,360
to your house so that we could
go out.

1254
01:13:02,400 --> 01:13:09,560
Oh my God, yeah, that was funny.
So I forget what I was just

1255
01:13:09,560 --> 01:13:12,200
going to say.
I don't even remember what I was

1256
01:13:12,200 --> 01:13:13,880
just going to say.
That's crazy, because you got me

1257
01:13:13,880 --> 01:13:18,200
on the boat thing, by the way.
Now that everyone from New York

1258
01:13:18,200 --> 01:13:21,040
is selling their expensive
apartments and driving up the

1259
01:13:21,040 --> 01:13:24,880
price of houses in Miami and
South Florida, when are you

1260
01:13:24,880 --> 01:13:27,800
going to sell your house for a
gazillion dollars and move back

1261
01:13:27,800 --> 01:13:29,520
to New York and buy a cheap
condo?

1262
01:13:30,360 --> 01:13:33,120
I got news for you.
If the price of housing in New

1263
01:13:33,120 --> 01:13:36,720
York City went down, I would
wholly consider it.

1264
01:13:37,560 --> 01:13:42,040
You know, like you, I have a
wonderful, wonderful respite in

1265
01:13:42,040 --> 01:13:45,320
the mountains.
That is but my heart's desire,

1266
01:13:45,320 --> 01:13:49,400
but not the most practical pace
in the world to roam your life

1267
01:13:49,400 --> 01:13:53,480
around.
However, anybody out there

1268
01:13:53,480 --> 01:13:56,520
listening a nice pet of terror
in New York City is right up my

1269
01:13:56,520 --> 01:13:58,040
alley.
And real estate values are

1270
01:13:58,040 --> 01:14:00,520
really good in Florida now.
Yeah, they are.

1271
01:14:00,520 --> 01:14:02,360
It's crazy.
I mean, unless you're buying,

1272
01:14:02,360 --> 01:14:04,960
you know, it's like where we
live now, we live in a pretty

1273
01:14:04,960 --> 01:14:06,800
small house.
And I've been looking at this

1274
01:14:06,800 --> 01:14:11,680
place right next door, not right
next door to our house, but an

1275
01:14:11,680 --> 01:14:14,440
area very close to where we're
at here in Wellington.

1276
01:14:14,880 --> 01:14:18,920
And you know, a few years ago
when I was starting to think

1277
01:14:18,920 --> 01:14:21,840
about it, it was a reasonable
price.

1278
01:14:21,840 --> 01:14:25,160
You know, I won't get into the
prices, but now it's literally

1279
01:14:25,160 --> 01:14:29,000
four times as much, literally
four times as much money.

1280
01:14:29,680 --> 01:14:37,520
I have seen the prices of homes
on my block go from the benign

1281
01:14:38,200 --> 01:14:42,400
to the oh, I can't believe it,
to the absolutely,

1282
01:14:42,400 --> 01:14:45,040
astronomically ridiculous over
the past.

1283
01:14:45,280 --> 01:14:48,280
It's not.
It it really is crazy.

1284
01:14:48,280 --> 01:14:50,680
And if you had told me that this
neighborhood was going to have

1285
01:14:50,680 --> 01:14:54,280
homes that were valuing where
they are now, where they're

1286
01:14:54,360 --> 01:14:57,000
jumping at now, I would have
said you're nuts.

1287
01:14:57,640 --> 01:15:01,480
But then again, there's only a
gazillion people coming to South

1288
01:15:01,480 --> 01:15:03,600
Florida.
Housing is at a premium, and if

1289
01:15:03,600 --> 01:15:06,600
you were fortunate enough to
have a nice single family home

1290
01:15:07,120 --> 01:15:09,640
in a good neighborhood, it's
going to be worth a chunk of

1291
01:15:09,640 --> 01:15:12,480
change.
Yeah, no, it's it's gone nuts.

1292
01:15:13,120 --> 01:15:16,280
It really has gone nuts.
So what are, what are you doing?

1293
01:15:16,280 --> 01:15:19,160
You keep talking about this
music thing that I'm doing now,

1294
01:15:19,160 --> 01:15:22,560
and so tell me specifically.
Like, you know, I know you're

1295
01:15:22,560 --> 01:15:26,400
doing a lot of historical stuff
and blah blah blah, but what is

1296
01:15:26,400 --> 01:15:27,920
it really that you're focused
on?

1297
01:15:28,600 --> 01:15:33,760
Well, I have a website,
roytho.com, and Roy Thode is the

1298
01:15:33,760 --> 01:15:37,920
DJ who I inherited much of his
archives and things.

1299
01:15:38,360 --> 01:15:42,120
And when you put together his
historical archives, like for

1300
01:15:42,120 --> 01:15:45,760
example, the gold record that
you see behind me that was given

1301
01:15:45,760 --> 01:15:49,120
to him, it's for Sylvester's
album.

1302
01:15:49,800 --> 01:15:54,320
OK.
There's an award there that was

1303
01:15:54,400 --> 01:15:56,640
the ice, but given the Ice
Palace, the owner of the Ice

1304
01:15:56,640 --> 01:15:58,920
Palace, you know there's an
award for me.

1305
01:15:58,920 --> 01:16:04,280
But my history has brought me
into this historical moment.

1306
01:16:04,280 --> 01:16:06,320
It got me involved with the
Brooklyn Museum.

1307
01:16:06,320 --> 01:16:09,960
It got me involved with the
Studio 54 movie and that is

1308
01:16:09,960 --> 01:16:13,760
based more, especially the 54
stuff that revisits my own

1309
01:16:13,760 --> 01:16:17,320
musical world as a producer and
as a musician.

1310
01:16:17,680 --> 01:16:21,040
And what I'm doing is taking
these old analog tapes that are

1311
01:16:21,040 --> 01:16:26,200
digitized and present RE and
presenting them through Roy's

1312
01:16:26,200 --> 01:16:28,520
website.
So that's a lot of technical

1313
01:16:28,520 --> 01:16:32,080
prowess in editing.
That is a whole new skill set

1314
01:16:32,080 --> 01:16:34,640
that I'm learning and really
enjoying the heck out of.

1315
01:16:34,960 --> 01:16:37,800
You know, For me editing was a
tape and a razor blade and an

1316
01:16:37,800 --> 01:16:39,880
editing block.
Back in the day, it's totally

1317
01:16:39,920 --> 01:16:41,440
true.
It's all different now.

1318
01:16:41,480 --> 01:16:44,320
It's cut and paste.
Yeah.

1319
01:16:44,320 --> 01:16:47,920
And it's and it's mixing and
it's recording and it's working

1320
01:16:47,920 --> 01:16:52,120
in digital recording which is
really interesting, I mean so,

1321
01:16:52,120 --> 01:16:54,560
so that's a bit of a learning
curve in that which kind of

1322
01:16:54,560 --> 01:16:57,760
keeps me out of trouble.
But then the idea with this Roy

1323
01:16:57,760 --> 01:17:03,760
Foed website is is to sell music
or to just give access to music

1324
01:17:03,880 --> 01:17:05,840
or at.
This juncture it is to give

1325
01:17:05,840 --> 01:17:09,360
access.
Selling music, you get into the

1326
01:17:09,360 --> 01:17:11,920
legalities and the copyright
issues, right?

1327
01:17:12,120 --> 01:17:16,720
However, what I'm doing is
reviving his artistry and

1328
01:17:16,720 --> 01:17:22,120
presenting it.
Democratizing access to his.

1329
01:17:22,200 --> 01:17:28,440
That and and he as a dead person
who's been dead 42 years.

1330
01:17:28,760 --> 01:17:31,400
Oh, wow.
Had he died in 1980?

1331
01:17:31,440 --> 01:17:32,840
Died.
Died in 1982?

1332
01:17:32,840 --> 01:17:34,280
I've had all this stuff since
82.

1333
01:17:34,280 --> 01:17:35,480
It's just.
Oh my goodness.

1334
01:17:35,800 --> 01:17:38,440
You look, I haven't had this
stuff for 20 years before you

1335
01:17:38,440 --> 01:17:40,120
had the technology to digitize
it.

1336
01:17:40,240 --> 01:17:45,600
Yeah, that's wild.
Think about it and and for some

1337
01:17:45,600 --> 01:17:49,120
reason I have this.
And if I can spread the joy by

1338
01:17:49,120 --> 01:17:52,600
taking the music and putting it
out there, it's through his

1339
01:17:52,600 --> 01:17:55,840
website that I publicize it
through the front page on the

1340
01:17:55,840 --> 01:18:00,600
website ofroytho.com, you can
access all of the platforms, the

1341
01:18:00,600 --> 01:18:04,400
Mixcloud, the SoundCloud.
We just did a release in tandem

1342
01:18:04,400 --> 01:18:07,360
with sound Metaphors on their
SoundCloud platform.

1343
01:18:07,680 --> 01:18:10,280
He's got a Facebook page.
He's got an Instagram account.

1344
01:18:10,280 --> 01:18:12,160
He's got more social.
And there's an audience for

1345
01:18:12,240 --> 01:18:15,680
this.
Yes, there's a very big audience

1346
01:18:16,840 --> 01:18:21,400
and and it's not just new and I
do get a lot of new followers

1347
01:18:21,400 --> 01:18:24,360
and new audience, but it's a lot
of other people who were there

1348
01:18:24,600 --> 01:18:28,240
and some of the comments that
come back really do touch me and

1349
01:18:28,240 --> 01:18:31,480
it gives me inspiration because
I'm bringing joy to these

1350
01:18:31,480 --> 01:18:34,600
people.
Some have never heard it before.

1351
01:18:35,160 --> 01:18:37,800
This guy I'm working with in
Germany who has this record

1352
01:18:37,800 --> 01:18:41,560
store sound metaphors, and he, I
don't even think he was alive

1353
01:18:41,560 --> 01:18:45,760
when Roy died.
But he's so interested.

1354
01:18:45,760 --> 01:18:51,120
There's a lot of of music that
Roy did that back in the 70s.

1355
01:18:51,120 --> 01:18:54,240
He was in trouble with.
He was very, very important and

1356
01:18:54,240 --> 01:18:56,240
he died and no one remembers
him.

1357
01:18:56,240 --> 01:19:00,360
And I guess that's maybe my job,
to make sure that what he did

1358
01:19:00,360 --> 01:19:06,680
doesn't go unappreciated because
it was so damn good and it holds

1359
01:19:06,960 --> 01:19:11,280
its own in today's world. 40
years later, it stands alone.

1360
01:19:11,920 --> 01:19:16,120
Look, SiriusXM had me do a 10
hour New Year's Eve broadcast

1361
01:19:16,120 --> 01:19:20,200
this year, welcoming in the new
year on their Studio 54 radio

1362
01:19:20,200 --> 01:19:21,560
station.
I don't.

1363
01:19:21,880 --> 01:19:26,080
I don't think I would have had
the opportunity to do all of

1364
01:19:26,080 --> 01:19:30,600
this stuff if not for the work
with Roy combined with my own

1365
01:19:30,600 --> 01:19:35,560
musical background gives me the
ability to do this and not to

1366
01:19:35,560 --> 01:19:37,440
take away from my lighting
career.

1367
01:19:37,880 --> 01:19:42,480
And I did recently design a
streaming TV studio in New York

1368
01:19:42,480 --> 01:19:44,720
for a friend of mine.
It just hasn't quite come to

1369
01:19:44,720 --> 01:19:46,800
fruition yet.
As you well know, we're waiting

1370
01:19:46,800 --> 01:19:51,320
for the funding, but but you
know, it just seems that

1371
01:19:51,320 --> 01:19:55,000
following my nose has taken me
back to my music and I'm

1372
01:19:55,000 --> 01:19:56,160
enjoying it.
So that's.

1373
01:19:56,160 --> 01:20:01,040
Wow, that's so fun though, huh?
Yeah, yeah, maybe That's what my

1374
01:20:01,040 --> 01:20:01,880
purpose is.
May.

1375
01:20:01,920 --> 01:20:04,200
You know, you get to this ripe
old age.

1376
01:20:04,200 --> 01:20:05,960
You like to know that you have a
purpose.

1377
01:20:06,200 --> 01:20:09,040
That's appreciated.
And maybe this is?

1378
01:20:09,600 --> 01:20:11,520
You know the beginning of
fulfilling that?

1379
01:20:11,880 --> 01:20:14,560
You know, and the The thing is,
I mean, as much as it's nice to

1380
01:20:14,560 --> 01:20:19,720
get a a big fat paycheck or
whatever, sometimes it's so much

1381
01:20:19,720 --> 01:20:23,120
better to be like following a
passion and following something

1382
01:20:23,120 --> 01:20:27,720
that gives you joy and and like
you said, a purpose, you know,

1383
01:20:27,800 --> 01:20:31,400
that to me is so much more fun
than running around as a sales

1384
01:20:31,400 --> 01:20:33,880
Rep for a lighting company or
something.

1385
01:20:33,880 --> 01:20:36,600
And again, as as much as it's
nice to get a fat paycheck from

1386
01:20:36,600 --> 01:20:43,000
somebody for doing something,
that's rather easy, you know, I

1387
01:20:43,000 --> 01:20:47,960
I love that stuff.
At at at some point, I have

1388
01:20:47,960 --> 01:20:53,320
every intention of selling much
of the memorabilia that I have.

1389
01:20:53,360 --> 01:20:56,080
How that's going to happen, I'm
not sure.

1390
01:20:56,080 --> 01:21:01,920
I also believe that I've got
enough that already has

1391
01:21:01,920 --> 01:21:04,720
qualified for an actual
historical museum exhibit.

1392
01:21:04,720 --> 01:21:07,520
And I would like to see a lot of
that combined with a lot of

1393
01:21:07,520 --> 01:21:11,120
other things that I've accrued
or other friends of mine have

1394
01:21:11,120 --> 01:21:14,280
and have accrued from that era
and put it into a proper

1395
01:21:14,280 --> 01:21:17,240
collection because that should
be recognized.

1396
01:21:17,240 --> 01:21:21,400
I mean, my personal beef with
the world of today is that the

1397
01:21:21,400 --> 01:21:25,400
music did not stop with our acid
rock of the 60s and all of a

1398
01:21:25,400 --> 01:21:27,800
sudden jump into rap and hip
hop.

1399
01:21:27,800 --> 01:21:33,080
You had an entire era of Motown,
Detroit, Memphis, rhythm and

1400
01:21:33,080 --> 01:21:36,880
Blues dance music, the kind of
stuff that Roberta Flack

1401
01:21:36,880 --> 01:21:41,520
described in this way.
You be in the basement and

1402
01:21:41,520 --> 01:21:44,520
someone to put a 45 on the
record player.

1403
01:21:44,760 --> 01:21:49,760
You throw a towel over the light
and you dance on a space no

1404
01:21:49,760 --> 01:21:52,880
bigger than a dime.
That's cool.

1405
01:21:53,040 --> 01:21:55,160
I like that.
That was really cool.

1406
01:21:56,120 --> 01:21:57,000
Marsha.
You know what?

1407
01:21:57,000 --> 01:21:58,960
We could we could talk for three
more hours.

1408
01:21:58,960 --> 01:22:00,320
We're gonna have to do another
one.

1409
01:22:00,880 --> 01:22:02,920
Unfortunately, I have to go
today.

1410
01:22:02,920 --> 01:22:05,960
But I appreciate you getting
this going.

1411
01:22:06,600 --> 01:22:07,160
Another one.
I know.

1412
01:22:07,160 --> 01:22:10,440
So would I.
Tell silly stuff, fun stuff.

1413
01:22:10,480 --> 01:22:11,440
I'd love to do it.
We'll.

1414
01:22:11,520 --> 01:22:13,560
We'll definitely do it.
Always a delight.

1415
01:22:13,800 --> 01:22:17,000
We'll definitely do it again.
No, I I love talking with you.

1416
01:22:17,000 --> 01:22:22,160
I love listening to you and you
know, I feel like we've just

1417
01:22:22,160 --> 01:22:24,440
gotten started.
But unfortunately today is one

1418
01:22:24,440 --> 01:22:28,600
of those days where I have time
limits and I've got places that

1419
01:22:28,600 --> 01:22:31,840
I've got to be.
So thank you so much for doing

1420
01:22:31,840 --> 01:22:34,880
it.
And Sarah probably already told

1421
01:22:34,880 --> 01:22:38,200
you it'll air next week, but
we'll send you the links and

1422
01:22:38,200 --> 01:22:40,920
stuff and.
Yeah, sounds good.

1423
01:22:40,960 --> 01:22:43,640
And I thank you.
And I'm very proud to now be

1424
01:22:43,640 --> 01:22:46,120
officially an old geezer of
gear.

1425
01:22:46,520 --> 01:22:50,840
You are a geezer.
Easy for.

1426
01:22:50,880 --> 01:22:53,720
You I look forward to Part 2,
Marcel, and thank you again for

1427
01:22:53,760 --> 01:22:55,800
having me as a guest.
This has been a lot of fun.

1428
01:22:56,000 --> 01:22:57,760
All right, Marcia.
Take care

1429
01:23:12,120 --> 01:23:12,200
the.